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Subject: Hound of Tindalos 2019 rss

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Doug Buel
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The card for the Hound of Tindalos in OS3 (or at least, in the Omega Rulebook for OS3) says that the Hound may be placed at any gate, even an enemy gate, upon obtaining the card.

It doesn't say that the Hound may be Summoned onto enemy gates later in the game. I assume that this is intentional, and that the Hound cannot be Summoned onto enemy gates later in the game. But I wanted to ask just to make absolutely sure.
 
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Arthur Petersen
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dbuel wrote:
The card for the Hound of Tindalos in OS3 (or at least, in the Omega Rulebook for OS3) says that the Hound may be placed at any gate, even an enemy gate, upon obtaining the card.

It doesn't say that the Hound may be Summoned onto enemy gates later in the game. I assume that this is intentional, and that the Hound cannot be Summoned onto enemy gates later in the game. But I wanted to ask just to make absolutely sure.


My understanding is that you are correct - only the initial placement. Normal Summonings are just that.
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Doug Buel
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existoid wrote:
dbuel wrote:
The card for the Hound of Tindalos in OS3 (or at least, in the Omega Rulebook for OS3) says that the Hound may be placed at any gate, even an enemy gate, upon obtaining the card.

It doesn't say that the Hound may be Summoned onto enemy gates later in the game. I assume that this is intentional, and that the Hound cannot be Summoned onto enemy gates later in the game. But I wanted to ask just to make absolutely sure.


My understanding is that you are correct - only the initial placement. Normal Summonings are just that.


Thank you so much
 
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Alex Hobbit
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Same goes for insects from Shag.
 
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Doug Buel
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Alright, I have another one for you.

The Hound of Tindalos is owned by Opener of the Way. The Hound and Yog are hanging out in a space. The Hound doesn't die, because Yog is a gate.

Opener wants to Move Yog one space over. Which of the following happens?

1. Yog Moves one space, and the Hound teleports into that same space for free, just fine.
2. Yog Moves one space, but there's a split second before the Hound teleports for free, and so it dies because it's not at a gate for that split second.
3. The Hound will not be able to teleport into the new space no matter what, because the free teleport has to be set up at the time the Move is announced, and there's no gate at the destination.
4. Some other thing

Thank you for any answer you're able to provide
 
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Pierre Lanrezac
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dbuel wrote:
Alright, I have another one for you.

The Hound of Tindalos is owned by Opener of the Way. The Hound and Yog are hanging out in a space. The Hound doesn't die, because Yog is a gate.

Opener wants to Move Yog one space over. Which of the following happens?

1. Yog Moves one space, and the Hound teleports into that same space for free, just fine.
2. Yog Moves one space, but there's a split second before the Hound teleports for free, and so it dies because it's not at a gate for that split second.
3. The Hound will not be able to teleport into the new space no matter what, because the free teleport has to be set up at the time the Move is announced, and there's no gate at the destination.
4. Some other thing

Thank you for any answer you're able to provide


Answer one for me: movement is simultaneous (for the Hound but also for the others game pieces)
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Hector-Xavier de Lastic
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dbuel wrote:
Alright, I have another one for you.

The Hound of Tindalos is owned by Opener of the Way. The Hound and Yog are hanging out in a space. The Hound doesn't die, because Yog is a gate.

Opener wants to Move Yog one space over. Which of the following happens?

1. Yog Moves one space, and the Hound teleports into that same space for free, just fine.
2. Yog Moves one space, but there's a split second before the Hound teleports for free, and so it dies because it's not at a gate for that split second.
3. The Hound will not be able to teleport into the new space no matter what, because the free teleport has to be set up at the time the Move is announced, and there's no gate at the destination.
4. Some other thing

Thank you for any answer you're able to provide
The Petersen rationale is that, whenever in doubt, rule that both players get the maximum benefit of their spellbooks.

Following that, I would rule that the Hound survives: before the Move Action it is in an Area with a Gate, during the Move Action it teleports to an Area with a Gate and after the Move Action it rests in an Area with a Gate.

If the Petersens disagree, I am willing to abide with that, though!
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Bernard Gourion
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Pitpipo wrote:
dbuel wrote:
Alright, I have another one for you.

The Hound of Tindalos is owned by Opener of the Way. The Hound and Yog are hanging out in a space. The Hound doesn't die, because Yog is a gate.

Opener wants to Move Yog one space over. Which of the following happens?

1. Yog Moves one space, and the Hound teleports into that same space for free, just fine.
2. Yog Moves one space, but there's a split second before the Hound teleports for free, and so it dies because it's not at a gate for that split second.
3. The Hound will not be able to teleport into the new space no matter what, because the free teleport has to be set up at the time the Move is announced, and there's no gate at the destination.
4. Some other thing

Thank you for any answer you're able to provide


Answer one for me: movement is simultaneous (for the Hound but also for the others game pieces)


Totally disagree, it is question of causality: what causes the free move is the move of the Opener and so to have the free move, the move of the opener must be triggered so that the condition to have the Tindalos free move is respected.

The best way to solve these kind issues is to avoid additional special rulings like we need to specify that all moves are simultaneous.

