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Subject: Finally beat Battle in the Mistlands! rss

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Garrett
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Finally beat Battle in the Mistlands! My wife and I played a 2-player game. I was Kari Wraithstalker and specialized in the Wildlander prestige class. My wife played Syndrael and specialized in the Berserker prestige class.

Going into the last round, we knew we were going to die soon. Ankaur Maro had only 1 wounds on him. Syndrael was the party leader, so she started with an attack and chose to eliminate the master Wraith engaged with her. Then Kari Wraithstalker aided Syndrael, adding 4 success tokens. She also used her ability to put a wound on Maro. Syndrael readied her attack and used it again, targeting Ankaur Maro. With the bonus from the red peril track place and the three success tokens, Ankaur was brought to 10 wounds. Kari used her ability to put 1 wound on Maro and then attacked with Skirmish. She did just enough damage to defeat Ankaur Maro before dying during the enemy phase.

I usually choose the Thief specialization, but decided to try out the Wildlander. I wasn't disappointed, but I don't think I've used either class optimally. I need to get in more games!
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Tomas Hejna
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I hate this scenario. We play with 'easy mode' already (i.e. using success tokens after roll instead before) and with three unsuccessful attempts (app. lenght 2+3+4 hours!) I do not think this scenario has been marked as trivial correctly.

I do not know whether its difficulty changes with number of heroes, but with only two at once it seems awful. It drags forever, and both the randomized locations AND enemies seriously affects its mechanics by their composition.

For example, a lot of undead means a lot of healing on skulls. Or Changeling presence translates to respawning the undead from the discard pile via mimicked Nemesis ability. Or four new/additional engaged enemies (i.e. at least one guaranteed direct damage, but very likely two or three at once) if the next location happens to be the Riverbank or Chamber of Statues.. etc.

IMO this one seems like it has been quite hastily designed and not tested in all its combinations (for a trivial difficulty).

And as I play this game with my 6y old son, I won't return to Mistlands any soon (if sometime) - as I simply do not have that amount of neccesary time and patience for it.

Anyway, congrats to your victory!

/ Actually it seems to be not that hard in the end, as I were doing critical error by spawning red number of enemies to each hero instead of only alternating between them up to the red number in total.
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Todd Hughes
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My wife and I played this scenario for the first time tonight and we got hammered! We’re looking forward to trying it again. Congratulations on the victory!
 
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Rupert Cullum
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It's next on the table for me, 3 handed solo. We'll see how I do - seems to be hard for a "trivial" rated scenario !
 
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glenn3e glenn3e
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I completed this scenario relatively easily with Krutz the Berserker and Albretch the Disciple. Krutz targets multiple enemies and dispatches them while trying to exhaust all his cards for the instant refresh for 2 health. Albretch tries to heal him up as much as possible since he will take a lot of damage. Whenever I can, I exhaust the Rest action. Also, try to put weak Trivial Undead on top of the discard pile so if they are raised they are easy for Krutz to put them down again. In the end, Krutz had something like 3-4 Wounds while Albretch ended with 15 Wounds but we were victorious.
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Tomas Hejna
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glenn3e wrote:
I completed this scenario relatively easily with Krutz the Berserker and Albretch the Disciple. Krutz targets multiple enemies and dispatches them while trying to exhaust all his cards for the instant refresh for 2 health.

What do you mean by this? Bar the Way gives you two success tokens instead of two heal and you may not use them immediately on ongoing rest action due to timing either..

We had similar party in our latest try: Krutzbeck the Berserker and Elder Mok the Disciple. We were surviving for 4 hours but the transition to last location killed us with enemies engaging and dealing the final damage (Chamber of Statues, while previous was Riverbank - both spawns four enemies to players).

In fact, even with the former (second) attempt we were never able to be truly freehanded / clean from enemies when moving to the final location..

/ Actually it seems to be not that hard in the end, as I were doing critical error by spawning red number of enemies to each hero instead of only alternating between them up to the red number in total.
 
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glenn3e glenn3e
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XehutL wrote:
glenn3e wrote:
I completed this scenario relatively easily with Krutz the Berserker and Albretch the Disciple. Krutz targets multiple enemies and dispatches them while trying to exhaust all his cards for the instant refresh for 2 health.

