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Subject: Which would you prefer? rss

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Ricatoni
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I would go for B or C. I am reminded of the battle for Stalingrad and the room to room fighting that the Russians mastered...especially in the grain silo. They made the Germans pay for every room then would jump down a floor to make them fight for a floor they had already cleared. It was frustrating as hell, drove the Germans nuts, and ran the Russians down to the last man as they held off the opposition for weeks with their tactics and an undersized force.

If you are going for urban fighting, reading up on this chapter of war will give you tons of material. Basically the Russians wrote the book on urban warfare.

In a police vs. thugs actions I am supposing that the thugs will be holed up in a building so some exterior details are necessary, with greater details for points of insertion and interiors. I cannot envision police fighting for blocks of an urban center but I can envision terrorists holed up in a larger building.
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Joe Ritter
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you could borrow from CounterStrike (scenarios) and M44/RoboRally (mechanics) you could do multiple double-sided boards (a la Roborally) each with a different scenario (per your examples, high detail interior, some low detail buildings with high detail external. etc.). or you could go the M44 route and have a generic board, but provide multiple tile set-ups to create the "board" based on the scenario - just a thought.
 
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Devon Harmon
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I vote for B.
 
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Mike Ricotta
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I would vote for c only because I haven't seen much else like that...that I can think of at least. A lot also depends on how detailed the game is, sure, that Cowboys: Way of the Gun game had interiors and exteriors, but it was so simple it didn't matter much, it just turned out to be a ho-hum game..
 
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Gregory Amstutz
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El Hidalgo wrote:
I would go for B or C. I am reminded of the battle for Stalingrad and the room to room fighting that the Russians mastered...especially in the grain silo. They made the Germans pay for every room then would jump down a floor to make them fight for a floor they had already cleared. It was frustrating as hell, drove the Germans nuts, and ran the Russians down to the last man as they held off the opposition for weeks with their tactics and an undersized force.

If you are going for urban fighting, reading up on this chapter of war will give you tons of material. Basically the Russians wrote the book on urban warfare.

In a police vs. thugs actions I am supposing that the thugs will be holed up in a building so some exterior details are necessary, with greater details for points of insertion and interiors. I cannot envision police fighting for blocks of an urban center but I can envision terrorists holed up in a larger building.


I agree with the above. A whole neighborhood just seems too big a scale for what you're describing.
 
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Ricatoni
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Exactly why I mention the grain silo in Stalingrad...it was all small weapons....no tanks or bazookas.

So I am a bit confused. If what you suggest is a thugs or terrorist action with a retaliatory force of police...I would expect at least some weapons that would take out vehicles...LAWs or RPGs, espcially if it is an exterior action.

What you are describing is a small business area with perps in multiple buildings. In some ways that makes sense...but any isolated defensive action is just avoiding the inevitable if no reinforcements are expected to arrive.

So as a terrorist what would the advantage be to spreading myself out over an entire block? Here we have to be mindful of what Sun Tzu said...if you are strong everywhere...you are weak everywhere. A possibility would be a collapsing defensive perimeter all converging on a given building...then we are back at the scenario described in the grain silo at Stalingrad. Ultimately, small weapons in confined spaces.

For thugs there is little to no motivation here that I could dream of if you are just drawing out the inevitable.

For terrorists, maximizing damage to a police force would involve a collapsing perimeter converging on a multiple storied building that could be defended over a long period of time. Or if they were spread out as you have envisioned it would work somewhat like Bastogne, even though that was an entire town. Here the Police would probe the perimeter and the perps would have a main force and a highly mobile reserve reacting to other probes.

Whether calling it a small action, or not it is still urban warfare and the tactics are the same. The Russians wrote the book on it. Their action in the grain silo involved a lot of hand to hand and face to face over the course of two weeks. The tactics used by modern and police forces and anti-terrorist units involve heavy analysis and extrapolation of what the Russians did in Stalingrad. The Germans stopped bombing Stalingrad because it just dug the Russians in further. Many of them went underground...yet another dimension for consideration.

So a block of buildings that are already rubble? That changes the proposition somewhat but Russian tactics still surface in the rubble as well. For that I would study the street fighting and the fight for the factories. Either way Stalingrad is a rich background resource for what you are proposing. I would go with terrorists instead of thugs because of the "doom" factor in a defense involving unreinforced attrition. I expect the terrorists would know their chosen ground very well...and be ready to die for their cause.

My God the thought of it all just made me "Shudder!"
 
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Ricatoni
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mbourgeois wrote:

I think that perhaps too much is being read into an interaction between the good guys and bad guys.


LOL
Yeah! That would be a problem with a simple post for a cops and robbers in a wargaming venue

Still, all police in urban actions have learned from Stalingrad. That is the grandaddy of them all in choosing cover/ground, emerging from cover, mobility and fire, etc. So your police would engage with SOP in an urban action.

The images I generated for terrorist action could be unnerving. Your proposal reminds me of LA in the riots...or a ride through Compton at night.

Good luck! I still go for B or C.
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Alpha Mastrano
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B sounds good, but C sounds awesome, like a Rainbow Six boardgame!
 
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Brad Wagnon
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Scenario 122 The Pro Football Retiree Murder Suspect incident! (Names have been changed to protect the innocent)

Police pursue in 47 squad cars.

Reitred player, who is popularly know as DJ and Driver in White Bronco.

First part of the game takes place only on highway, and movement of the vehicles would be more of a "relative distance" adjustment.

Scenario 123 Fear and Loathsome in Las Vegas

"DJ" and his posse enter a hotel room and try to shake down some "honest" sports memoribillia dealers. Hard to say who the bad guys are in this situation....

Have fun with these ideas!











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Skip Franklin
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I vote for A. With a small neighbourhood or small town you could give a car chase followed by a foot race then have them hole up in a house or business then the shoot-out. Try using something like The Creature That Ate Sheboygan as a start for a game system.

mbourgeois wrote:

a) exterior of a small neighbourhood no interiors just the shells of buildings.
 
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Jesse Escobedo
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I would imagine you could turn this into a coop game with room tiles similar to Betrayal at House on the Hill. Instead of Haunts, you would have scenarios which decide which tiles are used and which tiles have special effects. If it weren't copyrighted, the LOS system from Tannhauser would be awesome for this.

Jesse
 
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