Recommend
25 
 Thumb up
 Hide
55 Posts
1 , 2 , 3  Next »   | 

On Mars» Forums » Crowdfunding

Subject: Any one else finding the stretch goals a bit... silly? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Kristoffer Fredriksson
Sweden
flag msg tools
badge
Omnomnom
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I can't even pretend to be excited.

The likelihood of them releasing the game with all but the rover silkscreened must be close enough to zero that you'd need a microscope to tell the difference.

Plus the fact that they've been showing off silkscreen designs in the images section for a long while now.

I'd like it better if they were up front and said that they'd designed the ultimate package and that that was what they'll be releasing. No stretch goals, just perfection.

Am I am old bore?
83 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
David Mcgamin

Arizona
msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
But wait! There's more!

Act now and for the same low price you get not one, not two but three copies of On Mars!!

Yes, Kickstarter has a bit of an infomercial feel to it with all the "unlocked" stretch goals. But hey, that's how it is these days, without them people don't get the rush of joining a campaign full of "extras."
7 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
juri peters
Netherlands
flag msg tools
Agree, this feels very artificial. Even an announcement for future product as a strechgoal... Don't get me wrong. This is an instant back project for me because of the pedigree of Vital and I will most probably be very pleased with the final production referencing EGG past productions. But I would like less more vaulable strechgoals, so we get the feeling we actually work to something, instead of 'unlocking' small components that were already shown off.
16 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
jusstin hewelt
United States
Texas
flag msg tools
I think it’s likely that you hit custom meeples at the first stretch goal, and they’re just drawing you out until you hit enough copies to drop the price and fund the bigger ones. Reduced printing costs are in the thousands, typically 1,3,5k etc. They still need to hype you until you get to the next 2kish mark.
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Phil Triest
Australia
Sydney
NSW
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
DC680 wrote:
But wait! There's more!

Act now and for the same low price you get not one, not two but three copies of On Mars!!

Yes, Kickstarter has a bit of an infomercial feel to it with all the "unlocked" stretch goals. But hey, that's how it is these days, without them people don't get the rush of joining a campaign full of "extras."


Group buys make the game much cheaper to purchase. Is saving me plenty on rrp and shipping... surprised you've never done it before...
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Andrii Krokhmalnyi
Ukraine
Lviv
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Yeah, they are silly. The component list on the campaign page looks artificial with cardboard tokens.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rico Melchert
Sweden
Karlskoga
Sverige
flag msg tools
http://www.Spelpojken.se
badge
Proud member of EoN: Everything or Nothing a game group of friends.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Agreed. On all points.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Sam Lee
Malaysia
Kuala Lumpur
Federal Territory of Kuala Lumpur
flag msg tools
mb
OhSoCasual wrote:
I can't even pretend to be excited.

The likelihood of them releasing the game with all but the rover silkscreened must be close enough to zero that you'd need a microscope to tell the difference.

Plus the fact that they've been showing off silkscreen designs in the images section for a long while now.

I'd like it better if they were up front and said that they'd designed the ultimate package and that that was what they'll be releasing. No stretch goals, just perfection.

Am I am old bore?


With estimated delivery date of Oct 2019 (that’s few months away), I believed EGG/ Vital has taken a conscious decision to have minimum alteration to meet timeline. Looking at past EGG/ Vital past projects, feedbacks have been very good especially on the production value.

Let’s take 2 cases I have heard so far:

For Tang Garden, there are a lot of SG unlock (45 plus if you refer to Kickstarter). However, this significantly affects the production and delay the overall delivery date. The earlier promised date is Jan 2019 and it’s still undelivered as at today.

Reference: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/gonab/tang-garden/descr...

Let’s look at Unbroken. Based on the FB Group, there is significant cost overrun and the producer did not anticipate this based on the SG unlocks. In the end, they have to issue email to charge additional cost to the backers rather than absorbing the costs. You can follow the comments section.

Reference: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1227872561/unbroken-a-s...

Personally, I dislike publisher that create FOMO with their projects especially with SG unlocks/ Kickstarter exclusives. For On Mars, most of these are just nice-to-have additions which I am fine with. My only concern is that the expansion which is announced too soon.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Marco Herreras
Spain
flag msg tools
badge
NO QUEDAN PINGÜINOZ
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
OhSoCasual wrote:
I can't even pretend to be excited.

The likelihood of them releasing the game with all but the rover silkscreened must be close enough to zero that you'd need a microscope to tell the difference.

Plus the fact that they've been showing off silkscreen designs in the images section for a long while now.

I'd like it better if they were up front and said that they'd designed the ultimate package and that that was what they'll be releasing. No stretch goals, just perfection.

Am I am old bore?


If you look at the recent Age of Steam campaign, it had the same structure and feeling: few SGs (at least when compared to other similar campaign in pedigree and success, say Brass Deluxe) and tied to the number of backers, not to the amount pledged.

