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Combat Commander: Europe» Forums » Rules

Subject: Rules Clarification - Fire and Op Fire rss

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William Urban
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Hey everyone, trying to wrap my head around the firing rules for CC:E. Me and a buddy have played a few games and each time we find rules we misread or whatever but now our big question is Fire and Op Fire.

If I play a Fire order, I can select a leader, then select units within his command radius and then each one of those units may fire at some unit. Or combine to make a fire group as long as they are within an unbroken chain of hexes. Now if I do this, even if I have a fire card in my hand still I cannot activate either that hero or those units again correct? Is this the correct usage of Fire?

If I play Op-Fire when my opponent moves, I get ONE shot per hex they move into right? So I activate say a hero and 3 units. I can have a fire group fire at the enemy as he moves into a hex but say I only have LOS to two guys. Then he moves again so my other 2 units can op fire then? What about if that unit stays where it is, can my other 2 units that were "activated" but didn't fire, shoot when someone else moves or once a new order is drawn their op fire turn is over?

Can a unit only op fire one time per turn just like shooting?

If a unit has done the firing in the movement card, can they still use a fire order?

Thanks all! Trying to get these rules all situated

-Will
 
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Chick Lewis
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Will Urban asked:

"If I play a Fire order, I can select a leader, then select units within his command radius and then each one of those units may fire at some unit. Or combine to make a fire group as long as they are within an unbroken chain of hexes. Now if I do this, even if I have a fire card in my hand still I cannot activate either that hero or those units again correct? Is this the correct usage of Fire?"

Yes, perfect, except don't say 'hero' always use 'leader', as in CC a Hero is a specific type of leader.

"If I play Op-Fire when my opponent moves, I get ONE shot per hex they move into right?"

Yes

"So I activate say a hero" (LEADER) "and 3 units. I can have a fire group fire at the enemy as he moves into a hex but say I only have LOS to" (FROM) "two guys. Then he moves again so my other 2 units can op fire then?"

Right

"What about if that unit stays where it is, can my other 2 units that were "activated" but didn't fire, shoot when someone else moves or once a new order is drawn their op fire turn is over?"

Correct, you can fire once at each hex moved into with a single enemy move order with as many of your activated units as you can make into a single firegroup. Once a new order is played all your op firing units lose their activation.

"Can a unit only op fire one time per turn just like shooting?"

Right

"If a unit has done the firing in the movement card, can they still use a fire order?"

Yes, when your opponent ends his turn it becomes a new turn (yours) and all of your units are again available for a single activation. Conversely, your units which were activated in your turn become available again at the start of your opponent's next turn.

So overall, it sounds like you are playing correctly. Hope the above is not too garbled to be useful.

- Chick
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Richard Pardoe
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Chick has answered most of your points, but I wanted to clarify a few things that seemed a bit fuzz.

will_urban wrote:
So I activate say a hero and 3 units. I can have a fire group fire at the enemy as he moves into a hex but say I only have LOS to two guys.


As the hero has a command radius of 0 (zero), so a hero can only activate units in the same hex. Therefore, it is impossible for only 2 of your guys to have LOS as the LOS must extend from the same hex (the one with the hero). For purposes of this discussion, we can just make it a leader and assume you have activated units in adjacent hexes within the leader's command radius. This allows some units to have LOS and others not depending on the target hex.

Quote:
Can a unit only op fire one time per turn just like shooting?

No, a unit activated to op fire can fire as long as the move order is being resolved. So if a unit moves into one hex, it can be shot at. If that unit moves again and is still in range and LOS of your OpFire activated units, they may make another shot. So unlike a Fire Order, and OpFire Action may result in the same units firing multiple times.




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William Urban
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Thanks all for the clarifications, I also need to clarify my question better for one part. So you know the card that says you can shoot if the unit has boxed something (don't have the card in front of me) and is part of a moving unit? If I use a move card, move that unit and then use that action card to fire. Can I then use a Fire card after they are done moving or did that fire while moving count as their fire for the turn?

