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Subject: Simultaneous reveal of corporations rss

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Martin Tomov
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I am a regular player of the game, and one thing I recently noticed is that I have been playing a simple rule wrong.

According to the rulebook, players reveal corporations in player order, whereas I have been advising players do this simultaneously. What difference does it make, opposed to playing corporations at the same time? It is a pretty minor one and only affects two corporations, one of which is from the corporation promo pack.

So basically, if you own Colonies, there is the Stormcraft corporation, which has a Jovian tag. If there is a player with Stormcraft and a player with Saturn Systems (gain +1 megacredit prodction when a Jovian tag is played). it all comes down to player order on whether Saturn will gain +1 from Stormcraft corporation tag.

There are few similar examples with Splice (corporation promo pack), which I think don't merit the rule of playing corporations in player order. A few tag plays are literally the only difference that such rule makes and therefore I think it is much better for players to just go ahead and play their corporations simultanesouly. It makes for a quicker start and better thematical sense imho.

What do you think?
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RyuSora
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Yes, there is those exceptions (and you also do the turn order for the prelude cards).

The turn order reveal is mostly for standard sake. Everything is tm follows the same pattern and logic and that is great because they can add new stuff and keep the interactions clean and well known.
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H-B-G
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MarTom wrote:
I am a regular player of the game, and one thing I recently noticed is that I have been playing a simple rule wrong.

According to the rulebook, players reveal corporations in player order, whereas I have been advising players do this simultaneously. What difference does it make, opposed to playing corporations at the same time? It is a pretty minor one and only affects two corporations, one of which is from the corporation promo pack.

So basically, if you own Colonies, there is the Stormcraft corporation, which has a Jovian tag. If there is a player with Stormcraft and a player with Saturn Systems (gain +1 megacredit prodction when a Jovian tag is played). it all comes down to player order on whether Saturn will gain +1 from Stormcraft corporation tag.

There are few similar examples with Splice (corporation promo pack), which I think don't merit the rule of playing corporations in player order. A few tag plays are literally the only difference that such rule makes and therefore I think it is much better for players to just go ahead and play their corporations simultanesouly. It makes for a quicker start and better thematical sense imho.

What do you think?


Even if you reveal simultaneously , you still need people to announce to all players which corp they have taken and how many cards they keep (I would want this in a game). That would I think eliminate any time that would be saved.

Also what would you do in the case of those corporations you mention?
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John McComas
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There is a pretty profound effect to turn order reveal if Preludes expansion is in play since corporations and Preludes are resolved in the same timing window.
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H-B-G
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Thecostcutter wrote:
There is a pretty profound effect to turn order reveal if Preludes expansion is in play since corporations and Preludes are resolved in the same timing window.


Preludes have their own window. All corporations are revealed first before any preludes.
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Martin Tomov
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Exactly, my thoughts do not concern prelude cards at all, since those follow a new turn of revealing.

The point of simultaneous reveal is to keep the effects of those corporations consistent, since the corporation you play is basically the main core from which you branch out. To me it makes more thematical sense to announce it at the same time, as in once the World Government announces the terraforming program, several corporations enter the fray. Their specialisations enter the game immediately. Therefore, if Stormcraft and Saturn Systems are both in play, the latter will get to increase their MC production by one.

I think this is a relatively minor case, which would affect games roughly 1 in 100, but still.
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G K
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MarTom wrote:
Exactly, my thoughts do not concern prelude cards at all, since those follow a new turn of revealing.

The point of simultaneous reveal is to keep the effects of those corporations consistent, since the corporation you play is basically the main core from which you branch out. To me it makes more thematical sense to announce it at the same time, as in once the World Government announces the terraforming program, several corporations enter the fray. Their specialisations enter the game immediately. Therefore, if Stormcraft and Saturn Systems are both in play, the latter will get to increase their MC production by one.

I think this is a relatively minor case, which would affect games roughly 1 in 100, but still.


Thematically, it's closer to the companies being founded. Saturn Systems doesn't get an income boost from Jovian tags as part of the WG's terraforming contest, they get it because they're that deeply entwined in the Jupiter/Saturn economy.
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Peter Bakija
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MarTom wrote:
According to the rulebook, players reveal corporations in player order, whereas I have been advising players do this simultaneously. What difference does it make, opposed to playing corporations at the same time?


Yeah, as noted, *most* of the time, it probably doesn't matter. Some of the time, however, it does. As such, you should do it in order (i.e. reveal corps in player order, starting with player 1; then reveal Preludes in player order, starting with player 1).

Saturn Systems and Stormcraft, as you point out, is one of them. The big stitch, however, is if you are using Preludes, at which point, the order in which you reveal Corps (1st, in player order) and then Preludes (2nd, in player order, after corps) is important, due to things like city placement and the possibility of Tharsis, Jovian tags and the possibility of Saturn Systems, and Ecology Experts/Birds and Ecoline (i.e. you play Ecoline, and then later, someone plays Ecology Experts/Birds, and they eat your plant production, and then you are sad/hosed).

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Rikard Johansson
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As someone already noted above, everyone needs to announce what they are playing and how many cards they are keeping anyway so you won't be saving anytime by having everyone "playing" them simultaniously.

Obviously the decision has been made by all players already, you are not allowed to change your choice of corp, cards, or preludes, at this point.
 
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G K
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Hoogard wrote:
As someone already noted above, everyone needs to announce what they are playing and how many cards they are keeping anyway so you won't be saving anytime by having everyone "playing" them simultaniously.

Obviously the decision has been made by all players already, you are not allowed to change your choice of corp, cards, or preludes, at this point.


With experienced players who have any trust for each other, you can wait till everybody's discarded everything then:
- Flip corps simultaneously and quickly announce or glance around. Saturn & Splice can look around to see if any corps playing after them have their tag.
- Flip Preludes in order. If the person to your right doesn't flip one of the eight that requires a decision, don't wait for them to finish bookkeeping. You can announce how many cards you're buying here. If you have one of the eight decision Preludes and it somehow matters how many cards somebody to you left bought, ask them. You do need to make sure Acq. Space Agency & Experimental Forest draw their cards in sequence with other card draws, since they do effect the odds of subsequent draws.

This won't save a lot of time, but hey, every second counts if we're going to get a second game in, and d**n it, you know who was late again.

 
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Rikard Johansson
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Personally i find everyone announcing in sequence their picks goes faster than having them finding out on their own. There's a lot of "what are you playing again?" in the latter case.
 
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Etienne Desilets
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Stormcraft can trigger Saturn System's Effect.

Viron and Recyclon can trigger Splice's.


Those two situations might not happen often, but they still give you a good reason to announce the corporations in order.
 
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Danilo Festa
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MarTom wrote:
I have been advising players do this simultaneously


Always played this way
 
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