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Subject: 2019 Gaming Hoopla no-ship Math Trade discussion thread rss

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Scott Halvorson
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The 2019 Gaming Hoopla at the Doubletree Hotel in Mundelein, IL is just weeks away. Here is the math trade that you have all been waiting for!

Discussion GeekList: Right here!
Trade GeekList: https://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/254597/2019-gaming-ho...

If you are participating in this math trade, the use of the OLWLG (Online Want List Generator) is mandatory for creating your want list(s) (please remember to tip JeffyJeff some GG for his support).

If you have never used the OLWLG before, please read this: http://boardgamegeek.com/wiki/page/OLWLG

And if you're still unsure, feel free to ask questions in this discussion thread. It's not hard... really... the core idea is that you post stuff you are willing to trade, and then choose things others have listed that you'd be willing to trade each of your items for. You'll only ever give something away if you also receive something in exchange for it that you chose! And if there's nothing you want for a given title, you don't have to trade it.

Key Dates and Times

Open for posting games: now through Monday, April 8, 10:00 PM CDT
Want list submission period: Monday, April 8, 10:00 PM to Monday, April 22, 10:00 PM CDT

Results will be posted shortly thereafter.

Please note that errors made by you will NOT invalidate the results. You will be expected to honor your trades even if you made a mistake, so please carefully review your wants list(s) before submitting them. You can always make changes BEFORE the end of the submission period but NOT after it.

This event is open to anyone who wants to participate, but please note that this is a no-ship event. We will be meeting up on Saturday, April 27 at 10:00 AM to exchange games in the hotel lobby. You'll either need to be in attendance, have someone proxy (drop off and pick up) for you at the meet-up, or make your own arrangements to give/get your trade items.

Please do not delete items or sweeteners once you have listed them. You can always submit a blank want list for an entry if you've traded it away before the deadline or choose not to trade it away. *Note: I have been told previously that deleting items from the Geeklist will not mess things up for the OLWLG, but I have not had a chance to verify this. If it turns out that this is true, then I shall delete this paragraph, as it will no longer be applicable.

OK - some simple rules - please take a few minutes to read them:

* This is a no-ship event. All exchanges are to be made at the 2019 Gaming Hoopla as above. If you cannot attend in person, you can still participate, but you must find someone who is willing to act as your proxy at the convention (taking your games there for you and picking up your new games). If you are unable to get your games to the Con for whatever reason after participating, then this becomes a shipping trade for you, and it will be your responsibility to pay postage costs for both shipping your games and for others to ship games to you, but please don't let it come to that.

* Gift certificates and Geekgold (GG) are allowed in this math trade, but arbitrage of this is not (trading a lower cash value item for a higher cash value item). In order to trade a gift certificate for a game, it counts as a direct sale, and you have to list the game in the BGG Marketplace and give BGG their 3% commission.

* DVDs, RPGs, computer games, and other relevant items of interest are all permitted, but be reasonable. If you list items nobody is interested in, then you're wasting your and everyone else's time.

* Non-game entries must be added as "Outside the Scope of BGG" (game id 23953), Miscellaneous Game Merchandise (game id 22104), or "Miscellaneous Game Accessory" (game id 5985). Please also note the use of the "alt name" tag that the OLWLG supports in order to properly view your items over there.

* If you are offering an expansion for which there is no entry in BGG (for instance expansion cards handed out at Essen) and NOT the base game, please use "Miscellaneous Game Accessory" to help avoid confusion.

* You are expected to describe, as accurately as is reasonably possible, the condition (components and box) and edition of your item in the description. If your item is not the English version or a multilingual version that includes English rules, then the supported languages MUST be explicitly disclosed in the description (copies/printouts of English rules are fine, but it must be disclosed that the game was not originally English from the manufacturer). This includes sweeteners.

* For games not brand new (in shrink), you must inventory the game's components and list anything missing. Do not assume that it is complete solely because the person you obtained it from previously (assuming you obtained it used) told you it was. If a game is found to be missing pieces, then it will be the giver's responsibility to rectify that. Also, remember that just because something is "new in shrink," that doesn't mean that you shouldn't disclose any dings and dents. It might not matter to you, but it matters to some people.

* You are expected to periodically check during the item submission period, and preferably during the want list submission period, to see if anyone has commented on your entries. People often ask questions of items - most commonly because you have forgotten to state a version, language, or shipping policy - and you should check in to address such questions in a timely manner should they arise, so that everyone then has the correct information available.

This is a very easy thing to do. Just Subscribe to the item as you are posting it in the Geeklist. When someone posts a comment to your item, you will have a Subscription notification alerting you that someone posted a comment. You can then respond to the comment in the Geeklist for everyone to see.