What do you mean by this? Bar the Way gives you two success tokens instead of two heal and you may not use them immediately on ongoing rest action due to timing either..

We had similar party in our latest try: Krutz the Berserker and Elder Mok the Disciple. We were surviving for 4 hours but the transition to last location killed us with enemies engaging and dealing the final damage (Chamber of Statues, while previous was Riverbank - both spawns four enemies to players).

In fact, even with the former (second) attempt we were never able to be truly freehanded / clean from enemies when moving to the final location..


If you have all your cards exhausted(including the Rest card), beginning of your next turn they all get unexhausted and you take 2 health damage. This is very useful to get more attacks in but you might want a healer to help you up as the damage can pile up. Normally you can't exhaust the Rest card but there are effects in the game that do it(enemies/events etc)
 
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Ryan C
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Glad I'm not the only one who found this "trivial" scenario rather difficult.

Took me 3 attempts solo, 3 handed.

The key was having enough success tokens on the location to stop the spawning from the peril effects. First 2 games I didn't explore enough and had to keep spawning due to the peril. Got completely overrun. Every time I killed 3 enemies, another 3 spawned and I just couldn't make any progress.

3rd attempt I made sure I had at least 3 success on the location at the end of each round for the peril phase. The game was much easier after that.
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Tomas Hejna
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glenn3e wrote:
XehutL wrote:
glenn3e wrote:
I completed this scenario relatively easily with Krutz the Berserker and Albretch the Disciple. Krutz targets multiple enemies and dispatches them while trying to exhaust all his cards for the instant refresh for 2 health.

What do you mean by this? Bar the Way gives you two success tokens instead of two heal and you may not use them immediately on ongoing rest action due to timing either..

We had similar party in our latest try: Krutz the Berserker and Elder Mok the Disciple. We were surviving for 4 hours but the transition to last location killed us with enemies engaging and dealing the final damage (Chamber of Statues, while previous was Riverbank - both spawns four enemies to players).

In fact, even with the former (second) attempt we were never able to be truly freehanded / clean from enemies when moving to the final location..


If you have all your cards exhausted(including the Rest card), beginning of your next turn they all get unexhausted and you take 2 health damage. This is very useful to get more attacks in but you might want a healer to help you up as the damage can pile up. Normally you can't exhaust the Rest card but there are effects in the game that do it(enemies/events etc)

OK, I undestand now.

But I do not get the reasons. To have this happen, you must forfeit at least one action via enemy/location's effect and you won't execute that effect anyway. And on the opposite, there are effects that penalize you for exhausted actions even more.

On the other hand it is true that by combining only upgraded attack and explore on Krutzbeck you can deal quite amount of damage and speed up the final transition. But I seriously doubt that damage received would be that fast to take care by even the focused Disciple.
 
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Tomas Hejna
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SuperAbobo wrote:
Glad I'm not the only one who found this "trivial" scenario rather difficult.

Took me 3 attempts solo, 3 handed.

The key was having enough success tokens on the location to stop the spawning from the peril effects. First 2 games I didn't explore enough and had to keep spawning due to the peril. Got completely overrun. Every time I killed 3 enemies, another 3 spawned and I just couldn't make any progress.

3rd attempt I made sure I had at least 3 success on the location at the end of each round for the peril phase. The game was much easier after that.

This might be the key. But it is hard to explore with almost costant 3 black dice (which are unevitable if dealing damage is not priority, especially due to healing from Nemesis that takes place before the enemies are actually removed from combat).
 
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Garrett
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SuperAbobo wrote:
Glad I'm not the only one who found this "trivial" scenario rather difficult.

Took me 3 attempts solo, 3 handed.

The key was having enough success tokens on the location to stop the spawning from the peril effects. First 2 games I didn't explore enough and had to keep spawning due to the peril. Got completely overrun. Every time I killed 3 enemies, another 3 spawned and I just couldn't make any progress.

3rd attempt I made sure I had at least 3 success on the location at the end of each round for the peril phase. The game was much easier after that.


