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BoardGameGeek» Forums » Gaming Related » Women and Gaming

Subject: Question from Lady to other ACTUAL Ladies rss

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Tony Chen
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I saw this post in my dorm elevator the other day. GIRLS I lost my ring in the shower room please call me if you find it. Needless to say I looked at it. Needless to say I am replying to this post. Needless to say I am not an ACTUAL lady. The "Women and Gaming" forum is the last place you'd expect a guy to not stick his head into. We probably check this forum with more diligency than any other forum on BGG.

I haven't read many of these threads, but do men actually blame women for not playing games with them? It's one thing to complain about women not playing with them, but it's another to blame the women for it. And I don't consider, "Women aren't gamers" to be sexist. I don't know if you've read more egregious ones but I don't find that one to be sexist.
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Bruce Murphy
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I only noticed this because it was on the front page, but it gave me Little Britain flashbacks. How interesting that certain words have been captured by popular culture.
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Shawn Riordan
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milkingcowselbow wrote:

a) About 70% the posts here seem to be from men.


I suspect that is also, roughly, the percentage of BGG members who are male.

milkingcowselbow wrote:

b) It is common for these post to leads to threads with discussion almost, if not entirely, with other men.


Same reason as above.

milkingcowselbow wrote:

c) There are many posts by the guys in this forum section that are along the lines of: Women won't play games with me (Insert sexist comment) and I can't figure out why (More sexist comments).


Can you describe which comments you find sexist?
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Louise Holden
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There was a long discussion as I recall when this forum was set up about whether it should be restricted to female posters. One of the main reasons why that policy wasn't adopted was the impossibility of enforcing it, given the general anarchy of many posters.

I don't get any sense that the men are crowding out the women, more that the women mostly don't have anything in particular to say which would fit here. Plenty of us post all over the rest of the site. Possibly men are more interested in the issues around women gaming than women are; we just play games. Certainly a lot of men seem to have a vested interest in seeing more women play...

The whole "My girlfriend won't play games" thing gets old fast, I agree. If the guys complaining had boyfriends they probably wouldn't play games either. There are far more non gamers in the world than there are gamers; odds are you're likely to be going out with one, regardless of gender.

I don't find BGG a particularly sexist site. There is the occasional post that makes me wince, but I suspect it makes most other readers wince too.

I'm not convinced that this particular forum is terribly useful to the site, and I think the relative paucity of postings here supports that; those postings that there are would fit fine somewhere else. I think it was originally intended as some sort of support network but I think that was always unlikely to materialise. We really don't have enough issues surrounding gender and gaming to support a forum like this. There's no glass ceiling in gaming, or problems in getting selected for teams; if we want to play game X we sit down and play it and we have exactly the same experience playing it as men do (with the possible exception of Twister).

Oh, and any statement that generalises about what "women" are like is likely to be sexist, and probably wrong. We are astonishingly diverse.




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Diane Close
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louiseh wrote:
I'm not convinced that this particular forum is terribly useful to the site, and I think the relative paucity of postings here supports that; those postings that there are would fit fine somewhere else. I think it was originally intended as some sort of support network but I think that was always unlikely to materialise.


Yeah, I agree with everything Louise has said, and addressing this particular statement, I think this forum was seen as more of a "Koffee Klatch" type networking forum when it was set up, and it's turned out that ChitChat is more like that in actual use. This forum was set up at the same time as "Gaming With Kids" and the "Do It Yourself", which were all supposed to help encourage such slightly off-topic, non-specific-game discussion. Prior to those forums being created, such things used to get "lost" pretty quickly in the general gaming forum.

That said, lack of use doesn't equate to completely useless. Some areas of this site get used a lot, others are havens for a few, and still others are rarely used but contain a few occasional gems. Once nice thing about having this forum, is the ability to post here knowing you'll be guaranteed some female readers. For example, if you were a game designer, trying to hit a specific female audience (say young women, age 21-28), then this might be a good place to start your research?

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Sue Hemberger

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Serves as a tub to the whale -- I think I see fewer sexist comments on other parts of the geek these days because this board now provides a natural locus for them.

That said, when NextinLine/Janice was around more, she started threads here that I enjoyed and that gave me a better sense of who the other game-playing women around here are. I enjoyed the more conversational nature of those threads (vs. the serial monologues punctuated by recurrent fights/pissing matches dynamic that sometimes prevails elsewhere on the site.)
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Anye Freer
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I'm still shaking my head though about why, when the OP clearly said she was asking the question of "actual ladies" so many men felt the need to post anyway.
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EGG Head
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Shrugs. I always look in this forum hoping to find some interesting topic but other than the introductory thread about who's who for women gamers and the obligatory who's going to be at what game event there is naught but the same old boring threads here about nongamer girlfriends and wives.I'm not sure why those posters expect women gamers to have insight into why nongamer women don't game...I don't understand it eithershake
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Tony Chen
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dietevil wrote:
I'm still shaking my head though about why, when the OP clearly said she was asking the question of "actual ladies" so many men felt the need to post anyway.

And I am shaking my head and rolling my eyes at the fact that the OP clearly asked a question, and you posted without actually answering it. God forbid.
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Rachelle Grein
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Here is my take:
I can talk about gaming with guys anytime I want to..there are plenty of them around here and irl. Same for mixed company. But sometimes I just want to talk with the gals..my every so often perusal of this forum reminds me that isn't easily done here.

anyone know of a very active women's forum/community with a diverse population and diverse spectrum of conversational topics going on where threads on board gaming might be welcome?






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Mystery McMysteryface
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I sometimes feel that the comments here and in other forums can be on the sexist side--women are complete dummies who can't understand/don't like anything complicated or requiring thought or confrontational, etc.

