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Subject: The issue at hand concerning D.J. Trump rss

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Michael Carter
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Trump ran a privately held business in which he only had himself to answer to. I think a CEO of a publicly held business would be better at politics.
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Josh
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mlcarter815 wrote:
Trump ran a privately held business in which he only had himself to answer to. I think a CEO of a publicly held business would be better at politics.
That's basically modern politicians. Both are charged with turning a profit for their big investors and can be removed if they don't show results.
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Chad Ellis
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As someone who runs a private business, and knows others who run much larger businesses, the idea that the CEO or owner of a private business only answers to themselves and thus can't be an effective political executive is total bullshit.

Yes, I don't have a boss. Yes, there are some decisions I can take unilaterally. But I answer to my team. I answer to my vendors. I answer to my customers.

Every day I am working with multiple stakeholders, and my success depends on motivating and persuading them towards a common vision. I have to balance competing interests and values and if I don't do it well then my best people leave, my best customers stop coming back, the vendors I depend on to perform at an exceptional level start being just OK (which is awful for us).

This month alone I will:

1. Meet with the owners of multiple peer businesses and hopefully get them to coordinate towards mutual benefit.
2. Ask the city I operate in to authorize us to hold overnight and other special events that go past the normal legal restrictions on operating hours.
3. Work out a multi-party deal that would let us expand our operation.

And I run a comparatively tiny business, with fewer than 50 employees.

None of these are things I just get to decide. They all involve learning about the interests of other parties and either persuading them that their interests are best met by the path I've laid out or working with them to find a mutually-determined path forward.

The problem with Trump isn't his background. It's Trump. His inability to engage in any kind of negotiation other hand hardball value claiming isn't because that's all a private company CEO has to do or even that that's all a real estate guy has to do. It's because he has personal defects that prevented him from learning more.
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Christopher Dearlove
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mlcarter815 wrote:
Trump ran a privately held business in which he only had himself to answer to. I think a CEO of a publicly held business would be better at politics.
Plenty of CEOs of publicly held businesses act as if they have no one to answer to. Sometimes they discover they are wrong.

Edit, taking Chad's point, where he can't act that way (even if he wanted to) the above is particularly if they are large with near monopolies, or political grease to gain monopoly-like advantages.
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Wendell
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Thanks JD, that's an excellent article. Joseph Ellis is a historian I really respect (his books are good).

This struck home (if you read it, it isn't a piece about business people as president):

Joseph Ellis wrote:
Hugh Williamson of North Carolina went further, predicting that any singular executive was likely to evolve into a king, and their job should be "to postpone that event as long as possible."
Unfortunately, I doubt the willingness of the Republicans to postpone this further. Lindsey Graham's fucking rant about how the GOP has to support Trump on the border wall if he does a state of emergency was telling, he said it was for the sake of the PARTY that they should support a blatantly bullshit unconstitutional state of emergency should one be forthcoming.
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Andre
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I don't actually see the issue as being Donald J. Trump, Let's face it, he is an idiot, a shallow individual who really has no concept of morality, a limited intelligence, no intellectual curiosity, a pervasive liar...etc...etc...etc...

I don't even blame the election process, and the fact that an idiot was elected to the office. That was bound to happen, in our history, at some point or another.

What I see as the issue, is the fact that, AFTER Trump has displayed his true colors, that people in power (Congress), would cave on their own moral values, for fear of retribution from a voting populace, that got duped by the guy. In other words, sacrificing their moral and ethical principles, in exchange for essentially keeping their own careers intact. It's really a dereliction of duty, and I honestly hope that they receive the rebuke they deserve, in the history books, for staying silent for so long.
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Daniel Kearns
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abadolato01 wrote:


I don't actually see the issue as being Donald J. Trump, Let's face it, he is an idiot, a shallow individual who really has no concept of morality, a limited intelligence, no intellectual curiosity, a pervasive liar...etc...etc...etc...

I don't even blame the election process, and the fact that an idiot was elected to the office. That was bound to happen, in our history, at some point or another.

What I see as the issue, is the fact that, AFTER Trump has displayed his true colors, that people in power (Congress), would cave on their own moral values, for fear of retribution from a voting populace, that got duped by the guy. In other words, sacrificing their moral and ethical principles, in exchange for essentially keeping their own careers intact. It's really a dereliction of duty, and I honestly hope that they receive the rebuke they deserve, in the history books, for staying silent for so long.
I agree. He's always been a scumbag and a tyrant. He isn't the one who let us down.
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Chad_Ellis wrote:
Yes, I don't have a boss. Yes, there are some decisions I can take unilaterally. But I answer to my team. I answer to my vendors. I answer to my customers.
Sure. But if you really wanted to, you could fire your team, stiff your vendors, and defraud your customers.

remorseless1 wrote:
The key part you overlooked was "in Trump's vein."
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Christopher Dearlove
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abadolato01 wrote:


I don't actually see the issue as being Donald J. Trump, Let's face it, he is an idiot, a shallow individual who really has no concept of morality, a limited intelligence, no intellectual curiosity, a pervasive liar...etc...etc...etc...

