Recommend
4 
 Thumb up
 Hide
21 Posts

Crusaders: Thy Will Be Done» Forums » General

Subject: Future printings suggestions rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Jared Reeves
United States
North Carolina
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I'll start this thread to keep track of people's suggestions for changes to be made for future printings of the game. Including errata or missing rules explanations, and even suggestions for improving the game itself!

I'll start with a couple:
1) On the reverse side of the Knight Order tiles, include the flavor text of their history that's already in the rulebook. Having it there would be fun to read when it's not your turn.
2) Explain in the rules what the reference tile is for. I didn't see anything about it.
3) Add a sentence about the black knight token, to indicate it's used and played as another of that player's color's knights.

GREAT game! I'm loving it so far!
5 
 Thumb up
0.02
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steve Kosior
United States
Watervliet/Latham
New York
flag msg tools
Add a few 25 point influence tokens to be used only once end game is triggered to make lower denomination influence tokens available for players completing their final turn.
7 
 Thumb up
0.02
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Broggi
United States
Southwick
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I disagree with #1. It would make it harder to randomize them.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Dave Moser
United States
Escondido
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
If I had playtested it before final printing, I would've made a couple of suggestions:

1) Flip the iconography below the building storage spots on the player boards. For most people, it makes more sense to see the "cost" (action points) of the building, and then the "reward" (Influence points gained), rather than the other way around.

2) In some cases, like the building bonus tiles, Influence is indicated by the diamond shaped icon. On the Building spots and Muster tiles, the influence gained is shown on a banner. Why the inconsistency? It would be more intuitive to use the same icon for influence everywhere.

7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jared Reeves
United States
North Carolina
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
You can still randomize them with either of the 2 included opaque bags. It's not an issue.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Becq
United States
Cerritos
California
flag msg tools
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
yrnotyrkhakis wrote:
You can still randomize them with either of the 2 included opaque bags. It's not an issue.

Those cards look a bit thick to be randomized via bag...
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Francois LC
Canada
St-Bruno-de-Montarville (Near Montreal)
Quebec
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
dmoser22 wrote:
If I had playtested it before final printing, I would've made a couple of suggestions:

1) Flip the iconography below the building storage spots on the player boards. For most people, it makes more sense to see the "cost" (action points) of the building, and then the "reward" (Influence points gained), rather than the other way around.

2) In some cases, like the building bonus tiles, Influence is indicated by the diamond shaped icon. On the Building spots and Muster tiles, the influence gained is shown on a banner. Why the inconsistency? It would be more intuitive to use the same icon for influence everywhere.



I agree. I would have also done these. And if I could have proofread the rule book, there are at least 4-5 errors that I would have corrected that I saw on my first read.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Seth Jaffee
United States
Tucson
Arizona
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Cerberus777 wrote:
dmoser22 wrote:
If I had playtested it before final printing, I would've made a couple of suggestions:

1) Flip the iconography below the building storage spots on the player boards. For most people, it makes more sense to see the "cost" (action points) of the building, and then the "reward" (Influence points gained), rather than the other way around.

2) In some cases, like the building bonus tiles, Influence is indicated by the diamond shaped icon. On the Building spots and Muster tiles, the influence gained is shown on a banner. Why the inconsistency? It would be more intuitive to use the same icon for influence everywhere.



I agree. I would have also done these. And if I could have proofread the rule book, there are at least 4-5 errors that I would have corrected that I saw on my first read.

If you geek mail them to me, then I'll make a note for any future reprint.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Patrick Schuette
United States
Illinois
flag msg tools
mb
BBHouseRodent wrote:
Add a few 25 point influence tokens to be used only once end game is triggered to make lower denomination influence tokens available for players completing their final turn.


+1

LOVED this game, but the lack of denominations over 10 made end game scoring a bit more fiddly than it had to be.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Charles Washington
United States
Houston
Texas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I would just explicitly clarify in the rulebook that for build and muster actions you can only build/muster 1 building/troop. Switching from plural to singular in your wording of the rules just invited rules lawyers to question the interpretation during our first game.

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Dave Moser
United States
Escondido
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
croloris wrote:
I would just explicitly clarify in the rulebook that for build and muster actions you can only build/muster 1 building/troop. Switching from plural to singular in your wording of the rules just invited rules lawyers to question the interpretation during our first game.


This is a great point; it has come up in our games as well. And it goes for the Crusade action also. I.e., you can only Crusade against one enemy token in a turn, regardless of the number of Action tokens and Crusade icons you use.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Becq
United States
Cerritos
California
flag msg tools
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
My biggest request would be to add in overflow influence in some form. A 50-influence token/coin per player would be more than enough. Alternatively an extra 6-8 10-influence tokens/coins would likely be enough and wouldn't require any new component art/molds. (The goal would be to ensure that players could count their entire score using influence tokens/coins.)

