Recommend
6 
 Thumb up
 Hide
11 Posts

Magic Realm» Forums » General

Subject: MR Reduced Tutorials - Part One - Combat rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Chris Jones
United Kingdom
Sheffield
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
The first draft of my tutorial is with Karim to see if he's happy with how I've used his graphics.

If he says yes, or I can alter the document so he's happy, then I'll post the tutorial for much anticipated feedback.

I covered combat first as its the central element of character play and and the game mechanic (and the bit I thought I could get my head around). If you can start with players who know the rudimentaries of combat then you almost have an MR game!

I'm ignoring hiring and magic for now (bleeding from ears and eyes when I even glance at those sections) and may consider moving around the realm, tiles and an explanation of how actions are recorded on the day sheet and their various effects.

I'm going to have to get to grips with setting up the bounty and encounter boards, so I may look at set up guides for those (though Karim's boards are exceptionally helpful and clear), plus explanations of how monster/natives/treasure leave those boards and get placed on the map (not a clue at present, but I know it does happen).

Any suggestions for tutorial improvements or sequels?

CHRIS

************************************************************************

UPDATE

Karim has agreed to the file being posted and he'll wait to see what feedback arises before he finally approves.

Find it here..

INTRODUCTION

http://www.filefactory.com/file/b0fb3d/n/Introduction_pdf

COMBAT TUTORIAL (Corrections - 30th Oct)

http://www.filefactory.com/file/65f64e/n/MR_Reduced_Tutorial...

Please post advice on any aspect as I'd like it to be useful.

When the file passes BGG muster (and Karim is happy) I'll post the revised version in the files section.

CHRIS
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Lukasz Respondek
Poland
Pawonkow
flag msg tools
designer
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Ok, I'm no expert, as I only started to learn the game (about two weeks ) plus, I understand that those are simplified rules, but I noticed some mistakes.

Page 4/5 - Active weapons - there's no such thing as active weapons - weapon counters on their red side are called alerted, and they do not become alerted, unless you use a phase during the day to alert them, or alert them during the encounter step of combat if you have a move chit faster than each enemy maneuver on your sheet (you could omit this and get to the next part). Weapons also become alerted as soon as they miss, and turn unalerted when they hit.

page 18 - Armored monsters - as is the case with the armor of the characters - it does not lower the attack strength without a sharpness star.

page 23 - positioning monsters - Monsters do not have to be positioned evenly in the three boxes. You have to position monsters in as many boxes as possible, but nothing stops you to place 3 monsters in one box, and only one monster in each of the remaining boxes, as long as all boxes are filled (i.e. when you fight the goblins).


Once again - I'm still learning the game, so someone who knows better should double check the corrections
The idea of such tutorials is great - it certainly will speed up the process of learning Magic Realm
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Greg Durrett
United States
Portland
Oregon
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
zara2stra wrote:

Page 4/5 - Active weapons - there's no such thing as active weapons - weapon counters on their red side are called alerted, and they do not become alerted, unless you use a phase during the day to alert them, or alert them during the encounter step of combat if you have a move chit faster than each enemy maneuver on your sheet (you could omit this and get to the next part). Weapons also become alerted as soon as they miss, and turn unalerted when they hit.


While you are correct that weapon counters on their red side are "alerted", it is also true that weapons can be "active". Just as other items owned by a character can be active or inactive, so can weapons - with the proviso that only one weapon can be active at a time. See "Belongings" 4.3.6.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Greg Durrett
United States
Portland
Oregon
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Goldenturkey wrote:


Please post advice on any aspect as I'd like it to be useful.

CHRIS


Just a quick note that page 4 indicates H monsters as "Huge", when it should be "Heavy".

I'll post here if I find other errors.

Greg
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Lukasz Respondek
Poland
Pawonkow
flag msg tools
designer
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Terminus_Est wrote:
zara2stra wrote:

Page 4/5 - Active weapons - there's no such thing as active weapons - weapon counters on their red side are called alerted, and they do not become alerted, unless you use a phase during the day to alert them, or alert them during the encounter step of combat if you have a move chit faster than each enemy maneuver on your sheet (you could omit this and get to the next part). Weapons also become alerted as soon as they miss, and turn unalerted when they hit.


While you are correct that weapon counters on their red side are "alerted", it is also true that weapons can be "active". Just as other items owned by a character can be active or inactive, so can weapons - with the proviso that only one weapon can be active at a time. See "Belongings" 4.3.6.


Sorry - I wrote it badly; I know that weapons, just as other equipment can be active. I only wanted to point out that weapons on their red side are alerted (and to be alerted, they have to be active beforehand)
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Jones
United Kingdom
Sheffield
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
When someone mentions something I don't understand I will go back to the rules and either rewriet or omit the rule completely.