I'm not saying it might be related, but a similar trend is to be seen in CMON since Zombicide Invader: SHORTER campaigns, wider gaps between SGs and SGs slightly skewed to social goals and backers, not to the plain old funding amount.

Don't want to sound bitter, but this to me looks like a general trend: as if the very top deciding people (Board of Directors, Pension Funds behind the CEO, whatever) had noticed that the old trend of more SGs and longer campaigns (23+ days vs 13-16) triggering more funds somehow translates into less EBITDA margin... So, from now on, less SGs, wider gaps, shorter campaigns, even if it apparently looks like shooting their feet, it surely means more profit.

I know several people would say they just want the game funded, that is the target of KS etc, whereas other clique would say just wait for retail.
I agree with both visions, but let me state the case for Spain: several KS campaigns never make retail here, and if they do, all the SGs unlocked, be they exclusive or not, usually make it worth the extra steep cost of shipping vs waiting for retail. Not to mention it is not obvious to have the original version at retail, and I don't want translations (assuming they are professionally made, which is not always the case), as they go against all my lifetime investment into learning English/French.

Sorry for the overlong answer.

TLDR, the SG issue is an important variable in my decision to back a KS or not.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Graham
United Kingdom
London
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mb
OhSoCasual wrote:
I can't even pretend to be excited.

The likelihood of them releasing the game with all but the rover silkscreened must be close enough to zero that you'd need a microscope to tell the difference.

Plus the fact that they've been showing off silkscreen designs in the images section for a long while now.

I'd like it better if they were up front and said that they'd designed the ultimate package and that that was what they'll be releasing. No stretch goals, just perfection.

Am I am old bore?


EGG is a business. A key facet of successful business is effective marketing and communication (and a smart KS campaign is all part of that mix in this case). None of us as are immune to it although most of us are savvy enough to know when we succumb to it. But if the product is good enough and the brand strong enough, the figures will speak for themselves. And in this case they have. We all know the stretch goals are fluff disguised as additional value for money and that they have been baked into the product from the start, but we also know that only economy of scale enable EGG to produce the premium boxes they do. So armed with the knowldge of pedigree, we buy. These are luxury consumer goods, without KS they wouldn’t exist. Just enjoy the ride even though you’re aware you’re falling for the oldest tricks in he book...
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
A I
Netherlands
flag msg tools
I'm very excited about this game. I love Vital Lacerda games and equally love the quality of EGG produced games. Just setting up Lisboa or the Gallerist brings a smile to my face.

But I'm new to Kickstarter and am just amazed at the process... In general, we show half our game, then the biggest kindergarten class in the world jumps up, all fingers in the air going me, me, me, me, and then we slowly throw them a few sweets and within two seconds of the last sweet being eaten.... are we going home now..(as in has my game shipped yet).
Amazing theatre!

I wish Eagle Gryphon would have the courage to just say this is our game, yes it's pricey, but it's made by a great designer and a great artist, produced to the highest standard, that's it. And then they can even sell me the tray that holds the hexes as an addon. 2 clicks and I don't have to look at it again till October.

So I agree this is really silly, those cardboard chits representing the rover and robot really look like someone realised Wednesday night 12 o'clock damn.... we've taken the meeples out of the box, where are my crayons
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
ozgur ozubek
Turkey
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
let silly stretch goals be the only silly part in this beautiful KS campaign.

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Frank Calcagno
United States
Virginia
flag msg tools
designer
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Yeah, but it's the typical KS dog and pony show that generates hype and activity, which is hard to blame them for doing (otherwise, campaigns simply turn into a 5-day preorder system). I will appreciate wooden/screened meeples, but we all did expect them, so not surprises there. If they reveal dual layer for portions of game board overlays, or other things yet to be revealed, then genuine excitement will be generated.
The big disappointment from my perspective is "utilizing an SG spot" for a paid "add on" (the coop mode announcement). I do take exception when a creator "takes up space" for what "backers earned by their own efforts" to allow us to purchase something for more money. They should have just called it an add on for the future and not "given it to us because we worked so hard to achieve it." That does leave a very sour aftertaste, and I've pulled away from some campaigns for them having done so. (It's comparable to winning a race competition, standing up for the award and they announce. "Great job! For your efforts, you can register now and pay for next year's competition." I had not realized we were the marketing arm for the manufacturer...
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Aaron L.
United States
Belleville
Illinois
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
The comment about cost overruns and stretch goals is valid. Lacerda's last game, Escape Plan, delivered early. You don't hear that about most crowdfunded games with stretch goals. It didn't need tons of crazy extras. The production value from EGG has generally been very high in my opinion.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alliantie AJ
Belgium
Rijkevorsel
België
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
These stretchgoals were for the most easy to predict; in previous kickstarters they used similar upgrades, which are great. But indead, it's artificial.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Kristoffer Fredriksson
Sweden
flag msg tools
badge
Omnomnom
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Just to clarify, I'm not complaining about silkscreen meeples, it's the aforementioned artificiality of the stretch goals that I find borderline condescending.

