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Kingdom Death: Monster» Forums » General

Subject: Ive just beaten Gold Smoke Knight with no clothes on rss

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Jon Strike
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Well, not me naked, 3 of my survivors .

Just dropping in to make sure it seems kosher, ive left it all set up for now in case i need a rematch, but the whole thing underwhelmingly easy but then I'm sure I had some pretty nuts survivors. All vanilla campaign.

I wont go into details except where it would explain how I did it. My four survivors looped on ly 20 on a previous camapaign and survived all the way through. They had immortality and 600+ins, using shared experience I kept them shielded from murder, rerolls from other settlement events. strengths varied from 7-14, I had axe, shield, whip, sword. grand, spear, bow and f+t masteries. Also had the perfect slayer and legendary lungs on the grand weapon master and bow master (phoenix bow). Evasion was pretty much at 10's to hit, to get them all to that level I decided to for-go armour for the utilities and bandages/dried acanthus/ affinity unlocks turns out i didnt need armour. 2 guys had 6 movement btw-negate blacken knockback.

Fight was pretty bog standard, immortal soaked all the hits, I only saw a few AI cards, maybe 6total so i may have got exptremely lucky, one lass did die as she lost immortal to the pheonix on ly22 hunt...which leads to one question I do have...

The Cinder Sundering ai card....it killed that survivor...i went with the worst ruling.

The example in the book says it does 6 damage to 1 location wearing metal, but the card says 'All survivors in the ash zone with metal gear suffer bash and 1 hit for 6 damage to each location'.

That seems to contradict, I can see it one of two ways

1-1 hit-you block 1 hit-no damage
2-1 hit to 5 locations, you have to block them all

I went with number 2, but if it is number 1 then the oxidised beacon shield is AMAZING!


Thanks for sticking this out and helping, was a beautiful moment to pull Mournful Mask as the last hit location card
 
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Greysbull
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"Ive just beaten Gold Smoke Knight with no clothes on"

That's how I play all my solo games.
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"1 hit of 6 damage to each hit location"

Yeah I guess, this one could be interpreted in different ways and seems to go bit into the intricacies of English language (which I'm not qualified to go into).

However I would sternly lean towards 5 hits total because the general mechanic of hits is:
"Damage from a single hit is applied to a single hit location." (pg.70)
Therefore, for Cinder Sundering to apply damage to each hit location, it needs to cause multiple hits.

So far a hit that causes damage to multiple hit locations does not exist but if it does in the future, the rules will then and there tell you that it's a new mechanic and this is how it works. Just like the GSK showdown introduced hits outside of attack profiles.
 
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On a separate note, I'd be curious to hear what mechanics you "abused" to get your survivors to where they were.
Did I understand correctly that you had Immortality and 600+ insanity on ALL 4 survivors?
 
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Jon Strike
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For most of the time, my heavy hitters did all have immortal, but I went into the fight with only 3. The white lions ground fighting will give you pause to boost insanity. Getting immortal is easy when you have lucky bone eater/muders, control the event's via re rolls. Actually got immortal via some story event too after I lost it another time.

Looping is done via phoenix, just takes a long time to get back to where you were. My settlement was doomed first time around...really really bad rolls. Think I had 6 survivors and took the four best with me-all with ageless.

Not sure what your point is with 'abused', it's all right there in the mechanics of the game if you know what you're doing and got the smarts to mitigate/avoid/manipulate/encourage.
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Jon Strike
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Not to mention the way it's legal to control the hl deck with a crest crown and cat eye circlet looking for the death blows (weapon proficiency boosts)
 
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jstriker wrote:
Not sure what your point is with 'abused', it's all right there in the mechanics of the game if you know what you're doing and got the smarts to mitigate/avoid/manipulate/encourage.

Well, if you take advantage of Ground Fighting, the Screaming Helm (?), and the Lantern Helm to generate infinite insanity for a survivor, you're basically "abusing" those mechanics. It's not a judgment call (as in, "you shouldn't do that!") so much as it's acknowledging that you took something to the min-max extreme and / or used a mechanic in a way the devs probably ddn't foresee, thereby "breaking" the intended experience.

