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The Settlers of the Stone Age» Forums » Rules

Subject: Moving into a past camp location? rss

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Enon Sci
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I just finished a quick reread of the rules in preparation to an appraisal session* tomorrow with a focused subset of my group. One major question remains:

Q: The rules specifically state "If you have moved one of your explorers to an intersection with a tribe counter, you may convert the explorer into a camp." Are you allowed to establish a camp on an intersection that had an exploration marker on it in the past?

Thanks.




* - Appraisal sessions are explorations of questionable titles from a technically minded vantage. We then do a postmortem over our impressions after playing an introductory session (this is how we vet out the bad games from our real game nights).
 
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Michael Ward
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No. If you read on a bit down the page you'll see "Important: An explorer may be converted into a camp only on an intersection with a tribe counter."

To me if it was legal I still wouldn't want to do it, as you get no victory point for expending valuable resources for a camp (and losing your explorer, that will have to be rebuilt).
 
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Enon Sci
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Michael Ward wrote:
No. If you read on a bit down the page you'll see "Important: An explorer may be converted into a camp only on an intersection with a tribe counter."


Oh, I read that. The problems with interpreting it your way are:

1) The leader can strategically steal ideal resource placements and then vacate the zone merely to grief the rest of the table by removing any potential availability of the resource.

2) The rule you quoted could be interpreted as a pre-initial placement criteria and not a post-placement criteria. In other words, due to the probability distributions they calculated in play tests, they only want X number of locations for potential camps. The question is whether this number stays constant or whether it dwindles over time.

Since the legal spaces in a 3 player game are denoted with a triangle, and color denotes the placements in a 4 player game, it's not like one would be at a loss to determine whether a space in question was a legal spot at some prior time in play.

In all honesty, it's just issue #1 that has me worried. I could try the game both ways, but the point of the session is to try it the "official" way before putting in any mods.

[q="Michael Ward"
To me if it was legal I still wouldn't want to do it, as you get no victory point for expending valuable resources for a camp (and losing your explorer, that will have to be rebuilt). [/q]

That's true. The only reason you would want to do it is if the space in question outputted a valuable commodity coupled with a promising probability number.

For example, perhaps Player A has been starving for hides and Player B just left a forest space labeled with a 6 or 8. The next similarly plentiful forest might be a far march from the current zone of contention, so Player A inquires to me (the rules master) whether it would be legal to set up camp for a few turns in the space Player B just vacated.

?
 
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'Bernard Wingrave'
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I have a couple of comments for you, based on four or so plays of the game. I'm by no means an expert, but maybe this perspective will be helpful.

The rulebook states three times that converting an explorer into a camp involves an intersection with a tribe counter. In my rulebook, it's in section C on page 6. First, it mentions "If you have moved one of your explorers to an intersection with a tribe counter...", then "When you create a camp, you must...place the tribe counter...in front of you", and finally, "Important: An explorer may be converted into a camp only on an intersection with a tribe counter!" So as written, this seems clear to me.

In our games, I don't think it has happened very often that players have picked up camps outside of Africa in order to place them elsewhere. Maybe one or two players per game would do this once or twice, and I think it was toward the end of the game, when building a new camp in the same location would not give a player many resources before the end. (Each player starts with three camps in Africa and places the next two (which begin off the board) first, followed by picking up and moving of the three from Africa. A player who has done this will have five victory points from tribe markers alone. The other VP sources (exploration chits, technology cards, and the two 2-point VP cards) make it possible for players to get to 10 points without needing to remove camps that are outside of Africa, should they choose this strategy.)
 
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Deb Wentworth
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I'm finding some ambiguity in the English rules - I had tripped over this question as well. I think the German version of the rules is less ambiguous.

You only pick up a tribe counter when you convert an explorer to a campfire, and you can only do that conversion on a space with a tribe counter on it.

In our first play, we picked up tribe counters without building camp fires on the location, and we placed camp fires at any intersection where a tribe counter had been - wrong!

 
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