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Legends Untold: Weeping Caves Novice Set» Forums » Rules

Subject: Legends Untold FAQ rss

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Kev Young
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With games arriving within a matter of days/weeks (depending on where you are on this fine earth), I thought it helpful to put this up here?

I will get the ball rolling with the five questions about the rules we hear most often at conventions.

1 - If I select Scout, Centre or Guard can I change that position every turn?
Yes, absolutely.

2 - Can I split the party?

No, not at present. Perhaps in some future expansion but not just now.

3 - Do I need to play one of the Scenarios or Episodes?
No, it's your game you can use it in Sandpit mode and even ignore the events if you just want to explore.

4 - Do Conditions impact Foes?
No, not in the base game.

5 - In Combat why is there an Engagement Round and then standard Combat Rounds?
To ensure that Surprise can be taken into account (you may gain Surprise and choose to Retreat before the fight begins).
To ensure that Ranged combatants (both Foes and Heroes) always get a chance to shoot before the 'pinning rules' take effect in the standard Combat Rounds.

6 - On the Missing Adventurers scenario card it says to shuffle the tattered map and the warning note in. Should these 2 cards form part of the 6 treasure cards for thus quest or are they additional?
Any stated cards, Locations, Foes, Loot etc. are always used in addition to the stated number of cards in the metal rings. So in this case 6 plus those two and shuffle into the bottom half of the adventure deck.

7 - My trap card says each hero in the centre takes damage. But I am playing with 2 characters so technically speaking theres nobody in the centre. I presume that means they both take damage right?
No, neither is impacted. p.17 'If a card relates to a position that is not currently used then that effect is ignored.'

8 - Gaining loot - I was awarded a loot card thanks to a successful trap check. What do I do if the top card/s on the [?] deck are foes or discoveries? Do I discard them or in the case of foes, fight them?
Having clarified it with you in this case (Windrush Trap)it states 'Draw a Loot card.' Where a card itself says 'Draw a Loot card' then you draw until you get a Loot card. Don't resolve anything else.

9 - I was a bit confused with the actions of the melee foes but might have made sense of it now. They don't directly attack in the same way as the ranged foes do, but their damage (shown at the top of their stat block) is applied when resolving the party's melee actions - such as when Trading Blows. Is that right?
Yes this is correct, in melee you apply and Damage and Conditions FROM the Melee Creature to your Hero if you roll a Trade Blows or Fail result.

10 - My forgehand just used Mighty Throw from his Openers skill to throw the axe. He rolled a 10, which is Trade Blows - a melee outcome. Do I still Trade Blows if it's a ranged attack?
No, the Trade Blows result should be treated as a Miss result in this situation.

11 - I've had a few games so far and am loving it. I do have a simple question though, is there a limit on how much loot you can carry?
There is no limit to the number of Loot Items you can carry, it is also communal and can be used by the whole Party. Remember Loot does not carry over onto a new Adventure.

12 - In the campaign it mentions to add plot cards and write down how many you find. How many do we add as they aren't part of the normal adventure deck construction icons. Are there any specific rules about finding them as we draw them from the adventure deck? Are they like loot and we have to succeed a test?
Ah - this looks like an oversight on our part. Apologies. Plot cards should be mentioned in the Set Up section of the Adventure cards (Scenario or Episodes). You can see this in WC-SC06 and GS-EP05.

ERRATA FOR PAGE 24 of the Weeping Caves Campaign Book.

The last paragraph should read as follows:
Shuffle three Plot cards into the Adventure deck for each Episode in the Weeping Caves Campaign, except for WC-EP07 where they are not used. Plot cards are simply found and collected. Whenever you draw a Plot card from the Adventure deck always immediately draw the next card in the Adventure deck in line with the normal rules. The Plot Cards Found column is used to write down how many Plot cards you find during a given Episode, these will be important at a later point.



13 - Campaign Episode 2 - Report back. I take it the starting location is Warrenhome. This isn't mentioned anywhere but seems to be the logical starting location based on the where we ended up. But alternative starting locations aren't mentioned anywhere in the rules. Yes - it's at the top right of the Episode card. Please note in the Sewers Campaign it can vary depending on progress through the Sewer.

