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Subject: Making the Golden Geeks Even Better rss

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Randy Cox
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OK, the masses did a little better job this year in relation to selecting "Golden Geek" award winners. The biggest problems are that games outside the "Gamers Game" category probably can't win the Game of the Year and the nomination process. Can't do much about the former, but we can fix the nomination process. "Yes, we can!"

How about an automatic poll for each game, a la BGG best number of players, best ages, and language dependence? All we need is one more poll which allow only one selection. The poll would look like this:

Poll: Best Golden Geek Category for This Game
What is the single best Golden Geek category for this game?
Gamer's Game
2-Player Game
Card Game
Family Game
Children's Game
Party Game
Wargame
      16 answers
Poll created by Randy Cox


Then, people could pigeonhole games in the database to best categorize them.

Finally, when it's time to nominate games for the "Geekies," all that would be needed is to check each game's poll info when users select a game and place it in a category.

What would qualify in each category?

Well, Artwork would be open to all. Beyond that, allow a game to be in it's TOP category (as voted by the masses in this poll) plus any other category(ies) that is within 5% of that top category.

That way, an obvious "Wargame" with 67% of the vote going to that categorization would only be eligible in the wargame category. But a game that is 38% 2-player, 34% Card Game, with the other votes all small percentages would be eligible in those TWO categories.

Some will argue that it would be hard for a game to be in two categories in this scenario (e.g. Wargame and 2-player or Gamer's Game and Family Game or Card Game and 2-player). That's true (mostly for the 2-player games). But I think that's a GOOD result. It allows more games to take home prizes (rare double-winners in war and 2-player, e.g.). It also lets people see what games are grouped into outside of the Golden Geek voting timeframe--which is a useful tool for statheads.

*Note: of course, the whole 2-player problem can be averted by taking it out of the autopoll and basing 2-player categorization only on games where BGG says the game is best AND only playable as a 2-player game, since we already have that poll.
 
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Julien Vion
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At do not see the point to force games to fit in only one category. Games that play well with 2 players although also playable with more (read, RFTG or Through the Ages for example) are absolutely eligible for the 2 players prize in my opinion.

If one game simultaneously win all prizes, then it will probably be the best game of all times, and save me much money
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Dave Kudzma
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Quote:
The biggest problems are that games outside the "Gamers Game" category probably can't win the Game of the Year and the nomination process. Can't do much about the former, but we can fix the nomination process.


Perhaps I'm missing the point here. I don't get this statement.

It's a popularity contest. The most popular game won and always will.

End of story.
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Randy Cox
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scand1sk wrote:
At do not see the point to force games to fit in only one category. Games that play well with 2 players although also playable with more (read, RFTG or Through the Ages for example) are absolutely eligible for the 2 players prize in my opinion.

If one game simultaneously win all prizes, then it will probably be the best game of all times, and save me much money ;)

No one is forcing any game into a single category. The only limitation is that each voter can select only one category.

If you see results like this:

Axis & Allies
Wargame 98%
Gamer's Game 2%

[b]Through the Ages[b]
Gamer's Game 27%
Card Game 25%
2-player Game 23%
Family Game 22%
Wargame 1%

Then A&A gets in only one category and Through the Ages gets into four.

Of course, as I stated, the 2-player field doesn't have to be derived from this poll, as there is already a poll for that with each game in the database. Simply take it out of the poll, leaving only Gamer, Card, Family, Children, Party, and War. That's a perfectly good group of categories.
 
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Randy Cox
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locusshifter wrote:
Quote:
The biggest problems are that games outside the "Gamers Game" category probably can't win the Game of the Year and the nomination process. Can't do much about the former, but we can fix the nomination process.


Perhaps I'm missing the point here. I don't get this statement.

It's a popularity contest. The most popular game won and always will.
The point is that the most popular Gamer's game wins. The best Party, Children's, Family, War, or Card game doesn't have a chance (unless it's also one of the top 3 "Gamer's Games" as well).

And, as I said, there's nothing that can be done about the "Gamers Game bias" here. So I didn't make any suggestion to fix it.
 
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Dave Kudzma
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Randy,

So are you saying that games that are LESS popular here should have a chance to win game of the year?

Call me obtuse, but if there's a "gamer's game" bias here, then that's what's MOST POPULAR, and ergo, should win GotY.

What you really need is more people that are in favor of the "non-gamer's games" to vote to help them win next time.
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Galen
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locusshifter wrote:
Randy,

So are you saying that games that are LESS popular here should have a chance to win game of the year?


That's not what he is saying at all. All hes talking about is games and the categories they are in.
 
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Dave Kudzma
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Galen,

Quote:
The biggest problems are that games outside the "Gamers Game" category probably can't win the Game of the Year and the nomination process.


Actually, it seems clear to me he'd like to see other types of games win besides the usual uber-popular and super-hyped crowd.

I just do not see anything wrong with the system as it stands now. People vote. Games win. The voting reflects the feeling of the majority of users. That's my point. Take it or leave it.
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locusshifter wrote:
The voting reflects the feeling of the majority of users. That's my point. Take it or leave it.


I think Randy is proposing a third choice - suggest an improvement that helps ensure the games in the Party Games category (for example) are actually Party Games, rather than extremely popular Gamer's Games.
 
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Randy Cox
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locusshifter wrote:
Galen,

Quote:
The biggest problems are that games outside the "Gamers Game" category probably can't win the Game of the Year and the nomination process.


Actually, it seems clear to me he'd like to see other types of games win besides the usual uber-popular and super-hyped crowd.

I just do not see anything wrong with the system as it stands now. People vote. Games win. The voting reflects the feeling of the majority of users. That's my point. Take it or leave it. :)
As Galen pointed out, that's not what I'm saying. As I went on to say from that quote, there's nothing we can do about the first problem (Gamer Game winning GotY) but that we can fix the category problem.

This whole post was all about categorizing games to make the nominations better and lessen the chance that uberpopular games win in multiple categories.
 
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I sympathize with these goals, Randy, but if you want things to change, I suspect you'll have to go to the top. Aldie & Co. have made it eminantly clear that the way the Golden Geeks work is that they provide the categories and everything else is up to the voters. That means if someone wants to select Agricola as best wargame, he can do so, even though the choice is ridiculous. I happen to think this detracts from the quality of the awards, but my opinion isn't the one that counts. You're providing a possible way of partitioning the games by category, but without the will to actually implement this or something similar, it won't matter in the end.
 
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Randy Cox
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Larry Levy wrote:
I sympathize with these goals, Randy, but if you want things to change, I suspect you'll have to go to the top. Aldie & Co. have made it eminantly clear that the way the Golden Geeks work is that they provide the categories and everything else is up to the voters. That means if someone wants to select Agricola as best wargame, he can do so, even though the choice is ridiculous. I happen to think this detracts from the quality of the awards, but my opinion isn't the one that counts. You're providing a possible way of partitioning the games by category, but without the will to actually implement this or something similar, it won't matter in the end.
No doubt. But that's why I put it in the suggestions forum. The only major suggestion here is to add another auto-poll (of which there are already three with every game in the database). That shouldn't be all that difficult to incorporate.

From there, you either automate the use of said poll in the Golden Geek voting or you just weed out the silly nominees after all nominations are in. Either way provides the same level of sophistication to the award process (ie, reasonable selections) and the effort by Aldie & Co is minimal. The effort, as it should be, is on the membership. Just as it is with geekmod and the current auto-polls and ratings and everything else.
 
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