When I revise the file I will update the original link in the first post.

So far thankyou. I am learning the game (so there will be mistakes - sadly) but producing the tutorials is the only way I can learn it throroughly (otherwise I skim).

Keep it coming

CHRIS
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Gregor Jochmann
Germany
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Chris, I appreciate the effort you put into this. I am currently planning to introduce my gaming group to MR, and the idea of simplified tutorials with added questions at the end seems quite good.

Some thought about the current version:
While teaching by bad example is not everyones taste, i think the concept is ok. But the swordman should play an attack that has a chance of killing the snake if it connects. Let him use a slow Medium (M5) attack, which would be not optimal, but still useful if it hits.

The swordman only has a chance of killing the snake if he overswings. The concept of overswinging is introduced quite late. I think you should explain it early on, as it is very important for players to sort out attacks that won't do anything (and maybe realising that they have no chance of killing that T Armored monster they are facing).

The readers might stumbled over the name of the swordsman's weapon (Thrusting sword). Maybe you should add a note here that this is only a name, and that the sword is not restricted to doing the thrust attack.

Just as Lukasz said, it is not correct that weapons automatically flip "red side up" at the beginning of battle. You mixed up the terms "active" (= beeing the weapon of choice for the carracter, not in the backpack) and "alerted" (beeing wielded in hand). The weapons do not have an "active" side, only an alerted side and an inalerted side. In this tutorial, i think it would be enough to say "the swordsman was wary enough to carry his weapon wielded, so the sword is placed alerted side up on his chart", instead of describing the "alert" action.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Jones
United Kingdom
Sheffield
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
During my rules reading I've become aware of the alert/active/inactive confusion.

The tutorial is meant to be a progression. The object of the poor initial choice of Chits is to force the player to learn to recognise better choices. I also wanted to introduce the mechanism of death early.

'Overswing' (I assume that's the term - I will insert it in the text) is introduced after proving how even a successful attack can fail.

I'm trying not to say - "here's how you do it well" but more "think about the process stage by stage". It's a balance of getting the student happy with what they know before introducing the next element.

I appreciate I can't please everyone, and I will review the tutorial in great depth in the light of all responses.

Please keep it coming.

CHRIS

UPDATE


All suggested corrections have been completed and the link in the first post now points at the corrected file.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steve McKnight
United States
Needham
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Comments:

1. The text about the Action Chits could be clearer:
Quote:
"These chits allow the Swordsman to make attacks (in 3 possible ways) and attempt to evade attacks by opponents (again, in one of 3 different ways). They form a game resource in Magic Realm (‘MR’) that can get used up (Fatigued), lost (Wounded) or recycled. Each character has a different set of Action Chits, giving each character a unique style of play."

It's not clear what "ways" means, nor is it clear what "used up," "lost," or "recycled" means.

Suggestion: "His Action Chits allow the Swordsman to make attacks (in 3 possible directions) and attempt to evade attacks by opponents (again, in one of three different directions). They form a game resource in Magic Realm ("MR") that can be active (ready for use) or disabled through use of too much effort ("Fatigued") or through the character being hit by an attack ("Wounded"). Fatigued or wounded Action Chits can be recovered to active though Rest phases recorded during the Daylight part of the turn. Each character has a different set of Action Chits, giving each character a unique style of play."


2. Change all "Huge" to "Heavy." There are no "Huge" weapons or harm. The word "Huge" is never used in Magic Realm; "Heavy" is the word that is used.


3. Unless the Swordsman has recorded an "Alert" phase during the day, his Thrusting Sword begins the combat round light side up, not red side up. The weapon is not "flipped to its Active red side to show it is in use." There is no "Active" side; a weapon is active if it is with a character's active items. There is an "Alerted" side which is what the weapon is when it is red side up. A weapon can be flipped to its Alerted side by:

i. recording and executing an Alert phase during the day

ii. playing a Fight chit during the "Actions" phase of the Encounter Step (the Fight chit must have a lower number -- faster speed -- than the move time of any monster on his sheet)

iii. attacking and missing with the weapon in a round of combat -- it becomes alerted for the next round (if a weapon attacks and hits it becomes unalerted for the next round)

Note that the unalerted Thrusting Sword has a weapon speed = 4 ("L4"), so it will always attack with speed = 4 (and will not undercut the Viper) no matter what the speed of the Fight chit used.