14 - The rules around upgrade refer to weapons, talents and items of equipment. Does items of equipment actually mean kit. So can you obtain kit item when you upgrade your character? (there is a bit of ambiguity around "kit items" and "items of equipment" in the rule book) Rulebook p50 should keep you right hopefully. Yes in the base game it means Kit but we wanted to reserve the term at the start in case we add other things later. Yes you absolutely can upgrade a Weapon, Kit or Outfit when you receive n Upgrade as part of a level up. Indeed Kits become materially better when you upgrade them usually.


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Chris Ganshaw
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Is there a link to the most current copy of the rules? While I am waiting on my copies to arrive I would like to read them.
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Kev Young
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Hi Chris I have tried to upload them to BGG several times but unfortunately I have had no success(perhaps it is a file size thing).

I hope this is ok, here is the link to the download centre for IG. You can find it here:

https://www.inspiringgames.com/legends-untold-download-centr...
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Martin
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6. My trap card says each hero in the centre takes damage. But I am playing with 2 characters so technically speaking theres nobody in the centre. I presume that means they both take damage right?
 
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Chris Ganshaw
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Worked like a charm. I guess if I had enough sense I would have checked the IG site to begin with.
 
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Kev Young
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Hi Martin,
no, you are fortunate, neither is impacted. I've added this to the FAQ above as 7 - thanks for raising it.

Design note - If you are playing Lonewolf or two Heroes then yes these situations will come up from time to time, it's to help your own survivability when you have a smaller pool of Talent cards to draw from.

Conversely, if you are playing with a big party of say 6 or 8 Heroes and a Trap is triggered you may end up causing damage to 4 or even 6 Heroes in one go. This is to balance out the increased Talent card pool of the Party.

In this case most people will laugh (and probably grumble about useless Scouts).

IG
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Kev Young
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Banor58 wrote:
Worked like a charm. I guess if I had enough sense I would have checked the IG site to begin with.


Not at all, thanks for raising it. It had been on my to do list for ages!

Cheers
IG
 
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Gaining loot - I was awarded a loot card thanks to a successful trap check. What do I do if the top card/s on the [?] deck are foes or discoveries? Do I discard them or in the case of foes, fight them?

Also, I was a bit confused with the actions of the melee foes but might have made sense of it now. They don't directly attack in the same way as the ranged foes do, but their damage (shown at the top of their stat block) is applied when resolving the party's melee actions - such as when Trading Blows. Is that right?
 
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Kev Young
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sleekgeek123 wrote:
Gaining loot - I was awarded a loot card thanks to a successful trap check. What do I do if the top card/s on the [?] deck are foes or discoveries? Do I discard them or in the case of foes, fight them?

Also, I was a bit confused with the actions of the melee foes but might have made sense of it now. They don't directly attack in the same way as the ranged foes do, but their damage (shown at the top of their stat block) is applied when resolving the party's melee actions - such as when Trading Blows. Is that right?


Hi, I've answered these above.

Design note on the Melee results. Yes, I agree it is pretty unusual, we have done it this way in Melee to compress time and keep the game moving.
In say a four Hero vs four Creature fight depending on the RPG system being used, traditionally you may have to roll: surprise, initiative, to hit, damage, possibly even saving throws for each of those combatants.

That's a lot of dice rolls! In Legends we want you to clear that Location in five minutes flat but capture all of that depth without the time, and then also to add in fun Talents to help change results.

That's why we use the unified combat roll. You have one roll for Surprise and then each Melee Hero rolls once for both combatants. In effect, it captures initiative, to hit, damage, saving throws and outnumbering tactics in that single dice roll which you then may be able to modify with Talent cards.

IG
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drive elizabeth
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Nessie76 wrote:
Hi, I've answered these above.

