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Shear Panic» Forums » Rules

Subject: Reversing a previous move rss

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Richard Glassco
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There are two types of restrictions that prevent you from using the same action as the previous player's action to simply reverse that action. One makes an exception for a previous sheep panic roll and the other doesn't. I have three questions about those restrictions.
1. If the previous player did a wool rule (fence) move in one direction, and doing a wool rule move in the opposite direction would not leave the flock in exactly the same places as before the first move, would the second one be legal? I think this would be the case most of the time.
2. Could I use a line push or diagonal push to undo the previous player's lamb slam? It's not the same action as the previous action, although it has the effect on undoing it.
3. If there is a previous sheep panic action (either a lamb slam or a ewe turn), is it that action that may not be reversed, or is it the previous player's regular turn action?
 
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Paul
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1. I agree. The sheep would be in a different position after the second wool rule, so it doesn't simply undo the previous players move.

2. I would think so, but that's not "official". The rulebook does say "same action", and thoe two are indeed different actions from the Lamb Slam.

3.I think that after the panic action, the sheep are no longer in a proper position to undo the previous player's action (am I missing something?). That said, I think you can use an action to undo a panic action. Both restriction rules specify the player's previous action. A panic is the game itself doing something apart from anyone's strategy.

 
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Joe Grundy
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The designer answered question (1) previously... it's NOT allowed, even though the flock would not return to the exact same position. (Also, the same answer for all situations with the orthogonal and diagonal pushes ... the "reverse" action of pushing the same line in the opposite direction is not allowed, even if there was originally a gap in the line so the action doesn't restore the previous position.)

However I never got an answer (in the same thread) what happens if a line pushing action results in a "resolve the flock" then the resulting flock no longer has the same "lines"... so which line/s can not then immediately be pushed the other way?


The Mayfair Games publisher answered a related question to question 3... you can't use a ewe-turn action to reverse a ewe-turn that happened from a Panic die roll. He goes on to explain that even given the intervening Panic roll, the actions with a "No Entry" sign can't be used in the reverse direction of the same action either of the Panic roll effect or the previous players chosen action. The actions with the coloured pie can be used if the last thing that happened was a Panic die roll. But you can use a Panic roll result without restriction... this may allow you to "reverse" your own action (or, nominally, reverse the previous player's action).


In all cases, it seems to me from miscellaneous reading but no solid source, the "can't reverse the previous action" as only about using the very same nominal action but in the reverse direction, rather than about not restoring a previous position. So if a lamb slamb has an effect that you can undo with a diagonal or orthogonal push then you are allowed to "undo" the lamb slamb.

(edit: fixed link)
 
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Mark McEvoy
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Hey Joe, I think your first link is faulty. I think you meant to link to http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/129140 .
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Joe Grundy
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Thanks. Fixed.
 
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Robin Goodall
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jgrundy wrote:
The Mayfair Games publisher answered a related question to question 3... you can't use a ewe-turn action to reverse a ewe-turn that happened from a Panic die roll. He goes on to explain that even given the intervening Panic roll, the actions with a "No Entry" sign can't be used in the reverse direction of the same action either of the Panic roll effect or the previous players chosen action.

I remember not liking/accepting this ruling when I originally read the post. I believe that the panic roll is not part of the player's action.

Also, the following could happen:
Player A performs a ewe-turn clockwise, the marker movement results in a panic roll. This comes up white. Player A performs a ewe-turn anticlockwise (undoing his move - valid). Player B would like to perform a ewe-turn (it may even be his only action left), but cannot as he isn't allowed to perform one in either direction.

This rule has always caused me trouble (especially when trying to explain it to others). I've even gone to the extreme of just ignoring it totally.

What we really need is an official rewording/rewriting... over to Gordon and Fraser!

My suggestion:

"No entry" symbol - you may not perform the same action (ewe-turn or wall-rule) in the opposite direction to that performed by the previous player.
Exception: you are not restricted if the previous player performed a ewe-turn and a panic roll also produced a ewe-turn

"Coloured pie" symbol - you may not perform the same action (line or diagonal push) on the same row/column/diagonal in the opposite direction to that performed by the previous player, unless a panic roll was performed in between.
Exception: If the previous player's action caused the flock to be resolved and the originally pushed row/column/diagonal's contents have been changed then the player is not restricted.


In which case the OPs scenarios are:
1) illegal, even with a panic roll in between
2) legal, the previous player used a different action to you
3) it's the previous players "regular turn action" that is relevant
 
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