I have abused the hell out of easy breeding in PotSun and SotF lifetime rerolls in order to generate Warriors of the Sun with 6+ base evasion. Nothing wrong with that - it's built into the game - but I've certainly min-maxed the hell out of that part of the equation.
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jstriker wrote:
For most of the time, my heavy hitters did all have immortal, but I went into the fight with only 3. The white lions ground fighting will give you pause to boost insanity. Getting immortal is easy when you have lucky bone eater/muders, control the event's via re rolls. Actually got immortal via some story event too after I lost it another time.

Looping is done via phoenix, just takes a long time to get back to where you were. My settlement was doomed first time around...really really bad rolls. Think I had 6 survivors and took the four best with me-all with ageless.

Not sure what your point is with 'abused', it's all right there in the mechanics of the game if you know what you're doing and got the smarts to mitigate/avoid/manipulate/encourage.

Yeah I'm familiar with most of the mechanics, was just curious about the specifics, people have such various play styles (which is why some people find the game easy and some extremely hard). And I do find it interesting to so determinedly aim towards Immortal, and because I don't aim for it personally maybe I've been a bit blind to all the events that dish it out.

Ok, maybe "abuse" was a bit too harsh, "exploit"? Either way I meant no harm and wasn't insinuating you were breaking the rules or anything. While the infinite loops are more or less an intentional part of the game I just personally find using them to my advantage as "cheesy" tactics and choose to not partake in them, that's all.
 
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Peter S.
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Isn't there a thing where survivors with too much insanity run off into the dark, never to be seen again? Or is that specific to a particular monster or encounter?
 
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Jon Strike
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Well I didn't hunt for it and it was a fun discovery, which I took advantage of. It was also a Ballache keeping those survivors alive. Next time I play it I certainly won't. Never knew if gsk would reduce insanity to zero, would have been so easy and I don't buy the loopholes idea, they were there in 1.3. Perfect slayer, pty+graves, sotf rr+paint and time loops are abusive too(heck my first play I got to the watcher with pty and no clever shenanigans-just playing a smart game). The mechanic is there. But like I said I wont be doing it again, it was more management fun than action fun and it was a risk not using armour. In retrospect and in all honesty it was incredibly cheesy. Furthermore if I played again I doubt I would get immortal on four. I beat the game with the game and it feels good. Thanks for the clarification, it did come across as judgemental given I didn't 'aim'for it, it got my heckles up but no worries.
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Jon Strike
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Peter S. It's the screaming antelope that does that, I missed it a lot.
 
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There are certainly a myriad of mechanics and synergies ready to be exploited in the game, 100% agree. And there is no point in making their use into a moral question. As long as you're having fun, it's the right thing to do. And it's definitely fun experimenting with them and seeing if you can pull something off.

Just typically when you do pull off something crazy, the appeal tends to fade as they suck out the risk and fun from the game (as you noticed). Which is why I personally no longer bother with the CW Axe and will probably rule very strictly with Face Painting in the future. Also crit farming the SA via Chow Down, while useful, it also makes for one long and boring session. shake

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Fen Batten
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jstriker wrote:
Not sure what your point is with 'abused', it's all right there in the mechanics of the game if you know what you're doing and got the smarts to mitigate/avoid/manipulate/encourage.

Abused is a term used in the Kingdom Death community to recognise the situations arise when the rules used as designed can create degenerate scenarios that the game cannot challenge.

You can intentionally abuse and unintentionally abuse. There's no stigma involved in it. If you want to use Gorm + Hiccup + Monster Controller to gain 5 billion insanity on each of your immortal survivors, you can. And it's fun to do it once, but the game loses a lot of its challenge after the initial 'ah you can do this' and that's why they're categorised as abuse.