Design note on the Melee results. Yes, I agree it is pretty unusual, we have done it this way in Melee to compress time and keep the game moving.
In say a four Hero vs four Creature fight depending on the RPG system being used, traditionally you may have to roll: surprise, initiative, to hit, damage, possibly even saving throws for each of those combatants.

That's a lot of dice rolls! In Legends we want you to clear that Location in five minutes flat but capture all of that depth without the time, and then also to add in fun Talents to help change results.

That's why we use the unified combat roll. You have one roll for Surprise and then each Melee Hero rolls once for both combatants. In effect, it captures initiative, to hit, damage, saving throws and outnumbering tactics in that single dice roll which you then may be able to modify with Talent cards.

IG


I want to add that I am finding this approach to be fantastic as it keeps it manageable and streamlines the whole process - without it combat could have easily become confusing and cumbersome - inspired!
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Kev Young
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This is great to hear. It often takes a few rounds until the penny drops because it is different to the usual 'roll for everybody' approach, but once you get used to it it should be straightforward.

You've also probably noticed that without modifiers the melee results skew towards a Trade Blows result. This reflects our research on combat duelling where a 'double' (both combatants strike at the same time) is the most common result. Mechanically it also keeps the game ticking along and thematically there are no Creatures that are just fodder. This was really important to me, in Mor Nadar a simple Goblin Brave can kill the mightiest hero (and you guys are only playing penniless peasants to begin with).
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Paul Herrald
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My forgehand just used Mighty Throw from his Openers skill to throw the axe. He rolled a 10, which is Trade Blows - a melee outcome. Do I still Trade Blows if it's a ranged attack?
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Kev Young
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Lyannah wrote:
My forgehand just used Mighty Throw from his Openers skill to throw the axe. He rolled a 10, which is Trade Blows - a melee outcome. Do I still Trade Blows if it's a ranged attack?


Hi Paul I've answered this above.
This is an edge case (we knew we would get them, thanks for raising it). The design theory is that anyone can throw a Spear hence why it has a Trade Blows / Miss symbol beside it. You do not need a Talent to use a Spear as a Ranged Attack.

However, throwing an Axe well is much harder (note this is not a francisca which is a potential upgrade to the Axe at a later date), hence why you need a Talent to perform this attack with this Weapon. The Ranged Attack rules on p41 do not permit for a Trade Blows result with a Ranged Attack, however, of course, there is no miss symbol on either the Axe card or the Openers Talent.

Thanks again for bringing this to our attention, it is appreciated!

IG
 
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Felonious Tub
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I've had a few games so far and am loving it. I do have a simple question though, is there a limit on how much loot you can carry?
 
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Kev Young
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FeloniousTub wrote:
I've had a few games so far and am loving it. I do have a simple question though, is there a limit on how much loot you can carry?


Hi, great to hear you are enjoying it, this really makes our day! I've answered above. In short no. Design note - finding stuff is fun so we want you to find things, however in the base game we do not have enough resources to give you endless loot, hence why you lose it all again. Thematically you don't have a backpack in any case (peasants on the run). We may look at carrying over Loot in future expansions (you'll probably rig a backpack by then) but only if it does not imbalance the game. Equally so we may just stick to Kits and other interesting things to come like Gemstones and Silksign Fragments.

Cheers
IG
 
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Hi, I can't seem to find a reference to the 4 'NP' location cards in the card almanac. Are these intended to be mixed in with the WC set?
 
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I just tested the waters with a standalone scenario. I'm liking it. But I have a couple of questions. I suspect the answer to them, but I wanted to confirm.

Q: When a test says +0, does that mean that the character's attribute bonus is not applied? Example: In the Fungal Spores obstacle, it reads Balance (Brawn) + 0. Does the player still add the character attribute to the roll?

I suspect you still add the attribute #. The +0 or -1 is an additional bonus or penalty.

Q: A character has mastery if they have a card with a symbol that matches the symbol on the test card. If the specialty banner is blank, is there no mastery, even if a hero has a card with a blank specialty banner?

I played it as having no mastery, even if both the test card and a talent card had blank specialty banners.