I thought only the blue space let you discard progress tokens to prevent enemy spawns. Since you can't stay on the same space, you'll still be spawning at least every other round, right?

glenn3e wrote:
Normally you can't exhaust the Rest card but there are effects in the game that do it(enemies/events etc)


This was true in Warhammer Quest: The Adventure Card Game, but they removed that rule from Heroes of Terrinoth. There is nothing special about the rest action that ever prevents it from being exhausted.
 
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Ryan C
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Budgernaut wrote:

I thought only the blue space let you discard progress tokens to prevent enemy spawns. Since you can't stay on the same space, you'll still be spawning at least every other round, right?


Correct. I alternated between the green and blue the whole scenario, only moving to the red to get the +1 success to attack actions, which helped me take out the Nemesis quickly. I made sure I had at least 3 tokens to discard from the location each time I moved to the blue peril space to avoid spawning that round.
 
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Tomas Hejna
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@All: Btw, what were your locations and randomized enemies with the succesful run?
 
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Garrett
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XehutL wrote:
@All: Btw, what were your locations and randomized enemies with the succesful run?

Locations: Twisting Hall --> Chamber of Statues --> Brigand Camp

Enemies
1) Reanimate Warriors, Zombies, Bandits, Ogres
2) Reanimate Archers, Wraiths, Cave Spiders, Rat Swarms
3) Carrion Worms, Hybrid Sentinels, Sorcers, Goblin Archers
 
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Tomas Hejna
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Budgernaut wrote:
XehutL wrote:
@All: Btw, what were your locations and randomized enemies with the succesful run?

Locations: Twisting Hall --> Chamber of Statues --> Brigand Camp

Enemies
1) Reanimate Warriors, Zombies, Bandits, Ogres
2) Reanimate Archers, Wraiths, Cave Spiders, Rat Swarms
3) Carrion Worms, Hybrid Sentinels, Sorcers, Goblin Archers

Hmm. Brigand Camp as the last location and no Changeling seems really good. Perhaps I will try next time your distribution right away.
 
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glenn3e glenn3e
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Garrett wrote:
Normally you can't exhaust the Rest card but there are effects in the game that do it(enemies/events etc)


This was true in Warhammer Quest: The Adventure Card Game, but they removed that rule from Heroes of Terrinoth. There is nothing special about the rest action that ever prevents it from being exhausted.[/q]

What are even talking about? I'm saying that the rest card auto unexhausts itself when used. To get the autorefresh for the cost of 2 health you need other effects to get Rest to exhaust.
 
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Garrett
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glenn3e wrote:
Normally you can't exhaust the Rest card but there are effects in the game that do it(enemies/events etc)

Garrett wrote:
This was true in Warhammer Quest: The Adventure Card Game, but they removed that rule from Heroes of Terrinoth. There is nothing special about the rest action that ever prevents it from being exhausted.

What are even talking about? I'm saying that the rest card auto unexhausts itself when used. To get the autorefresh for the cost of 2 health you need other effects to get Rest to exhaust.

Sorry, I misunderstood what you were trying to say. You said that you normally can't exhaust the rest card and that statement is false because technically, you do exhaust the rest card when you choose that as your action, but it will refresh at the end of your turn. This wasn't the case in WQ:ACG. In that game, the action that refreshed your cards could never be exhausted. If that were your last card and an effect told you to exhaust an action or suffer 2 damage, it was against the rules for you to exhaust your refresh card or choose it as the card to exhaust (even though it couldn't exhaust). When you said that you normally could not exhaust the rest card, I thought you were saying that the rest card could not be exhausted by other effects just like in WQ:ACG. I see now that I misinterpreted your statement.
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Tomas Hejna
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glenn3e wrote:
I completed this scenario relatively easily with Krutz the Berserker and Albretch the Disciple. Krutz targets multiple enemies and dispatches them while trying to exhaust all his cards for the instant refresh for 2 health. Albretch tries to heal him up as much as possible since he will take a lot of damage. Whenever I can, I exhaust the Rest action. Also, try to put weak Trivial Undead on top of the discard pile so if they are raised they are easy for Krutz to put them down again. In the end, Krutz had something like 3-4 Wounds while Albretch ended with 15 Wounds but we were victorious.

Do you still remember your randomized locations and enemies?
 
