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Subject: Clarification about sectors and territories rss

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Zsolt Nagy
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We played a great game of Dune on Sunday, however a few blurry parts were raised and I would like to get your opinion about them.

1) When a player ships or moves his units into a territory with multiple sectors can he split his units between different sectors or all units has to be in the same sector within the territory?

2) When a player ships or moves his units into a territory with multiple sectors where he already has unit(s) in a sector can he move his 'new' units into a different sector(s) than where his 'old' units are?

3) Also in the case of #2 above can the the player "move" or regroup units which are already in the territory but in different sector to the sector of the newly arrived units?

4) In general, does regrouping units between sectors of the same territory count as move? Can it be done in all territory or just where shipment or movement happened? Can it be done at all?

5) Let's assume the player has units in a 3 sector territory with the following split: 3/4/4. Can he take one unit from each sector to move them into a different territory (leaving the starting territory as 2/3/3)?

Some answers to some questions can make other questions moot, I'm aware of that.
 
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Moshe Callen
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As I understand the rules, there are no genuine sectors of spaces as far asmovement or placement is concerned. The longitudinal lines areonly relavent to the storm. Of course if the storm blockspart, it blocks the whole.

I'm still new-ish to the game and could be mistaken but that's how I read the rules.
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Matt Albritton
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Nagypapi wrote:
1) When a player ships or moves his units into a territory with multiple sectors can he split his units between different sectors or all units has to be in the same sector within the territory?


You may split them however you want, but only the tokens in the same "sector" as the spice may collect spice.

Also, this does not prevent you from losing all your tokens to battle. If another faction ends their turn in the same "territory" as your multi-sector force, then they all fight. (Exception: You and the other tokens are separated by a sector that is currently in storm.)

Nagypapi wrote:
2) When a player ships or moves his units into a territory with multiple sectors where he already has unit(s) in a sector can he move his 'new' units into a different sector(s) than where his 'old' units are?


Sure, it's the same result as (1).

Nagypapi wrote:
3) Also in the case of #2 above can the the player "move" or regroup units which are already in the territory but in different sector to the sector of the newly arrived units?


Yes, as long as they are not separated by a sector in storm.

Nagypapi wrote:
4) In general, does regrouping units between sectors of the same territory count as move? Can it be done in all territory or just where shipment or movement happened? Can it be done at all?


Don't make this more complex than it has to be. The rule is (paraphrasing): "When you finish a shipment action or a movement action in a territory with multiple sectors, make it clear what "sector" each token is in." I'd say you can't adjust any other territory than the current one.

Nagypapi wrote:
5) Let's assume the player has units in a 3 sector territory with the following split: 3/4/4. Can he take one unit from each sector to move them into a different territory (leaving the starting territory as 2/3/3)?


You started your move with 11 tokens in territory A. You then moved 3 tokens from territory A to territory B. This is fine.
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Tim Thorp
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They can be in in multiple sectors if you want, but it makes no difference. It's the territory that matters. As Moshe said, the sectors only matter in determining storm movement. Movement between sectors is meaningless, it's only movement between territories that counts.


Edit: Once again, I was beaten to the punch by a better answer!
 
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B C Z
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The real question is when/why would you do this?

That strategic/tactical advantage is there?

Specifics please.
 
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Matt Albritton
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Yeah, I thought about just saying that and then I deleted it. I figured they would come to that conclusion for themselves after some play time anyway.
 
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Brian Newman
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byronczimmer wrote:
The real question is when/why would you do this?

That strategic/tactical advantage is there?

Specifics please.


The only circumstance I can think of is if you are going after a spice blow, and you want to also send along a combat force to make another move later, and you're playing with advanced storm movement, and the place with the spice blow is exactly 6 sectors away from the storm's current position. You may want to commit a spice harvesting force to the spice but keep your combat force in the storm sector 7 sectors away.
 
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B C Z
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Blackberry wrote:
byronczimmer wrote:
The real question is when/why would you do this?

That strategic/tactical advantage is there?

Specifics please.


The only circumstance I can think of is if you are going after a spice blow, and you want to also send along a combat force to make another move later, and you're playing with advanced storm movement, and the place with the spice blow is exactly 6 sectors away from the storm's current position. You may want to commit a spice harvesting force to the spice but keep your combat force in the storm sector 7 sectors away.


Which can only be done at South Mesa. There is no other location where the spice blow is not the 'last' location in the territory.

And anyway, if you do that, you are guarenteed that someone will play weather control and ruin your day.
 
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Zsolt Nagy
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byronczimmer wrote:
The real question is when/why would you do this?

That strategic/tactical advantage is there?

Specifics please.


For us it came into the picture when a multi-sector rock territory was under the storm (at least a sector if it) than a battle occured in the same territory. Than it became quite important how to handle this as it influences the number of units participating in the battle. Not right when it happens, as then it is quite clear. But when you plan ahead.

Let's say again we have the 2/3/3 unit split in a 3 sector territory (rock). The storm might come over that territory without weather control in the next round. Than it is important to manage the forces in the different sectors before the storm arrives there to be prepared for a possible coming battle. If the storm stops over the middle sector you will have only 2 or 3 units in a battle if an opponent attacks one of the side sectors. If the storm sits over one of the side sectors you will have only 5 or 6 units to do battle. And it means a lot of difference. If 2 or 3 units got separated from the rest because of the storm they might be easy prey for an enemy attrition attack. Especially for Harkonnens who might capture a leader with a won battle, so they might be out to hunt for such opportunities.
 
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Moshe Callen
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The storm effects the whole territory because the storm is in it. No battle there is possible. My original comment is really all you need to take into account; the different sectors are not separate spaces.
 
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Dan The Man
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whac3 wrote:
The storm effects the whole territory because the storm is in it. No battle there is possible. My original comment is really all you need to take into account; the different sectors are not separate spaces.


Storm affects only sectors, not territories. You can have a battle in territories that have sectors under storm. Tokens under storm and opposing tokens separated by storm will not fight, however.

The rule about movement indicates you can only move INTO a single sector (IX.C.2.d), though no such limitation is made for shipments. Multiple moves into a territory could be made into separate sectors. I see no mention of a limitation on movement FROM several sectors in one territory out of that territory.

I can see that a player potentially subject to storm might wish to have tokens in more than one sector for flexibility purposes (including, but not limited to, dealing with Weather Control).
 
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B C Z
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I'm still not seeing a tactical reason to burn 2+ turns fighting over a specific ROCK. If two factions have troops in a sector split by storm, they simply don't fight this round. When the storm passes, if both factions stay put, then they'll fight the following round.

I'm sure that those troop movements could be better used going after spice, sietches or a different set of troops that aren't dealing with the storm.
 
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Zsolt Nagy
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byronczimmer wrote:
Blackberry wrote:
byronczimmer wrote:
The real question is when/why would you do this?

That strategic/tactical advantage is there?

Specifics please.


The only circumstance I can think of is if you are going after a spice blow, and you want to also send along a combat force to make another move later, and you're playing with advanced storm movement, and the place with the spice blow is exactly 6 sectors away from the storm's current position. You may want to commit a spice harvesting force to the spice but keep your combat force in the storm sector 7 sectors away.


Which can only be done at South Mesa. There is no other location where the spice blow is not the 'last' location in the territory.

And anyway, if you do that, you are guarenteed that someone will play weather control and ruin your day.


That's not true. Oh Gap/Old Gap and South Mesa have the Harvesters in the middle sector. Habbanya Erg, Wind Pass North and Cielago South have the Harvesters in its first sector (by CCW storm movement).
 
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