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Subject: Can you use cards to move the dragon(s) away from other players? rss

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Mark Jimenez
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Not only is this legal, but encouraged in BMC. This is to prevent others from getting scales, which prevents them from leading in crystals. Of course, you do this on your turn.

It seems that this is another one of those games where it pays to "look good" to the dragons.

*Waving arms frantically at Green Dragon* "Hey! Over here! You don't want to look at THAT feeble attempt at city reconstruction - look over here! I'm about to finish a grand building! Oh, BTW I see one of your precious scales are falling off, can I haves it plz!"

OR

"Mr. Red Dragon, I heard there's a great sale on dragon chum 3 blocks away. Certainly that's cooler than THAT market being built over there. Oh, and tell your friends too."

Remember that some cards can move a dragon anywhere, including off board, and others can only move a dragon 3 space.
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Michael J
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Drew1365 wrote:
In a recent game, I found I wanted to use cards in my turn to move one or more of the dragons -- not necessarily move them to where I stood, but to move them away from other players so they couldn't take advantage of the bonuses without spending cards to move them back. Is this legal?

This was only my second play of the game -- I don't own it, so I'm not sure of the rule, or if this is even covered.


Yes, the above answer is correct. You can spend your cards to move the dragons anywhere. As to WHY you would move dragons from one space to another, that strategy is up to you. In general, I treat BMC as a game of a real estate. You want to invest in tiles that are good locations (e.g. have good rewards, and have people near them who might finish them, and even might have a dragon or two). Moving dragons from one tile to another can increase the property value of a tile, drawing contributors from far and wide to add to the tile and complete it for you. Ideally, every contribution you make is followed up with a completed tile sooner or later. If you ever place a cube on a tile and the tile is not completed, you have essentially wasted your turn. Which brings me to my next point.

BMC is designed to keep scores close. This is a game that is almost always won by a player with just a few crystals more, or one TURN more. Often times, more than one player is about to win the game when the final offering is added to the obelisk. Some view this as a detraction - I think it is brilliant. My view is that it means that a single wasted move can cost you the game, adding tension throughout to every decision. Do I go here and add a cube? Will it net me crystals? Did I waste a turn by moving to the obelisk without two offerings at the same time? Can I get three more crystals by going here and having a neighborhood bonus?

Where am I going with this? Back to your original question. You CAN move the dragons anywhere you want. But because the game is so tight, you have to think hard about spending cards moving dragons to spaces that don't help you. I think every move is precious. Given a choice of moving the dragons to one of my own tiles (whether I am on it or not) is better than moving them to another tile so an enemy can't use them. It's hard to keep people away from the 3-scale bonus award anyway - so in reality, making moves like this is designed to prevent 1 person from getting to 6 scales. In essence, you are spending cards to affect 1 person. Plus, whatever tile you move the dragons to MIGHT actually benefit someone else, making the whole move neutral anyway. Unless you can calculate odds well enough and be sure that the move doesn't have any effect one way or another, there is a chance the move can hurt you.

One time I think it is a good idea to move dragons is when the crystals are about to run out, and you can calculate exactly where in the race for the 6 point bonus you are, and know that moving a dragon or 2 can net you the bonus. Still, you don't know what cards the enemy has, and you may just waste as many cards moving the dragons as they waste moving them back.

So think carefully before you move them - you are spending cards too!
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Gláucio Reis
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mgamer72 wrote:
Remember that some cards can move a dragon anywhere, including off board, and others can only move a dragon 3 space.

Moving dragons off-board is not allowed.
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Mark Jimenez
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GSReis wrote:
mgamer72 wrote:
Remember that some cards can move a dragon anywhere, including off board, and others can only move a dragon 3 space.

Moving dragons off-board is not allowed.


According to the rules,

"Black cards – The Vulca (during the movement phase)

• With a black-1 card you can move the red dragon to any building tile. The dragon can also be moved outside of the city.
• With a black-2 card you can move the red dragon up to 3 tiles. This is only possible when the dragon is already in the city.

Red cards – The Terrah (during the movement phase)

• With a red-1 card you can move the green dragon to any building tile. The dragon can also be moved out of the city.
• With a red-2 card you can move the green dragon up to 3 tiles. This is only possible when the dragon is already in the city.

Blue cards – The Aqua (during the movement phase)

• With a blue-1 card you can move the blue dragon to any building tile. The dragon can also be moved out of the city.
• With a blue-2 card you can move the blue dragon up to 3 tiles. This is only possible when the dragon is already in the city.
"

We just had our first play of this at BGG.con 08. If "out of the city" is not off-board, where is it?
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Pasta Batman
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mgamer72 wrote:
According to the rules,...

I'm not sure what you're quoting from there. The official rules for dragon movement cards are:
Quote:
Discard to fly the (color) dragon to any space (the dragon may be inside or outside the city).

and
Quote:
Discard to to move the (color) dragon up to three spaces (if the dragon is already in the city).

There is no discussion of 'off-board' being considered a space. I concur with Gláucio.

Edit: I think the confusion may be due to the parenthetical statement "(the dragon may be inside or outside the city)" in the above rules. But it's clear to me that this refers to the starting position of the dragon.
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Jeff Binning
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Quote:
Moving dragons off-board is not allowed.


This was also discussed here:

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/118319
 
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Allen Doum
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mgamer72 wrote:
GSReis wrote:
mgamer72 wrote:
Remember that some cards can move a dragon anywhere, including off board, and others can only move a dragon 3 space.

Moving dragons off-board is not allowed.


According to the rules,

"Black cards – The Vulca (during the movement phase)

• With a black-1 card you can move the red dragon to any building tile. The dragon can also be moved outside of the city.
• With a black-2 card you can move the red dragon up to 3 tiles. This is only possible when the dragon is already in the city.

Red cards – The Terrah (during the movement phase)

• With a red-1 card you can move the green dragon to any building tile. The dragon can also be moved out of the city.
• With a red-2 card you can move the green dragon up to 3 tiles. This is only possible when the dragon is already in the city.

Blue cards – The Aqua (during the movement phase)

• With a blue-1 card you can move the blue dragon to any building tile. The dragon can also be moved out of the city.
• With a blue-2 card you can move the blue dragon up to 3 tiles. This is only possible when the dragon is already in the city.
"

We just had our first play of this at BGG.con 08. If "out of the city" is not off-board, where is it?

When you quote the rules of a game, it would be nice if you actually quoted the rules without rewriting them.

The Rulebook in my game is identical to the rules posted on the FFG website. They all read:
Quote:
{Vulca (black)/Terrah (red)/Aqua (blue)} card of value 1. Discard to fly the {red/green/blue} dragon to any space (the dragon may be inside or outside the city).

This is significantly different than your "quote". Please do not confuse issues by inaccurately quoting the rules. There is enough noise around here, anyway.

-------------------------- Later that same night -------------------

OK. That was a little harsh. I seems that the rules translation posted here before the English edition was available is a source of the error. It does state the card rules as above.

But, the game has been available in English for years. The rules have been posted to FFG's site for that long as well. From what has been written here, that rule was a translation error.

Any of several of the summaries posted here have the correct rule. So you had any number of opportunities to update your rules before now. To quote a translation when English rules are available is still a source of confusion for those who come here looking for answers.

This is a minor point anyway, because it would rarely be a good move, even if it were legal.

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