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glenn3e glenn3e
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I don't remember because its was many games ago. However, I decided to play this scenario once more while introducing the game to a friend(He played Warhammer ACG though).

We picked Tumble the Scout and Lein the Mage for two players. Our locations were Chamber of Statues, Twisting Halls and Decrepit Monument. We even hit the jackpot in the first turn with spawning 4 master enemies in the first round. After taking some damage and dealing with them it was smooth sailing.

Before the final location, there is plenty of time to gather Success tokens, unexhaust cards and heal up since this particular scenario does not have time constraints. (hence the 'trivial' difficulty). All you need to do is make sure you have enough firepower to deal with the few spawning enemies per turn. Once we are ready to move to the final, we went in with guns blazing. You can make 3 attacks in one round by using the item that unexhausts your attack card. With last action, explore to deal with the spawning enemy by discarding progress tokens.

Anyway, we managed to kill more monsters than were spawnimg due to the Geomancer's ability to target 3 enemies with an additional exhaust. Using this you can exhaust all your cards in order to trigger the -2 health for free unexhausts.
 
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Tomas Hejna
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glenn3e wrote:
Before the final location, there is plenty of time to gather Success tokens, unexhaust cards and heal up since this particular scenario does not have time constraints. (hence the 'trivial' difficulty). All you need to do is make sure you have enough firepower to deal with the few spawning enemies per turn. Once we are ready to move to the final, we went in with guns blazing. You can make 3 attacks in one round by using the item that unexhausts your attack card. With last action, explore to deal with the spawning enemy by discarding progress tokens.

Anyway, we managed to kill more monsters than were spawnimg due to the Geomancer's ability to target 3 enemies with an additional exhaust. Using this you can exhaust all your cards in order to trigger the -2 health for free unexhausts.

I agree, mass dealing is a must in this scenario. Any improved healing is also great. You are also very likely right about the alternating between green (aka slow retreat) and blue (aka hold position) peril AND a lot exploring to feed the blue forbidding of any new enemies. It seems like a key to this scenario.

Still, the second location quite matters (number of spawned enemies to every player and its travel effect) and for the last location it is perhaps even more important critical (it is huge difference between getting one or two new engaged enemies versus three plus one guaranteed direct damage). It also does matter how far you actually get in the enemies deck, how many undead are there and whether you got Changelings or not.

I'll have to run one or two solo games before I will make final statement but for now I think that certain possible combinations here are definitely far from being trivial.

/ Actually it seems to be not that hard in the end, as I were doing critical error by spawning red number of enemies to each hero instead of only alternating between them up to the red number in total.
 
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glenn3e glenn3e
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XehutL wrote:
glenn3e wrote:
Before the final location, there is plenty of time to gather Success tokens, unexhaust cards and heal up since this particular scenario does not have time constraints. (hence the 'trivial' difficulty). All you need to do is make sure you have enough firepower to deal with the few spawning enemies per turn. Once we are ready to move to the final, we went in with guns blazing. You can make 3 attacks in one round by using the item that unexhausts your attack card. With last action, explore to deal with the spawning enemy by discarding progress tokens.

Anyway, we managed to kill more monsters than were spawnimg due to the Geomancer's ability to target 3 enemies with an additional exhaust. Using this you can exhaust all your cards in order to trigger the -2 health for free unexhausts.

I agree, mass dealing is a must in this scenario. Any improved healing is also great. You are also very likely right about the alternating between green (aka slow retreat) and blue (aka hold position) peril AND a lot exploring to feed the blue forbidding of any new enemies. It seems like a key to this scenario.

Still, the second location quite matters (number of spawned enemies to every player and its travel effect) and for the last location it is critical (it is huge difference between getting one or two new engaged enemies versus three plus one guaranteed direct damage). It also does matter how far you actually get in the enemies deck, how many undead are there and whether you got Changelings or not.

I'll have to run one or two solo games before I will make final statement but for now I think that certain possible combinations here are definitely far from being trivial.


Are you having Changelings copy the Nemesis? Because he is only Trivial, while there are Challenging monsters in the deck, so Changelings could be copying something else like an Ogre.
 