Thanks!

-Will
 
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Pokke
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Quote:
If I use a move card, move that unit and then use that action card to fire. Can I then use a Fire card after they are done moving


You can only order units once in your turn. In your case above you ordered them to move (with an action to "assault fire") but after that move (and assault fire) they cannot receive another order.

Edit: so no, you cannot play a fire card after they are done moving.
 
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Richard Pardoe
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Reread O14 on activation. When playing an Order you activate a player or unit that has not yet been activated this turn. So once you have activated units to move, they may not receive any other order until your next turn. If you play a Fire Order after the move order, other units, units not yet activated this turn must carry out the fire order.
 
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William Urban
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Oh wow, so we kinda did that wrong then. So you can't move, fire, and then advance into melee to slaughter the broken units? Whoops, too much 40k I guess

Thanks all!

Hehe now I guess the battles will be more than just that one squad on the table doing 4 actions a turn while the rest of the army sits on their hands.

-Will
 
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Richard Pardoe
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will_urban wrote:
I guess the battles will be more than just that one squad on the table doing 4 actions a turn


They can do 4 Actions, they just can't do 4 Orders

The only reason I mention this - the rule book is well written and part of it efficiency is the precise use of terms and terminology combined with the "interpret strictly" doctrine in the box on Page 3. Avoiding a bit of loose language when discussing the game helps avoids some misunderstandings about the rules and their intention.
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Gregory Wong
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My two-cents: One exception to the One-order rule is the Hero. He can be ordered multiple times. Give him a flamethrower and plenty of order cards, and watch him go berserk.

Of course, I've only seen this happen with my opponents' heroes. The few times I've gotten a hero, he just seems to sit on his a** and complain about not having a flamethrower and how he wants to transfer out of this chicken s*** outfit.
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William Urban
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That's a good point about the literal word because we tend to throw them around alot. Hero/leader, action/order etc etc. But thanks for everyone for clearing up a lot of these questions, it's going to make a huge difference in how the game is played. Best hex chit tactical game we have ever played.

Oh on a random note, has anyone looked at the dice rolls on the cards and see if they follow the statistical curve of actual dice rolling? Just so that when you are thinking "Oh I need a 7" you get a good chance of getting that etc.

-Will
 
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William Urban
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@Gregory oh wow, well we haven't used Heroes or flamethrowers yet but I'll keep that in mind!

-Will
 
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Craig Tenhoff
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will_urban wrote:

Oh on a random note, has anyone looked at the dice rolls on the cards and see if they follow the statistical curve of actual dice rolling? Just so that when you are thinking "Oh I need a 7" you get a good chance of getting that etc.

-Will


72 Cards per deck. They match the statistical curve for 2 six sided dice (1 in 36 for a 2 or 12, ect).

Of course there is a thread somewhere around here about someone who skewed the decks by buying an extra copy of CC:E so that he could build decks ALA Magic: The Gathering....
 
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Mark Beyak
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RPardoe wrote:

Quote:
Can a unit only op fire one time per turn just like shooting?

No, a unit activated to op fire can fire as long as the move order is being resolved. So if a unit moves into one hex, it can be shot at. If that unit moves again (or another unit that was activated to move by the same order) and is still in range and LOS of your OpFire activated units, they may make another shot. So unlike a Fire Order, and OpFire Action may result in the same units firing multiple times.


I added the Bold Italics just to further clarify.

Quote:
Thanks all for the clarifications, I also need to clarify my question better for one part. So you know the card that says you can shoot if the unit has boxed something (don't have the card in front of me) and is part of a moving unit? If I use a move card, move that unit and then use that action card to fire. Can I then use a Fire card after they are done moving or did that fire while moving count as their fire for the turn?


The Order you gave them was to Move. They cannot receive another Order that turn. You played an action on them allowing them to Assault Fire. So they can fire because they were activated to move (the qualification on the Assault Fire Action). Note too that they can Assault Fire later in that same move if you played another Assault Fire Action card on them.
 
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