Other useful information

OLWLG Metric Used: USERS-TRADING Seed=12345 Iterations=100

Want list submission

You can start creating your want lists any time after the start of the event.

Please note that it's best to work on your want lists and submit them early - you can always make changes and resubmit later. This will prevent you from being left out if you forget the deadline.

Submissions may be made at any time after the listing period has ended. If you will be unavailable during the want list submission period but still wish to participate, contact me directly and we can discuss the possibility of you submitting early.

Remember that you may have saved your want lists, but they have NOT been submitted until you press the green button in step 4 and received a confirming Geekmail.

You are not obligated to trade anything you put up for offer. If you offer a game, but see nothing that you are willing to accept for it in trade, just submit a blank want list for it. If, however, you do submit a want list for a game, then it is expected that you will honor any trade that the TradeMaximizer comes up with. You will not receive anything you did not list as acceptable for the game(s) you have offered, so it is important to check your want lists when they are posted publicly (see above dates), to correct any errors.

Please note: Sometimes real life intrudes on us unexpectedly. If I'm late posting something or responding to someone's questions, please bear with me. Running one of these can be a fair bit of work, so please be patient.

So enter lots of items and have fun!
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Charles Boyung
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Hey Scott, can you post when it's up on OLWLG? Much easier to use that to relist things that didn't trade at Fire & Ice.
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Scott Halvorson
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Yeah, I forgot to GM JeffyJeff about the math trade. I'll get right on that and let everyone know when it is ready.
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Charles Boyung
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Only a week to go and a lot of the "regulars" aren't on the math trade yet. What's going on???
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Phil
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motoyugota wrote:
Only a week to go and a lot of the "regulars" aren't on the math trade yet. What's going on???


I know the Hoopla website still has a link to the old math trade: http://www.gaminghoopla.com/math-trade.html, not sure if that is causing the significant drop off in submissions.

I at least posted the 2019 links to the 2018 list in case anyone was subscribed to the old list.
 
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William Jason Raynovich
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Are Math Trades out of fashion?
 
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Chris Menden
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Has the list been updated lately? I’m only seeing 6 items right now, but 350+ on the other list. Am I doing something wrong?
 
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Phil
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chrismenden wrote:
Has the list been updated lately? I’m only seeing 6 items right now, but 350+ on the other list. Am I doing something wrong?


Nope, the list just hasn't been synced with OLWLG for a bit. Scott will sync it once the listing period is done.

In the past it's been synced multiple times (I know it was last year) probably because there were so many items. This year is a quite a bit lighter (at least compared to last year when I believe there were over 40 pages of stuff for trade).
 
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Charles Boyung
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farsidehobbes wrote:
chrismenden wrote:
Has the list been updated lately? I’m only seeing 6 items right now, but 350+ on the other list. Am I doing something wrong?


Nope, the list just hasn't been synced with OLWLG for a bit. Scott will sync it once the listing period is done.

In the past it's been synced multiple times (I know it was last year) probably because there were so many items. This year is a quite a bit lighter (at least compared to last year when I believe there were over 40 pages of stuff for trade).


Last year there were 51 participants. Right now, there's only 22. Hope we get some more traction in the next few days.
 
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Phil
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Reminder that today is the deadline to post your games to the 2019 Math Trade list. Get your stuff in by 10pm CDT.
 
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Scott Halvorson
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The time for submitting games for trade is up, and I am working on opening up the want list submission window. I'll have that ready shortly.
 
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Scott Halvorson
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OK, I think everything is now ready. The OLWLG has undergone some changes since the instructions how to run a MT were written, so if things aren't working as they should, please shoot me a GM and let me know. I'll look into it when I can. Otherwise, go ahead and start putting together your want lists and submit them. You have a week. Ready, set, GO!
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Jack K
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FYI - I accidentally misrepresented the version of Granada.

I listed it as multilingual, but it's the German-only version. There's a colour printout of the English rules, and the only language-dependency is the names of the buildings on the tiles and the helper tiles.

I played it last night, and the language makes no difference but seems like the safest thing is to submit a blank list for this item...

(side trades are always a possibility)
 
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Amanda Turnbull
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I'm pretty disappointed that after months of checking the the Hoopla site regularly, I still managed to miss the Math Trade window. It hasn't been in any of the emailed updates and aside from constantly checking the website, or apparently this thread, there was no indication that it was happening. So if you're seeing a decline in participants, it's definitely because of a lack of communication.
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Scott Halvorson
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I have to apologize for some of the lack of communication. Even though I had thought that there was mention of the math trade in the last couple of newsletters, I had forgotten to put it on the front page of BGG in the Trade and Auction Lists section. Somebody had suggested it to me, but only a couple of days before the submission window closed, and then due to busyness, I had neglected to post it there. I don't know about the timing of updating the gaminghoopla.com web site, but as of my last check, the information there is current. I cannot speak to how it was earlier.