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Garrett
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I just tried this scenario again with four heroes instead of two. I lost when Ankaur Maro had 6 wounds on him.

Locations: Brigand Camp -> Decrepit Monument -> Twisting Halls

Enemies (in no particular order): Reanimate Warriors, Reanimate Archers, Carrion Worms, Crow Hags, Hybrid Sentinels, Sorcerers, Dark Priests, Bandits, Goblin Archers, Goblin Witchers, Cave Spiders, Rat Swarms.

Heroes:
Ashrian (Disciple)
Astarra (Geomancer)
Krutzbeck (Berserker)
Kari Wraithstalker (Thief)

I made a few mistakes this game that I look forward to changing the next time.

1) I should have chosen Elder Mok as a Spiritspeaker instead of Ashrian. Ashrian has a nice ability, but for the first part of the game, it was useless because Astarra and Krutzbeck were defeating all the enemies so she had nobody engaged with her at the start of the enemy phase. Using Elder Mok would have helped the Healer's role as a healer by allowing him to heal three wounds instead of two when he aids, and he would recover a wound at the same time. That's a lot better healing.

2) I chose to upgrade everyone's attack first. I knew it was a combat-heavy scenario and thought I would need the attack dice. I now have a better feel for how each hero can play different roles. I used the Healer's Aid action a lot to heal Krutzbeck and ready his attack. If I had upgraded that card instead, I would have been a lot better off. Likewise, I had a couple rounds where I was 1 progress short of being able to travel. Upgrading the Scout's Explore action would have helped eliminate those rounds.

3) I feel like I finally understand this scenario's rhythm. You go to the green location to upgrade your abilities. You go to the red location to thin those enemies out. You switch between blue and red until you are ready to travel or you are ready to upgrade your abilities. Now, the thing that was messing me up was that I kept forgetting that if I was ready to travel, the green space essentially gives me no enemies. This is so obvious, but somehow I didn't realize that since Peril is after the enemy phase but before the travel phase, the green space spawns enemies that don't get to activate before you travel. I think the ideal would be to wait until you had enough progress on the location to activate the upgrade ability AND travel on the same turn. I may have to try that next time. On the other hand, I really like trying to upgrade those abilities during the first round of the game.

There was an awful round where I went to the green space and only had 11/8 progress on the location. It was the second location so I had to choose whether to upgrade or travel. I chose to upgrade. I shouldn't have gone to the green space unless I knew I had enough progress to upgrade and travel in one round.
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Tomas Hejna
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Nice report.

BTW, imagine getting to Chamber of Statues as the final location: 16 new enemies spawned at once, three to each player and fourth as direct damage from shadows. In the case you travel with one or two enemies engaged, it will be even more damage to those heroes.

I had misinterpreted spawning rule, so this one is not relevant any more. This also applies to my several former comments above. I'll correct/mention to them sometime later.
 
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Xelto G
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XehutL wrote:
Nice report. BTW, imagine getting to Chamber of Statues as the final location: 16 new enemies spawned at once, three to each player and fourth as direct damage from shadows. In the case you travel with one or two enemies engaged, it will be even more damage to those heroes.

Allow me to make your games just a little bit easier. When you spawn enemies, you don't spawn enemies per player equal to the top number: it's total enemies equal to the top number, with spawns starting at the first player and going around the table clockwise.

See if that doesn't make a minor difference.
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Tomas Hejna
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Xelto wrote:
XehutL wrote:
Nice report. BTW, imagine getting to Chamber of Statues as the final location: 16 new enemies spawned at once, three to each player and fourth as direct damage from shadows. In the case you travel with one or two enemies engaged, it will be even more damage to those heroes.

Allow me to make your games just a little bit easier. When you spawn enemies, you don't spawn enemies per player equal to the top number: it's total enemies equal to the top number, with spawns starting at the first player and going around the table clockwise.

Huh, now I can see it. There is no such ruling as spawn per player - only keep spawning until red number of location is reached.

That will make things a lot easier! Also it is very likely that we could have won our second or third attempt.

Thank you for pointing out!

BTW, though this is clearly my bad on reading the respective rule, the rulebook could be written much clearer. I have never done so much errors in any other game before, including way mooore complicated Arkham LCG.
 
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