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EVE: The Second Genesis» Forums » General

Subject: Local Events and Players in Nothern California? rss

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Mike Fassio
United States
Oakland
California
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I picked up the starter decks from the Core Set and was wondering if anyone knew of local shops or groups that play in Northern California (Sacramento/Modesto/Manteca/Bay Area).
 
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Craig C Randall
United States
Sandy
Utah
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I don't know of any stores that hold events. I saw mention of it in the program book for one of the local game conventions, I think it was DunDraCon. I'd offer to play but I utterly hate the game since it's totally broken. They tried to fix the problem by releasing a few "magic bullet" cards in the Exile set, but really it's the rules themselves that have to change to make the game playable. It's a shame too because it sure is a pretty game. Anyway, good luck finding other players.

Best Regards,
Craig
 
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Mike Fassio
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Problems with the rules? Care to elaborate?
 
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Craig C Randall
United States
Sandy
Utah
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Sure. So, the problem is that your opponent can Warp directly to your Starbase and attack it in the same turn without you having any sort of defensive action to recall your ships. That's not too bad I suppose, but it does mean that you have to keep a fairly decent force on patrol, still there are some major flaws that result:

1. Outer Regions are suicide - To benefit from an outer region you must control it. To control it you must have ships there. If you have ships at an outer region, they can't defend your Starbase. It's a catch 22; send enough ships to control and maintain the outer region but then your starbase is vulnerable to attack or send only enough to control the outer region and probably lose it the next turn or have your starbase destroyed. So, the increased income you might earn from controlling an outer region isn't going to be worth the effort. Not to mention that the money spent to bring it into play will likely go towards aiding your opponent more than helping yourself. You spend resources on something that is too easily taken away from you and which can't defend your starbase. You're much better off spending those resources on more ships or your starbase itself.

2. Kamikaze wins every time - One race has access to an ability called Kamikaze. The purpose of it is clear, I'm sure, but the problem is that it is just too effective. The ships that possess it are all very cheap. Even worse is that the kamikaze ability is resolved before anything else. It's all too easy for a starbase to be destroyed from nothing but kamikaze ships. The fleet that you kept home to defend is utterly useless against ships with that ability.

3. Deal damage twice - In the event that your opponent is playing a race they like rather than the race they know can win the fastest, you're still faced with the fact that the rules of the game want the game to end as quickly as possible. Your opponents fleet of ships will inflict damage on your ships as necessary to destroy them and your defending ships will fire back. The problem is that combat doesn't end there, instead the attacker now deals the full damage of each surviving ship to your starbase, effectively allowing the attacker the unfair advantage of shooting twice.

Those are the 3 biggest problems with the game and for me they make it pretty much unplayable. The Exile expansion has not corrected any of the problems with the rules, and these are _rules_ problems not cards with overly powerful abilities (even kamikaze counts as a rule not a broken card). Instead, their solution to the problem (well, the only problem they admit to is the kamikaze rush victory) is to print new starbase cards for each race that are exactly the same and when upgraded say something to the effect of opponents can't warp to your starbase region while you control 3 outer regions. Mind you that you can't bring more than 1 outer region into play per turn. This type of magic bullet card is utterly worthless as it does not address the real problem. It's like a doctor putting a bandage on a broken leg and then telling you to walk it off, "The pain let's you know that it's healing." That may be a bit harsh I suppose. It seems as though my friend and I are the only people who think the game is completely broken.

It's a shame because the game looks fantastic and I really wanted to like it, but I already own another CCG that is very similar with far better rules and strategy though not as pretty and sadly now defunct.

Best Regards,
Craig
 
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Tom Jones
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skandall wrote:

3. Deal damage twice - In the event that your opponent is playing a race they like rather than the race they know can win the fastest, you're still faced with the fact that the rules of the game want the game to end as quickly as possible. Your opponents fleet of ships will inflict damage on your ships as necessary to destroy them and your defending ships will fire back. The problem is that combat doesn't end there, instead the attacker now deals the full damage of each surviving ship to your starbase, effectively allowing the attacker the unfair advantage of shooting twice.


I don't quite follow your complaint as outlined here, but I believe that your complaint is that attacking ships can target the enemy base in Target Step (III), and the survivors can inflict damage on the base again in Result Step (V). This appears to be incorrect according to the original rules. In the rules for "Target", it says, "When choosing targets for your ships during the targeting step in a battle phase, the only legal targets are enemy ships in the same region." You can't target a starbase during the Target Step.

Kamikaze does explicity allow you to target a base. This this might be a pathological/clever assault technique (for the Minmatar, unless another faction has this ability as well). However, you claim that Kamikaze ships are cheap for the damage they inflict. In my Minmatar starter (don't have boosters), I see the Breacher has Kamikaze 2 for 3 ISK. Meanwhile, Slasher has Attack 3 for 3 ISK (both ships have 1 Shield).

However, if if Kamikaze isn't under-costed, there may be a pathological strategy of squirreling away sufficient Kamikaze ships docked safely in your own base, then unleashing them in an unstoppable suicide, game-winning run. If this *is* a game breaker, with no plausible counters -- house rule it. Disallow Kamikaze attacks from targeting a base. Done.

The Outer Regions are a puzzle to me. I'm just getting prepared to try this game for the first time (all 6 starters, no boosters). Having just read the rules, I'm trying to figure out why the Outer Regions having ratings for Locations that are as high as they are. Seems like the infinite limit in your home region means that income generation Locations should be tucked away in the home region, unless the card itself prohibits it, or only becomes useful in an Outer Region.

There are a few Outer Regions that have such cool special abilities, that I can imagine putting enough force there to retain it (like Sansha's Nation, which allows you to draw cards randomly from your discard pile). But Outer Regions that just pump your income, seem to be a trap. Unless... unless that's what they are, a way to draw the enemy into battle.

[Yes, I know about the Exiled star bases, and the fact that they force Outer Region play.]

I'll have to see how it goes. I'm still concerned about the utility of Outer Regions, but I don't think this claim of "broken" game play stands up. At the most, I can see a minor house rule to set things right.
 
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