I don't even blame the election process, and the fact that an idiot was elected to the office. That was bound to happen, in our history, at some point or another.

What I see as the issue, is the fact that, AFTER Trump has displayed his true colors, that people in power (Congress), would cave on their own moral values, for fear of retribution from a voting populace, that got duped by the guy. In other words, sacrificing their moral and ethical principles, in exchange for essentially keeping their own careers intact. It's really a dereliction of duty, and I honestly hope that they receive the rebuke they deserve, in the history books, for staying silent for so long.
You assume they had moral and ethical values. Perhaps what they've sacrificed is the fig leaf of pretending they had them. Except their supporters are still buying it.
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Andre
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Dearlove wrote:
abadolato01 wrote:


I don't actually see the issue as being Donald J. Trump, Let's face it, he is an idiot, a shallow individual who really has no concept of morality, a limited intelligence, no intellectual curiosity, a pervasive liar...etc...etc...etc...

I don't even blame the election process, and the fact that an idiot was elected to the office. That was bound to happen, in our history, at some point or another.

What I see as the issue, is the fact that, AFTER Trump has displayed his true colors, that people in power (Congress), would cave on their own moral values, for fear of retribution from a voting populace, that got duped by the guy. In other words, sacrificing their moral and ethical principles, in exchange for essentially keeping their own careers intact. It's really a dereliction of duty, and I honestly hope that they receive the rebuke they deserve, in the history books, for staying silent for so long.
You assume they had moral and ethical values. Perhaps what they've sacrificed is the fig leaf of pretending they had them. Except their supporters are still buying it.
You could be right, but I am at least hopeful that there are enough people, that recognize the failings of the Republicans in Congress, and decide to use their vote to ouster them. The 2016 midterms did, to some degree, validate that everyone is not pleased with Trump. The 2020 elections may be even less favorable to them. I am convinced that voting is the best means to rid ourselves of Trump. Everything else is merely good (or bad) theater.
 
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Bill Cook
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Yo yo yo, DJ Trump is in the house. Spinning some wicked tunes for you people. Now get up and dance
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Moshe Callen
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EMBison wrote:
Yo yo yo, DJ Trump is in the house. Spinning some wicked tunes for you people. Now get up and dance
I picture him playing Barry Manilow, Rick Ashley, and annoying songs that have gone viral on youtube.
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Al Ross
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whac3 wrote:
EMBison wrote:
Yo yo yo, DJ Trump is in the house. Spinning some wicked tunes for you people. Now get up and dance
I picture him playing Barry Manilow, Rick Ashley, and annoying songs that have gone viral on youtube.
ABBAyuk

Remembering his coked up Studio 54 days.
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Moshe Callen
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Albatros28215 wrote:
whac3 wrote:
EMBison wrote:
Yo yo yo, DJ Trump is in the house. Spinning some wicked tunes for you people. Now get up and dance
I picture him playing Barry Manilow, Rick Ashley, and annoying songs that have gone viral on youtube.
ABBAyuk

Remembering his coked up Studio 54 days.
Yeah, but as much of a metalhead as I am, there are still some ABBA songs I can't quite bring myself to hate.
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Andre
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whac3 wrote:
EMBison wrote:
Yo yo yo, DJ Trump is in the house. Spinning some wicked tunes for you people. Now get up and dance
I picture him playing Barry Manilow, Rick Ashley, and annoying songs that have gone viral on youtube.
Couple songs he WON'T be playing;

Macarena
Despacito
Fight the Power
Feliz Navidad
La Bamba
The Message

Amongst others.
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Moshe Callen
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remorseless1 wrote:

Terrible, isn't it? I stoutly reject Abba … then Dancing Queen comes on the radio... cry
For me, it's "Take a chance on me".
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abadolato01 wrote:
whac3 wrote:
EMBison wrote:
Yo yo yo, DJ Trump is in the house. Spinning some wicked tunes for you people. Now get up and dance
I picture him playing Barry Manilow, Rick Ashley, and annoying songs that have gone viral on youtube.
Couple songs he WON'T be playing;