Most of the posts and responses are NOT sexist and are written in good faith, I believe.

Yes, men will always read & post in W&G forum--it doesn't bother me at all. I was attacked in a hostile manner by a female poster on one of my threads on this forum.........so, you never know!!

I am still a new user--9 months--and have learned to take all posts with a grain of salt and a sense of humor.

I guess that's why I love to hang around Chit Chat. Not taking anything seriously is WONDERFUL for the mind, body, soul!!!

Love,
Mrs.
kiss
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Colleen
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This forum should not exist. No one has ever clearly defined what belongs in this forum and pretty must everything should go to chit chat. The women and gaming forum should either be a place for women to talk - which it is not since we've seen threads moved (thinking of the gowns for gamers thread in particular) that women have started in this forum...or it should be a place for people to ask questions about women who like to game. Either way, I'm not sure that separating gender on the site serves any good.

I would like the admin to explain in detail what is the goal of this forum. What is inappropriate (will be moved to other forums) and what is on-topic? I've been on this site since this forum was created, and I still see no relevancy of a Women and Gaming forum to the rest of the site.
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Jess i TRON
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Well, I like it. The existence of this forum made me feel particularly welcome at BGG.

of course, clarification of which threads will be moved can't hurt.
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Nina Kin
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I actually made my way here from a very active mostly-women community with a diverse population and very diverse spectrum of conversational topics. While many of them are geeks/gamers, I think they are mostly of the computer/console gaming variety, however it may be that the board gamers come to BGG more to talk about board gaming. In fact, I only got into board gaming after 2 of the ladies at knitting night talked about the games they liked. Yes, this is the knitting community I'm talking about. It's really amazing how diverse and controversial they are. The website I'm referring to is: www.ravelry.com
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christine belsom
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I enjoy this forum and would be sad if it did not exist. Perhaps it does not actually have a black-and-white, delineated "purpose," but I think it encourages women to post who might not otherwise post at all. An online community is driven by its participants, and anything that might encourage more participation of any sort is a plus in my book.

Getting back to the original question, I have noticed all of the trends you mentioned at one time or another (a, b, and c), and sometimes I laugh or sometimes I am slightly disgusted. But we live in a world where the guy in the commercials gets rewarded with a Klondike bar for listening to his wife! Like it's a special achievement.

Gaming, like many specialized hobbies, occasionally attracts people who have social issues of one kind or another. The hobbies give them (us?) an environment in which they (we) can be free of some social concerns if they so choose. To be crude, well, let's say that we can't expect everyone to be great gamers AND extremely socially adept as well. I can train myself to be good at boardgames, but maybe training myself to be more charming would be difficult or even impossible. Still I could try to practice in a forum where I knew I could find the social situation I was seeking. In a way, it's like when your guy friend begins a question with, "Hey, you're a girl ..."
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John So-And-So
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dietevil wrote:
I'm still shaking my head though about why, when the OP clearly said she was asking the question of "actual ladies" so many men felt the need to post anyway.

Maybe we don't like being restricted because of our sex any more than you do.
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Eddie the Cranky Gamer
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Even though I do not have a vagina I would like to clarify for the good of the community that generalizations that rely on gender, while usually ignorant, are not by definition sexist.

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Lynette
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A, B and C are all valid observations.

However I still like this forum because sometimes there are some gems in here.

Also I don't think this site gets less male attention but it does get more female attention. And the site is so huge a place with some ablity to focus is good.
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Burster of Bubbles, Destroyer of Dreams.
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To be honest, I don't look in this forum very often because I don't find the concerns discussed here very relevant to me.

However, I realize that I'm a rare beast in having multiple gaming venues I can go to (public and private) where female gamers are a noticeable fraction of the population and are taken as seriously as they deserve.
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Adrienne
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While I understand the need for this forum, I grow tired of the crying about girlfriends/wives not gaming with their so's. Sorry, I don't have any insight on that. I know that I love gaming and certain games but not others. It is a hobby that does not speak to everyone.
Once in a great while there is a great post in this forum, other than that, not too much is happening.
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When it comes to havoc, I reek!
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I do want to add that I was surprised the first time I stuck my head in the Women in Gaming forum.

I was hoping to find a forum for Women in Gaming and instead I found a forum about Women in Gaming.

Not really what I was hoping for.

Men and women think differently and we have different needs.

Maybe the forum should be broken up into the to categories I mentioned above.

One for the men to talk about the girls and one for the ladies to talk about the boys! laugh
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EGG Head
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ChloeH wrote:
I do want to add that I was surprised the first time I stuck my head in the Women in Gaming forum.

I was hoping to find a forum for Women in Gaming and instead I found a forum about Women in Gaming.

Not really what I was hoping for.

Men and women think differently and we have different needs.

Maybe the forum should be broken up into the to categories I mentioned above.

One for the men to talk about the girls and one for the ladies to talk about the boys! laugh


Yeah, can't [they] start their own forum called 'girlfriends/wives' in gaming
and leave women gamers their own? although I'd really be much more interested to talk games than boys/husbands/men
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Dana Jacobs
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I'm surprised that Emily Howard hasn't come on here saying "But, I'm a lady, that likes to do lady things, and shit"
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Rachelle Grein
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I vaguely recall this forum being created as a consolation prize when some of us asked for a Women in Gaming guild..back when the guilds were new. don't know if it was the powers that be or an overabundance of geeks that did not want the women to have a guild here...whatever the case .. this is what we were allowed.

Maybe we needed to prove ourselves a vibrant community by utilizing this forum first... and maybe we will see a guild later... i can dream.


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M Hellyer
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Women are busy. Men aren't. That's why women will only play games that take 45 minutes or less and have fewer than 5 rules. Plus, my wife only plays games she can win 2/3 or more of the time.
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