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Subject: Help w/ Werewolf rules w/ no eliminations and less players rss

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Wayne Burg
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I've been reading the rules to Werewolf, but there is one thing I'd like to change about the game for my own gaming group. I don't like games that eliminate people from the game. They literally are left out and then end up going off to do something else. This can end a night of gaming after just one round of Werewolf. Is there a way of altering the game so no one is eliminated from play? I read there was a variant where, instead of dying by the hands of the wolves, villagers were turned into werewolves, allowing them to continue playing. However, this doesn't do anything about the werewolves and other villagers that are lynched in the daytime cycles. Anyone want to help?

I'm also trying to find a variant that allows the game to be played with less than 8 players. Something like 5 would be good. Never know how often I can get 8 or more players together at one time.

Thanks
 
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Jim Cote
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
Check out The Castle of the Devil or Lifeboat for games with some similarity where everyone plays the entire game.
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JessA
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
If you haven't played werewolf yet, I find that getting eliminated isn't as bad as in some games because it's so fun to watch when you are "in the know". Plus, games go pretty fast, so you're not out for long and revenge is sweet!

You might want to check out Saboteur. It reminds me of werewolf, but no one is eliminated.

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J. Green
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
How about a game called "Invasion of the Body Snatchers" in which instead of becoming werewolves, every morning a new person is replaced with an exact copy of themselves that is actually an alien, and you have to figure out who is who without arousing the suspicion of the aliens or else become their next target.

At night, the alien(s) choose a victim with eyes closed. Then, the next day, everyone carries on conversations, talks to each other as normal, trying to detect anything unusual about their behavior. There could be a rule about a characteristic that distinguishes aliens, such as their fear of water, and any "alien" would have to pretend they were really afraid of water and thus become reluctant to talk about anything water related, but if you ask too many questions and get too pushy, the aliens will realize you are onto them and thus you'll become their next target, so you have to be indirect.

Another similar game that is web published but untested is Alien Abduction, at this link:

http://www.invisible-city.com/play/52/alien-abduction
 
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Wayne Burg
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
I'm liking Saboteur. Thanks for suggesting it.
 
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Dave Chalker
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
We created Covert Action specifically to be like Werewolf without elimination. Same with Criminals, though we're hoping it gets a full publication from a larger game company.
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Jack Reda
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
I have some roles created for Werewolf that count on people not being completely out of the game. I don't know if it will work with your group (it depends on how many are playing, and what other roles are involved)... too many special roles can bog things down.

Ghost: If killed by the Werewolves, he continues to vote with the Villagers, but can't participate in discussions. If lynched by Villagers, he can open his eyes at night with the Werewolves and point to people he thinks should be killed (Seer, other important Villagers).

Medium: If she is in the game, the Villagers can vote for a seance during the day. If the Medium votes for it too, and there's a majority, one of the dead players may be questioned. In these games, the dead still close their eyes, but they can have opinions or vital info (if the Seer is dead, for example). The Medium reveals her role when the vote is successful, and does the questioning. Alternately, you can keep the role secret and all the living can question the dead player.

Vampires and Zombies... if you have these roles in, Villagers killed by Vampires and Zombies become them, and join in at night, choosing their own victims. This adds a lot of interaction to the game, and generally requires a few other roles that counter-balance them. If you want all the details, mail me, and I can send you a spreadsheet that details ALL the roles in my set.

Jack
 
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Todd McCorkle
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
Hopefully this isn't too unhelpfully vague...

I watched a group of people playing a version of werewolf called 'thing' I believe. What I remember is that at night the things would pick someone and they would become a thing. During the day, everyone had 2 tests/shots/taking samples of other players. If the test successfully gets a thing, the thing becomes a person (scientist?) again and the group gets an additional test.

I'm not sure how to win the game. I assume it's similar to normal werewolf where the scientists win if they eliminate/convert all of the things and the things win if they outnumber the scientists.

I could easily be missing some rules since I wasn't playing and don't know all of the specifics. Hopefully some searching could fix that. I think this may be what you're looking for though.
 