I agree regarding clarifying muster (and similarly, build -- crusade does not need clarification) and regarding adding a comment regarding the black knight in the components section (and make it clear that the black knight counts for scoring the Tier 4 Farm).

And lastly, the text "you must assign at least 1 token to that action" should be moved from where it currently is in "step 2" of page 4 to just above step 1: "In all cases, you must assign at least 1 token to each action to perform that action; you may not perform an action relying on bonuses alone." As it is, it looks as though the rule applies only to upgraded wedges.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Dave Moser
United States
Escondido
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Becq wrote:
My biggest request would be to add in overflow influence in some form. A 50-influence token/coin per player would be more than enough. Alternatively an extra 6-8 10-influence tokens/coins would likely be enough and wouldn't require any new component art/molds. (The goal would be to ensure that players could count their entire score using influence tokens/coins.)

Not sure who originated the idea, but Seth passed this on on the Kickstarter page. As soon as the last token is taken, the starting player puts 50 Influence into the bank. At final scoring, count the Sword as 50 pts.


Seems like a good plan to me. (If the 1st player doesn't have 50, then have another player buy the sword for 50 first. This doesn't change player order, and the game still ends after the original last player's turn.)

4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Seth Jaffee
United States
Tucson
Arizona
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Becq wrote:
My biggest request would be to add in overflow influence in some form. A 50-influence token/coin per player would be more than enough. Alternatively an extra 6-8 10-influence tokens/coins would likely be enough and wouldn't require any new component art/molds. (The goal would be to ensure that players could count their entire score using influence tokens/coins.)

Yeah, in retrospect I wish I had done that differently. I'm working on a solution.

Quote:
I agree regarding clarifying muster (and similarly, build -- crusade does not need clarification)

If Muster and Build require clarification, why wouldn't Crusade?

I personally thought the wording was clear, but it's worth being even more clear I guess, because "cheating" kind of breaks the mechanism.

Quote:
And lastly, the text "you must assign at least 1 token to that action" should be moved from where it currently is in "step 2" of page 4 to just above step 1: "In all cases, you must assign at least 1 token to each action to perform that action; you may not perform an action relying on bonuses alone." As it is, it looks as though the rule applies only to upgraded wedges.

I agree here as well, this should be clearer.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Becq
United States
Cerritos
California
flag msg tools
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
dmoser22 wrote:
Becq wrote:
My biggest request would be to add in overflow influence in some form. A 50-influence token/coin per player would be more than enough. Alternatively an extra 6-8 10-influence tokens/coins would likely be enough and wouldn't require any new component art/molds. (The goal would be to ensure that players could count their entire score using influence tokens/coins.)

Not sure who originated the idea, but Seth passed this on on the Kickstarter page. As soon as the last token is taken, the starting player puts 50 Influence into the bank. At final scoring, count the Sword as 50 pts.

Seems like a good plan to me. (If the 1st player doesn't have 50, then have another player buy the sword for 50 first. This doesn't change player order, and the game still ends after the original last player's turn.)

Yup, tried that, and it wasn't enough. (By the end of the game, it's not terribly uncommon for players to be taking 8-10 point actions, so if the first player triggers the end game, you could need upwards of 20 influence just to cover the last round worth of actions. Then another ~20 to hand out influence for the enemy bonus tiles (shared bonuses don't allow for handing out the tiles themselves), and a varying amount to account for building bonuses (which *could* be upwards of 30 influence per player, but is more likely to be around 4-8 per player).

We've taken to using the building bonus tiles as 5-influence tokens for overflow (we remove them from the board when their spaces are built on). It *works*, but it's not a very elegant solution.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Becq
United States
Cerritos
California
flag msg tools
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
sedjtroll wrote:
Yeah, in retrospect I wish I had done that differently. I'm working on a solution.

Much appreciated! I love the game, as have everyone I've taught it too, but that one nitpick always rears it's head at the end of each game. (Well, the 4-player ones, at least.)

Quote:
Quote:
I agree regarding clarifying muster (and similarly, build -- crusade does not need clarification)

If Muster and Build require clarification, why wouldn't Crusade?

The rules for Crusade state "Choose 1 region containing one of your knight figures and an enemy token." That seems clear enough to me, though YMMV.

The brute force solution to this would be to add something like this to the into paragraph for each action:
Quote:
You may only flip a single troops token -- the lowest-level one -- each time you use the Muster action.
You may only build a single building -- the lowest-level one of the type chosen -- each time you use the Build action.
You may only battle against a single enemy token each time you use the Crusade action.


 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Seth Jaffee
United States
Tucson
Arizona
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Becq wrote:
sedjtroll wrote:
Yeah, in retrospect I wish I had done that differently. I'm working on a solution.

Much appreciated! I love the game, as have everyone I've taught it too, but that one nitpick always rears it's head at the end of each game. (Well, the 4-player ones, at least.)

I'm glad you're enjoying it!

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I agree regarding clarifying muster (and similarly, build -- crusade does not need clarification)

If Muster and Build require clarification, why wouldn't Crusade?