Q: Does Weakness apply to combat rolls?

My reading is that it doesn't because the manual states that it applies to all Tests. It doesn't mention combat. And the combat rules don't refer to Weakness.


Q: In what order should the search results and the careful search time cost be resolved? And in the case where the time card is the last one, should the event resolve before the search?

Logically, I'd say that the resolving the time cost is first. And that includes resolving the event if applicable. In some cases, I can see where as a narrative, the event works better coming after gaining the search results.
 
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John Flood
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If you are soloing a hero, is he scout, guard, both or neither?
 
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Daily Grind
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FlashFlood52 wrote:
If you are soloing a hero, is he scout, guard, both or neither?

Ooo! I know one

Page 17: If there is only one Hero in the Party, they are the Scout.
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Jonathan Meltzer
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When building a level 1 hero, you are told to take a weapon and three talents, and that later you can gain equipment and outfits through upgrade. However, the Alchemist booster rules state that one hero must have taken the Herbalism Pack Kit. Does that mean that you cannot gain herbs and potions until at least level 2 (due to taking the kit as your allowed upgrade when leveling up), or that you start with that kit at level 1?
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gbeason wrote:

Q: Does Weakness apply to combat rolls?

My reading is that it doesn't because the manual states that it applies to all Tests. It doesn't mention combat. And the combat rules don't refer to Weakness.


But isnt a combat roll a test?
 
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Jonathan Meltzer
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stevelabny wrote:
gbeason wrote:

Q: Does Weakness apply to combat rolls?

My reading is that it doesn't because the manual states that it applies to all Tests. It doesn't mention combat. And the combat rules don't refer to Weakness.


But isnt a combat roll a test?


I don’t think so. There is nothing I have seen that indicates that a melee or ranged attack is a test.
 
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Mizerak wrote:
stevelabny wrote:
gbeason wrote:

Q: Does Weakness apply to combat rolls?

My reading is that it doesn't because the manual states that it applies to all Tests. It doesn't mention combat. And the combat rules don't refer to Weakness.


But isnt a combat roll a test?


I don’t think so. There is nothing I have seen that indicates that a melee or ranged attack is a test.


the rulebook p.40 Performing an Attack - "An attack is a Test, and dice are rolled to determine the outcome."

Edit: not only does it say test, it capitalizes it, which to me for sure means it is one.
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gbeason wrote:
Q: When a test says +0, does that mean that the character's attribute bonus is not applied? Example: In the Fungal Spores obstacle, it reads Balance (Brawn) + 0. Does the player still add the character attribute to the roll?

The plus or minus is an added modifier to make the test slightly easier/harder; the character's bonus is still applied.


gbeason wrote:
Q: A character has mastery if they have a card with a symbol that matches the symbol on the test card. If the specialty banner is blank, is there no mastery, even if a hero has a card with a blank specialty banner?

There is no mastery.


gbeason wrote:
Q: Does Weakness apply to combat rolls?

Yes. Both Weakness and Mastery allows rolling all four dice, but Weakness uses the three lowest dice while Mastery uses the three highest dice. So it's possible to be weak in combat, but not masterful.


gbeason wrote:
Q: In what order should the search results and the careful search time cost be resolved? And in the case where the time card is the last one, should the event resolve before the search?

Events are resolved after the actions that required the spending of time.
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Jonathan Meltzer
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stevelabny wrote:
Mizerak wrote:
stevelabny wrote:
gbeason wrote:

Q: Does Weakness apply to combat rolls?

My reading is that it doesn't because the manual states that it applies to all Tests. It doesn't mention combat. And the combat rules don't refer to Weakness.


But isnt a combat roll a test?


I don’t think so. There is nothing I have seen that indicates that a melee or ranged attack is a test.


the rulebook p.40 Performing an Attack - "An attack is a Test, and dice are rolled to determine the outcome."

Edit: not only does it say test, it capitalizes it, which to me for sure means it is one.


My mistake then...though I did say that nothing *I* have seen indicates it. Obviously I missed that part when I was reading the rules.
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