Macarena
Despacito
Fight the Power
Feliz Navidad
La Bamba
The Message

Amongst others.
We're Not Gonna Take It
 
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Moshe Callen
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ἄνδρα μοι ἔννεπε, μοῦσα, πολύτροπον, ὃς μάλα πολλὰ/ πλάγχθη, ἐπεὶ Τροίης ἱερὸν πτολίεθρον ἔπερσεν./...
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Talmanes wrote:
abadolato01 wrote:
whac3 wrote:
EMBison wrote:
Yo yo yo, DJ Trump is in the house. Spinning some wicked tunes for you people. Now get up and dance
I picture him playing Barry Manilow, Rick Ashley, and annoying songs that have gone viral on youtube.
Couple songs he WON'T be playing;

Macarena
Despacito
Fight the Power
Feliz Navidad
La Bamba
The Message

Amongst others.
We're Not Gonna Take It
Nyah, that's actually a decent song.
 
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Bern Harkins
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A lot of people don't know it, but Donald Trump knows all about music. He has the best ears. A lot of people, when they find out, they don't believe it. They say, "Wow. I can't believe that."

Mr. Trump never made the cross-over to digital music, as he thinks a thumb-drive is a technique for walking a prostitute into a hotel room, and he fears compact disks can steal his soul.

Instead, he has staff members copy his music onto the tiny cassette tapes that used to come in answering machines, which he then marks with a black Sharpie.

Here's a few hot trax from the private playlist of Mendacious DJT.

REM: "Got no spine, got my orange rug."

Gershwin: "Rhapsody in Burnt Umber."

Queen: "Another sheik books a floor... and another sheik books a floor...'

Beatles: "HELP ME!"
 
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Chad Ellis
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remorseless1 wrote:

Dude, I'm hip, okay? My father ran his own business for more than 40 years, so I understand. The key part you overlooked was "in Trump's vein." It was specific. Don't get all butt hurt -- I love capitalism!
I was less responding to your post than the one that immediately followed:

mlcarter815 wrote:
Trump ran a privately held business in which he only had himself to answer to. I think a CEO of a publicly held business would be better at politics.
This is an example of a theme I've heard many times, both here and elsewhere: not that Trump happened to run his little empire like a little empire (which, I suspect, played a large role in his many failures), but that people who run a private business that they own naturally only answer to themselves and so can't adapt when suddenly they have to deal with many stakeholders that they can't just boss around.

This seems echoed in another post that also thought I'd missed the "in Trump's vein":

Talmanes wrote:
Chad_Ellis wrote:
Yes, I don't have a boss. Yes, there are some decisions I can take unilaterally. But I answer to my team. I answer to my vendors. I answer to my customers.
Sure. But if you really wanted to, you could fire your team, stiff your vendors, and defraud your customers.
The answer to this is, well, sure, but if I did that I would fail and lose everything I own. Anyone who owns anything can do dumb things with what they own. It's like saying that people don't learn about how to build lasting relationships because anyone who wants to could cut everyone they know out of their life and live alone in a basement.

There are important differences between business and government, and business leaders who think they can just jump into government often misunderstand those differences. I just think it's important to understand what those differences are, and where they come from. I don't think public vs. private is the issue at all, or that private business owners are used to a world where they just get to decide whatever they want.

The biggest difference is probably that in business you have much greater flexibility to decide who you want to work with, and this is often where successful business leaders make the biggest impact. You can identify the customer segments where you think you can deliver the most value, you can meet with multiple vendors and figure out which one offers the best fit to your needs, you can plan your compensation, hours, benefits, and work environment to attract a particular type of worker. You don't get to dictate to any of them (at least, not without cost), but you have a lot of flexibility on who you're negotiating with.

A President doesn't have that flexibility. You can't decide that a particular segment of the world isn't working out and sell or close that division. If you find it's hard to identify shared interests with another nation you can't just say, "OK, let's partner with someone else." You have to work with what you have to a much greater extent.

This was one of my big criticisms of Mitt Romney. It seemed to me that he'd learned too many of the wrong lessons from private equity, but in particular he didn't seem to understand that a huge part of his success was that he could pick and choose exactly where to get involved. If a situation didn't look attractive they just moved on.
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Chad_Ellis wrote:
This seems echoed in another post that also thought I'd missed the "in Trump's vein":

Talmanes wrote:
Chad_Ellis wrote:
Yes, I don't have a boss. Yes, there are some decisions I can take unilaterally. But I answer to my team. I answer to my vendors. I answer to my customers.
Sure. But if you really wanted to, you could fire your team, stiff your vendors, and defraud your customers.
The answer to this is, well, sure, but if I did that I would fail and lose everything I own.
Aha but then you can just file bankruptcies and make another withdrawal from the bank of daddy.

To be clear: no, I didn't think you missed the "in Trump's vein". I was just having a little fun with it.
 
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Carl Parsons
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So much ABBA hate. While I say...

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