Other examples of abuse are:
- Gloom Man
- Counterweighted Axe + Timeless Eye + Bone Witch -accuracy (with optional ways of gaining more speed)
- Red Ring
- The aforementioned Screaming Helm + Deaf insanity gain exploit*
- Most things involving the Flower Knight
- The Great City exponential population combos
- Deja Vu/Clinging Mist loops
- Butcher infinite insanity loops*
- Murderbaiting Saviors

As mentioned before, there's no stigma to abusing at all because the very nature of the game and its complex moving parts means that at one point or another you're going to stumble onto one and it's natural to want to push it to its extreme and see what happens.


*Abuse happens a lot with Insanity, there are so many benefits to high insanity, it has no upper limit and there are multiple ways to do it.
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Alessio Massuoli
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fenpaints wrote:

- The Great City exponential population combos


Further exasperated by the new promo resource in the Easter Twilight Knight. Infinite Movement on everyone yay!

(Btw, I really do think that "Promo" on these cards should be taken very seriously).
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Fen Batten
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t3clis wrote:
fenpaints wrote:

- The Great City exponential population combos


Further exasperated by the new promo resource in the Easter Twilight Knight. Infinite Movement on everyone yay!

(Btw, I really do think that "Promo" on these cards should be taken very seriously).

I agree, the Lump of Atnas passive + my usual population boom methods was already causing my latest settlement's population to get out of control (and that's without considering technically each cube triggers when the 5+ amount is reached because it doesn't say 'limit once per year' - I'm not doing that but).
 
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Comboteur "Crazed 'Beastface' Survivor" Fou
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t3clis wrote:
fenpaints wrote:

- The Great City exponential population combos


Further exasperated by the new promo resource in the Easter Twilight Knight. Infinite Movement on everyone yay!

(Btw, I really do think that "Promo" on these cards should be taken very seriously).


What, the rabid bunny?
 
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Alessio Massuoli
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Yeah, very tematic (it replicates without control in storage), but easily exploitable: on a 6+ you get an unchecked +1 Movement. With a few rerolls, you can get extreme movement buffs.
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Comboteur "Crazed 'Beastface' Survivor" Fou
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t3clis wrote:
Yeah, very tematic (it replicates without control in storage), but easily exploitable: on a 6+ you get an unchecked +1 Movement. With a few rerolls, you can get extreme movement buffs.


It is indeed very thematic, forced me to purchase the mini again though I have it already cry

I'm sure I'll never figure out how to exploit it though I'm still dying to level 2 gorms on LY 15 after all
 
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Kyle A
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Can someone please explain murderbaiting saviors?
 
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Alessio Massuoli
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I think it is a bit OT, but it is simple:
a Savior accumulates hunt XP easily if you use his advantages, and because of this, you will never use it to get long-term stuff like a Mastery.

So, if you have a Savior, you abuse him to get him on the brink of getting out of existence, and he will (possibly) be the highest XP guy in the settlement (barring the unfortunate, retired souls).

That one will be the next Murder victim, automatically keeping your master-in-training safe in the process.
 
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Kyle A
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t3clis wrote:
I think it is a bit OT, but it is simple:
a Savior accumulates hunt XP easily if you use his advantages, and because of this, you will never use it to get long-term stuff like a Mastery.

So, if you have a Savior, you abuse him to get him on the brink of getting out of existence, and he will (possibly) be the highest XP guy in the settlement (barring the unfortunate, retired souls).

That one will be the next Murder victim, automatically keeping your master-in-training safe in the process.


Ok thanks. I don’t consider that abuse, but I admit that is something I do
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Ira Deorum
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HAHA
 
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David Marienburg
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ErsatzDragon wrote:
Isn't there a thing where survivors with too much insanity run off into the dark, never to be seen again? Or is that specific to a particular monster or encounter?


That happens when you defeat a screaming antelope and have a survivor with 20+ insanity.

edit: added quote for context
 
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Kristabelle Du Bast
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Razoupaf wrote:
t3clis wrote:
fenpaints wrote:

- The Great City exponential population combos


Further exasperated by the new promo resource in the Easter Twilight Knight. Infinite Movement on everyone yay!

(Btw, I really do think that "Promo" on these cards should be taken very seriously).


What, the rabid bunny?

Shame it's a pinup.
 
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