Why ? In a broader perspective, this is clear that the moves are NOT simultaneous as you always have the possibility to trigger a free action between two moves: for example, i move CThulhu i attack and then, on the ground on the results of the Battle, decide to move or not some other units...

You could argue that it is the intent that matters but that could cause some other issues...

in fact, the more i think of this the more i will precise for the "move" action:

"The first move in a player turn is a standard action. Any additionnal 'moves' are considered to be free actions (that means you may take any number of 'move' actions although you still have of course to pay 1 PP for each)"

This way, i solve the quite not so rationale rules about the difference between actions and free actions: 'move' was the only one i need to precise that it allows to move any number of units while 'move' is NOT a free action. That alwasys sounded weird to some new players

Arthur, your feeling about this ?
 
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Rick S

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bengougou75 wrote:

Why ? In a broader perspective, this is clear that the moves are NOT simultaneous as you always have the possibility to trigger a free action between two moves: for example, i move CThulhu i attack and then, on the ground on the results of the Battle, decide to move or not some other units...


Is there anything in the rulebook or an official ruling by PG that states this? All I have seen describes Move as a single action, though you can choose how much to pay and how many units to move.
 
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Graham Robinson
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bengougou75 wrote:
you always have the possibility to trigger a free action between two moves: for example, i move CThulhu i attack and then, on the ground on the results of the Battle, decide to move or not some other units.


You cannot do this. Move is a standard action - you move one or more units, paying the cost for all of them. If you have unlimited battle, you can choose to battle before or after Moving, but you cannot move-battle-move as that would be taking two standard actions.

Cheers,
Graham
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Jeff Hobbs
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bengougou75 wrote:
Pitpipo wrote:
dbuel wrote:
Alright, I have another one for you.

The Hound of Tindalos is owned by Opener of the Way. The Hound and Yog are hanging out in a space. The Hound doesn't die, because Yog is a gate.

Opener wants to Move Yog one space over. Which of the following happens?

1. Yog Moves one space, and the Hound teleports into that same space for free, just fine.
2. Yog Moves one space, but there's a split second before the Hound teleports for free, and so it dies because it's not at a gate for that split second.
3. The Hound will not be able to teleport into the new space no matter what, because the free teleport has to be set up at the time the Move is announced, and there's no gate at the destination.
4. Some other thing

Thank you for any answer you're able to provide


Answer one for me: movement is simultaneous (for the Hound but also for the others game pieces)


Totally disagree, it is question of causality: what causes the free move is the move of the Opener and so to have the free move, the move of the opener must be triggered so that the condition to have the Tindalos free move is respected.

The best way to solve these kind issues is to avoid additional special rulings like we need to specify that all moves are simultaneous.

Why ? In a broader perspective, this is clear that the moves are NOT simultaneous as you always have the possibility to trigger a free action between two moves: for example, i move CThulhu i attack and then, on the ground on the results of the Battle, decide to move or not some other units...

You could argue that it is the intent that matters but that could cause some other issues...

in fact, the more i think of this the more i will precise for the "move" action:

"The first move in a player turn is a standard action. Any additionnal 'moves' are considered to be free actions (that means you may take any number of 'move' actions although you still have of course to pay 1 PP for each)"

This way, i solve the quite not so rationale rules about the difference between actions and free actions: 'move' was the only one i need to precise that it allows to move any number of units while 'move' is NOT a free action. That alwasys sounded weird to some new players

Arthur, your feeling about this ?


Assuming moves work this way, the Hound reads:
"The Hound cannot preform a Move Action by itself. The Hound Moves for free whenever you move any other Unit."

The use of the term whenever would imply that this move is simultaneous with the other move. So, You declare that Yog is moving and when he moves the Hound also moves for free to another gate.
 
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Pierre Lanrezac
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jchobbs wrote:


The use of the term whenever would imply that this move is simultaneous with the other move. So, You declare that Yog is moving and when he moves the Hound also moves for free to another gate.


My point exactly
 
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jchobbs wrote:

Assuming moves work this way, the Hound reads:
"The Hound cannot preform a Move Action by itself. The Hound Moves for free whenever you move any other Unit."

The use of the term whenever would imply that this move is simultaneous with the other move. So, You declare that Yog is moving and when he moves the Hound also moves for free to another gate.


But it also says whenever you move any other unit, which wouldn't be the case in the example provided, as it's another player moving a unit.
 
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Rick S

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Which example?
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Bernard Gourion
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therealbuserian wrote:
bengougou75 wrote:
you always have the possibility to trigger a free action between two moves: for example, i move CThulhu i attack and then, on the ground on the results of the Battle, decide to move or not some other units.


You cannot do this. Move is a standard action - you move one or more units, paying the cost for all of them. If you have unlimited battle, you can choose to battle before or after Moving, but you cannot move-battle-move as that would be taking two standard actions.

Cheers,
Graham


Hmmm... a lot of time has passed since i play CW. I will look after that question. Maybe you are right.
 
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wonderloss wrote:
Which example?

Whoops, my bad actually, I misread Douglas' post and thought that the Hound and Yog were owned by different players, but now upon re-reading I realize this was not the case.
 
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