4. Note that the Viper is armored, so the sharpness star on the Thrusting Sword does not add to its harm level -- the Thrusting Sword cannot kill the Viper unless it is played with a Fight chit (Medium) that exceeds the weapon weight (Light). This is known as "overswinging".


5. If you are going to use the "Encounter Step"/"Melee Step" terminology, you should use it the same way the rules do. Section 5 of the Third Edition rules gives an outline of the steps in a round of combat:

A. The Encounter Step involves the following activities, in order:

a. Luring - the character can lure as many monsters onto his sheet as he likes,

b. Random Assignment - all non-lured monsters are assigned randomly to unhidden characters in the clearing.

[In your example, it doesn't matter if the Swordsman lures the Viper or declines to lure and the Viper is randomly assigned. In either case the Viper ends up on the Swordsman's sheet -- although not in any particular box. That happens later in the Melee Step.]

c. Deployment/Charging - only used with hired natives or in character vs. character combat.

d. Actions - the Swordsman can i) play a Fight chit to alert his weapon, ii) play a Move chit to run away. The speed of the Fight chit or Move chit would have to be faster than the Viper's Move Speed.

[At the end of the Encounter Step, the monsters have been distributed to the characters' sheet, but the characters have not selected a target and no attack/maneuver directions have been determined.]

B. The Melee Step follows the Encounter Step and is comprised of the following activities, in order:

a. Selecting Targets - in random order characters select the targets for their attacks. In the example of the Swordsman and the Viper this is trivial -- of course the Swordsman will target the Viper. But if there was more than one character in the clearing or more than one monster, the characters have to pick a target for their attack.

b. Attacks/Maneuvers - monsters are placed in their initial attack/maneuver directions, and characters place their Move and Fight chits to select their attack and maneuver directions.

c. Repositioning/Changing Tactics - each character rolls one die to reposition all the denizens on his sheet according to the repositioning table on the sheet. He then rolls two dice separately for each Medium and Heavy monster (and Head or Club counter) to see if the monster "changes tactics" and flips over.

d. Resolving Attacks - it is determined which attacks hit and the order of hits (weapon length first with attack speed to resolve ties in Round 1; speed first with weapon length to resolve ties in Round 2 and following rounds)

e. Inflicting Harm - the harm of each attack is determined in order. If a target is killed, any pending attacks are canceled.

C. Fatigue Step- Action Chits are fatigued and wounded as appropriate.


6. The Swordsman's attack speed is not his weapon length. His attack speed is the weapon speed given by the "L4" on the unalerted side of the Thrusting Sword. If there is no number next to the harm level, then the attack speed is the speed of the Fight chit played. Attack speeds are never compared to weapon lengths -- they are compared to Move speeds to determine undercutting and to other attack speeds to determine the order in which harm is inflicted. Weapon lengths are compared only to other weapon lengths -- the Viper's "Tooth/Claw" attack has length=0. In Round 1 harm is inflicted in order of weapon length (longest first) with attack speed breaking ties. In Round 2 and following rounds, harm is inflicted in order of attack speed with weapon length breaking ties.




There are some other problems, but these are the major issues.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Jones
United Kingdom
Sheffield
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
mcknight wrote:

1. The text about the Action Chits could be clearer....

Agreed. Will go with your suggestion. Thanks.

mcknight wrote:

2. Change all "Huge" to "Heavy.".....

Done.

mcknight wrote:

...Thrusting Sword begins the combat round light side up, not red side up....

For clarity (for now) have just stated the weapon is Alerted.

mcknight wrote:

4. Note that the Viper is armored.......

Reworded and changed. Also the indication (wrongly) was that Armour reduce Harm Level in all cases. - Changed also. Overswing mentioned

mcknight wrote:

"Encounter Step"/"Melee Step/Fatigue Step" terminology.....

Terms dropped as the tutorial does not cover all elements of these phases.

mcknight wrote:

6. The Swordsman's attack speed is not his weapon length....

Agreed. This is now VERY wrong. Complete rewrite underway.

mcknight wrote:

There are some other problems, but these are the major issues.

And list them please if you have time.

*****************************************************************

It's clear that much needs to be done. Please continue to comment. I am learning and want to share the route I've taken (hopefully that of least resistance) with other Noobs.

CHRIS

***Still correcting the above*** I'll remove this line when the latest file is posted
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Jones
United Kingdom
Sheffield
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Well it's amazing how much you can learn in a day and how wrong you can be when you think you're right.

I'm stalling posting any more versions of the Tutorial as I've got major rewriting to do before it is correct.

Please still post (or email) suggestions based on the posted doc (I may still update it) or ideas of your own to help out, but I'll post a new thread when I've more to offer.

Thanks so far guys

CHRIS
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.