Also, I backed the game with no reservations. I'm super excited about it.

Would just prefer a more honest approach.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mark O'Reilly
United Kingdom
Chester
Cheshire
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
With these stretch goals they should have started with the game in a zip-lock bag and we have to work up to a box back first and sweat it out to get the front. Those tokens without silk screaning ( or a sticker) would be ridiculous.
The game and presentation look fantastic.
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Kristoffer Fredriksson
Sweden
flag msg tools
badge
Omnomnom
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I bet the silkscreen rover goal won't be reached and then EGG will cure this thread as a reason for not throwing it in as a freebie and then I will never get that Geek of the Week award...
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
A G
Italy
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I am not impress at all about these SG, I found them very poor. Is a plastic tray already included as base? Hope so. Just looking back on a previous Lacerda's campaign for Lisboa, the goal was 50k now is 200k. Understand was 2 years ago project but for sure the price of components China made would not be that pricy....about the announcement for the expansion....meh, very business deal to get more money
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Danielle Goldman
United States
Lake Oswego
Oregon
flag msg tools
mbmbmb
There's absolutely nothing exciting about them at all, but then stretch goals always feel this way. This is just the most blatant.

I think linking it to backer count instead of money is just... bizarre. Removes any incentive for us to stretch our wallets to help push the project through, which was sorta the original intent of stretch goals I thought. I guess we should make bot accounts and pledge $1 to push through to get the silk screened meeples they clearly intended to produce from the get go?

Super, super, super excited about On Mars and I happily backed it, but the stretch goals are far too transparently meaningless. I'm curious to see if there's going to be a single one worth feeling excited about.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
BG.EXE
United States
flag msg tools
I favor Euros, but I like pretty much all games.
badge
Make the kinds of posts you want to read.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
This isn’t your typical KS game where they’ve taken all the stuff you need to actually play the game out, and the base package is 4 minis and a quarter of a mission. They didn’t hide the actual game behind fake stretch goals designed to lure hungry consumers into buying. The base package is the real deal. Hence the stretch goals are a bit minor.

That said, stretch goals are always a marketing illusion.

Kickstarter rule 2 for me: buy for the base package, ignore stretch goals. They’re an illusion anyway, simply there to appease the people who need to be “excited” about a campaign at every minute.
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Sean S
Luxembourg
flag msg tools
boardgamesdotEXE wrote:

Kickstarter rule 2 for me: buy for the base package, ignore stretch goals. They’re an illusion anyway, simply there to appease the people who need to be “excited” about a campaign at every minute.


What's rule number 1?
2 
 Thumb up
0.01
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
BG.EXE
United States
flag msg tools
I favor Euros, but I like pretty much all games.
badge
Make the kinds of posts you want to read.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
ibjew wrote:
boardgamesdotEXE wrote:

Kickstarter rule 2 for me: buy for the base package, ignore stretch goals. They’re an illusion anyway, simply there to appease the people who need to be “excited” about a campaign at every minute.


What's rule number 1?

My 3 rules:

1) Don’t back a game just for the miniatures. I have to like the gameplay, even if it had wood cubes. Don’t get me wrong, I like minis, but it can’t be the only reason I’m interested in a game.

2) Don’t back just for stretch goals. Same deal more or less.

3) Don’t put in money I can’t afford to not see a product from. I’m careful with what I back and have yet to have a project that didn’t deliver, but the horror stories exist. Kickstarter always has some risk.

Maybe I should just have 2 rules back for the base product gameplay and then rule 3 becomes rule 2.
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tiffany Leigh
United States
New York
NY
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
boardgamesdotEXE wrote:
ibjew wrote:
boardgamesdotEXE wrote:

Kickstarter rule 2 for me: buy for the base package, ignore stretch goals. They’re an illusion anyway, simply there to appease the people who need to be “excited” about a campaign at every minute.


What's rule number 1?

My 3 rules:

1) Don’t back a game just for the miniatures.


Games that mete out one mini at a time among their dozens of stretch goals feels more "artificial," but that tactic will always draw in more backers who don't mind being slow-played this way, because minis.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
BG.EXE
United States
flag msg tools
I favor Euros, but I like pretty much all games.
badge
Make the kinds of posts you want to read.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Oh absolutely. But I don’t want to receive a pile of plastic with a bad game under it, so that’s my personal rule and something I recommend when asked. But yeah, Kickstarter gonna Kickstarter, so Mini Mountain is always a good selling tactic.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2 , 3  Next »   | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.