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Wayne Burg
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
I like the what I'm reading about that Covert Action game. Thanks for the tip.
 
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Wayne Burg
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
Todd, Is this game The Thing what you are talking about? If so the last rule listed seems to indicate that people are actually removed from play. Otherwise, the game does seem to come close to what I'm looking for.
 
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Warren Forrest
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
Wayneburg wrote:
They literally are left out and then end up going off to do something else.

This has never happened in any of the occasions I've played it.

For example, at this year's SCA Clinton War our camp had a bonfire going and people - some friends, some complete strangers, some sober, some not so sober - were coming and going all night for about 11 hours (!) straight playing Werewolf. But in virtually every case the people who were leaving still waited until the end of the round to do so because they wanted to see the end.

Quote:
This can end a night of gaming after just one round of Werewolf.

Our game finally ended at 6am, roughly 3 hours after the rest of the 2,000 or so people in the encampment had gone to bed. Since the event is held in the middle of nowhere with no electricity we were basically acting as beacon of light and laughter for people to flock to.
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Wayne Burg
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
W4st wrote:
Wayneburg wrote:
They literally are left out and then end up going off to do something else.

This has never happened in any of the occasions I've played it.

For example, at this year's SCA Clinton War our camp had a bonfire going and people - some friends, some complete strangers, some sober, some not so sober - were coming and going all night for about 11 hours (!) straight playing Werewolf. But in virtually every case the people who were leaving still waited until the end of the round to do so because they wanted to see the end.

Quote:
This can end a night of gaming after just one round of Werewolf.

Our game finally ended at 6am, roughly 3 hours after the rest of the 2,000 or so people in the encampment had gone to bed. Since the event is held in the middle of nowhere with no electricity we were basically acting as beacon of light and laughter for people to flock to.


Niiiice. That's exactly what I want... addictive fun.
 
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Rishi A.
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
A lot of times Werewolf is more fun to watch than to play. I don't think that player elimination is as much of a problem as you think. I would recommend playing it with player elimination the first time you play. If people don't seem to be enjoying it, then try to have variations ready that don't eliminate players.
 
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Dick Ruck
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
Jatoha wrote:
If you haven't played werewolf yet, I find that getting eliminated isn't as bad as in some games because it's so fun to watch when you are "in the know".

I'd reinforce this and add that being knocked out is the only time that you are certain about other players' roles. Then is the time to sit back and note how the others play, watching their body language and gestures, especially when they are 'being economical with the truth'. Assimilate knowledge about their style - it will come in useful in later rounds...

 
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Wayne Burg
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Re: Help with rules to Werewolf where no one is elimanted
Yes I'll definitely try out Werewolf before trying any variants.

The other thing I don't like Werewolf is the minimum number of players needed. 8 is pretty high.

Any ideas on bringing the number of players down?
 
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A few friends play 5-player werewolf but it is sort of an 'all-star' version as they have all played a few hundred times. If newer players play in smaller games it may be sort of a coin toss and/or the game is over before it really gets started. Again, stick to the recommended number as it allows for characters and strategy to really develop.
On the other extreme I have seen groups attempt huge games; the largest I saw was just over 40 players. Unlike the other games commented on above the eliminated players in these huge games rarely stick around such a long time to see how they end.
 
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Wayne Burg
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I don't think there ARE games that would accomidate huge crowds. Are there? A friend of mine is going to South Africa with a bunch of college students. I'm trying to find a good party game for him to take. I was picturing him playing with maybe 10 or so at a time. I hadn't considered the entire group trying to play one particular game. Guess I'll start up a different thread instead of derailing this one.
 
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Necessary Evil
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Re: Help w/ Werewolf rules w/ no eliminations and less playe
Wayneburg wrote:
I'm liking Saboteur. Thanks for suggesting it.


Saboteur is a great game, can't go wrong there.

Werewolf needs the elimination and being eliminated as people above said is some of the fun. Watching this game is at least as entertaining as being a part of it. also be warned werewolf needs a good charismatic person to lead the game or it can breakdown in to endless voting and nominating.

-M


 
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