The best I can say is that for next year, I will make sure to have all the information updated wherever it needs to be, and I will add it to the Trade and Auction Lists section for those who check that area of BGG. And we will make extra sure that it is mentioned in the couple of Hoopla newsletters before it begins.

- Scott
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Scott Halvorson
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Three days to go to post your want lists. I'll run the Trade Maximizer software on Monday evening around 10pm. If your games do not trade, remember that there is still time to submit your games to the Hoopla silent auction. Click here for a link to the auction section of the Hoopla web site. The deadline for those submissions is Thursday afternoon. Submitting them online is the *only* method to put your games in the auction.
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Fatt Hon Yong
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Hi all,

I made some mistakes when i posted my games. But back then, it didn't allow me to edit my posts, so I made the corrections in the comments. Is that enough to notify the people who want the games? If it is not, then i am just going to clear my want list for those games.

 
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Charles Boyung
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fatthon91 wrote:
Hi all,

I made some mistakes when i posted my games. But back then, it didn't allow me to edit my posts, so I made the corrections in the comments. Is that enough to notify the people who want the games? If it is not, then i am just going to clear my want list for those games.



Just speaking for myself, but seeing the changes (one is NIS and the other is "played once"), I would say that there's no issue there - if people were looking for details on those items, they would have asked. But again, that's just my opinion and I would leave the final say to Scott (unless you're able to GM all participants in the trade).
 
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Charles Boyung
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alcazar84 wrote:
I have to apologize for some of the lack of communication. Even though I had thought that there was mention of the math trade in the last couple of newsletters, I had forgotten to put it on the front page of BGG in the Trade and Auction Lists section. Somebody had suggested it to me, but only a couple of days before the submission window closed, and then due to busyness, I had neglected to post it there. I don't know about the timing of updating the gaminghoopla.com web site, but as of my last check, the information there is current. I cannot speak to how it was earlier.

The best I can say is that for next year, I will make sure to have all the information updated wherever it needs to be, and I will add it to the Trade and Auction Lists section for those who check that area of BGG. And we will make extra sure that it is mentioned in the couple of Hoopla newsletters before it begins.

- Scott


We still ended up with pretty good participation numbers - not quite last year, but close.
 
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Scott Halvorson
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fatthon91 wrote:
Hi all,

I made some mistakes when i posted my games. But back then, it didn't allow me to edit my posts, so I made the corrections in the comments. Is that enough to notify the people who want the games? If it is not, then i am just going to clear my want list for those games.


Posting the corrections to the comments should be good enough. You are able to edit your posts until the submission period closes, but after that, comments are still open for people to post questions or updates.
 
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Scott Halvorson
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About 5.5 hours to go to submit your want lists. After that, I'll run the MT software and post results. A reminder, the meet-up is Saturday at 10am in the hotel lobby for the game exchange, unless you want to make individual arrangements with your trading partners to make your exchanges at your convenience.
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Jack K
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alcazar84 wrote:
fatthon91 wrote:
Hi all,

I made some mistakes when i posted my games. But back then, it didn't allow me to edit my posts, so I made the corrections in the comments. Is that enough to notify the people who want the games? If it is not, then i am just going to clear my want list for those games.


Posting the corrections to the comments should be good enough. You are able to edit your posts until the submission period closes, but after that, comments are still open for people to post questions or updates.


Generally I very strongly disagree with this. Not everyone subscribes to all of the items that they add to their want list and, IMO, it's entirely unreasonable to expect people to regularly recheck the list just in case someone has updated the condition of their entries. I will usually submit a blank list rather than try to make a correction (as I have with Granada).

That said, in this case, I agree with Charlie that it's OK - because of the nature of the updates. There were missing descriptions and anyone who was concerned (particularly given my comment in the Geeklist) wouldn't have added the item to their list. Had there been undisclosed issues or misinformation (as there was with my copy of Granada) then I'd have felt that a blank list was warranted - thankfully that isn't the case here.
 
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Scott Halvorson
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OK, I know you are all sitting at your computers waiting for the results of the math trade. I'm closing the want list submissions and getting on with the finishing parts of the trade. Stay tuned for the results....
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Scott Halvorson
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...and the results are in! You may click here to see the list of trades. We had 14.5% of games traded, out of about 800 submitted. Not too bad. You may start contacting your trading partners if you want to arrange your meeting times to trade, or show up at the hotel lobby at 10am on Saturday for the in-person gathering.

Thank you to everybody who participated. And if your games did not trade, you can always submit them to the silent auction, found here. You have until Wednesday afternoon to get them submitted.
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Scott Halvorson
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This is a much easier list of who trades what to whom. Not sure why the names of the games weren't in the list, nor do I know where such large numbers came from. But this view should make more sense.
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