The rules for Crusade state "Choose 1 region containing one of your knight figures and an enemy token." That seems clear enough to me, though YMMV.

I don't see that as different from "Check the cost of the lowest-level face down troop token above your player board." or "Choose a type of building: castle, church, farm, or bank, and check the cost of the lowest-level building of that type on your player board."

but it's clear that people do have this question all the time, so it's definitely worth doing something to draw attention to it!

Quote:
The brute force solution to this would be to add something like this to the into paragraph for each action:
[q]You may only flip a single troops token -- the lowest-level one -- each time you use the Muster action.
You may only build a single building -- the lowest-level one of the type chosen -- each time you use the Build action.
You may only battle against a single enemy token each time you use the Crusade action.

Yeah, maybe something like that.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Seth Jaffee
United States
Tucson
Arizona
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Becq wrote:
dmoser22 wrote:
Becq wrote:
My biggest request would be to add in overflow influence in some form. A 50-influence token/coin per player would be more than enough. Alternatively an extra 6-8 10-influence tokens/coins would likely be enough and wouldn't require any new component art/molds. (The goal would be to ensure that players could count their entire score using influence tokens/coins.)

Not sure who originated the idea, but Seth passed this on on the Kickstarter page. As soon as the last token is taken, the starting player puts 50 Influence into the bank. At final scoring, count the Sword as 50 pts.

Seems like a good plan to me. (If the 1st player doesn't have 50, then have another player buy the sword for 50 first. This doesn't change player order, and the game still ends after the original last player's turn.)

Yup, tried that, and it wasn't enough. (By the end of the game, it's not terribly uncommon for players to be taking 8-10 point actions, so if the first player triggers the end game, you could need upwards of 20 influence just to cover the last round worth of actions. Then another ~20 to hand out influence for the enemy bonus tiles (shared bonuses don't allow for handing out the tiles themselves), and a varying amount to account for building bonuses (which *could* be upwards of 30 influence per player, but is more likely to be around 4-8 per player).

We've taken to using the building bonus tiles as 5-influence tokens for overflow (we remove them from the board when their spaces are built on). It *works*, but it's not a very elegant solution.

I never expected players to have enough tokens to account for their game end bonuses. I expected players to add those bonuses to their token counts.

I should acknowledge that there are people in the world who want to dole out VP tokens for end game bonuses like that, and then simply count the tokens, but I just am not one of those people!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ben Vaterlaus
United States
Sahuarita
Arizona
flag msg tools
badge
"JoJo left his home in Tucson, Arizona"
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
sedjtroll wrote:
I should acknowledge that there are people in the world who want to dole out VP tokens for end game bonuses like that, and then simply count the tokens, but I just am not one of those people!


Ah how our internal systems and patterns come out when others are reading what to do instead of modeling what you do. Human nature. It could be that a scorepad could solve that instead, with verbiage like you said. Something to the effect that you total the coins collected during the game, add the score tile totals and any other bonuses to reach your final score.

I didn't acknowledge the opposite of your reaction when we played (which was more akin to the others in this thread), which was that people just started grabbing tokens to "count" the total. All in all, a great game that I want to try and get to the table again over the weekend!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Becq
United States
Cerritos
California
flag msg tools
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
bivaterl wrote:
sedjtroll wrote:
I should acknowledge that there are people in the world who want to dole out VP tokens for end game bonuses like that, and then simply count the tokens, but I just am not one of those people!


Ah how our internal systems and patterns come out when others are reading what to do instead of modeling what you do. Human nature. It could be that a scorepad could solve that instead, with verbiage like you said. Something to the effect that you total the coins collected during the game, add the score tile totals and any other bonuses to reach your final score.

I didn't acknowledge the opposite of your reaction when we played (which was more akin to the others in this thread), which was that people just started grabbing tokens to "count" the total. All in all, a great game that I want to try and get to the table again over the weekend!

A scorepad would (at least to my mind) make it less important to have *as much* overflow, but it still seems as though there should be enough influence to hand out the influence earned through the end of the game -- which is virtually guaranteed to be more than the threshold established by player count. (The scenario where the last player takes exactly enough to deplete the supply, thus ending the game, seems pretty unlikely!) A scorepad would eliminate my perceived need for influence to cover end-game bonuses, though.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Dave Moser
United States
Escondido
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Becq wrote:
dmoser22 wrote:
As soon as the last token is taken, the starting player puts 50 Influence into the bank. At final scoring, count the Sword as 50 pts.

Yup, tried that, and it wasn't enough. (By the end of the game, it's not terribly uncommon for players to be taking 8-10 point actions, so if the first player triggers the end game, you could need upwards of 20 influence just to cover the last round worth of actions.

Prior to trying the 50-pt sword idea, we were just having everyone throw 20 pts back into the back. That's plenty to cover last round points. Then after all scoring is done, everyone just adds 20 back to their total score.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.