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Subject: Do you play with River expansions? rss

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norman rule
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We also throw in the river pieces from the GQ expansion.
 
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Daniel Corban
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I have tried the river several times and it makes the game worse.
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PenumbraPenguin
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I find it mildly annoying to be restricted in where the river pieces can go (often 'wasting' a turn, when you don't want to place a meeple), and don't feel it adds that much. Still play with it occasionally - it doesn't hurt that much either.

This isn't for games with any particular number of players.
 
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Simon Lundström
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I hate the river. The wrap-around on the start and end easily creates this ultra-field of Doom, Destruction and No Return, netting too many points for the player in thiis/these fields. And even if people start setting on sabotaging those fields, too much work goes into preventing those placed into turning to mega-fields, so the game just crashes.

I could perhaps use the second river, but no to the first.
 
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Bruce Murphy
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I usually play with River I and II, using the variant suggested here of burying the end pieces to ensure the fork gets placed. We didn't find the giant wraparound field to happen, perhaps because with both rivers, it's typically longer.

B>
 
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norman rule
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Zimeon wrote:
I hate the river. The wrap-around on the start and end easily creates this ultra-field of Doom, Destruction and No Return, netting too many points for the player in thiis/these fields. And even if people start setting on sabotaging those fields, too much work goes into preventing those placed into turning to mega-fields, so the game just crashes.

I could perhaps use the second river, but no to the first.


Well, the second river wraps around as well. The artwork is just a bit different.

The River starting tile included in the GQ expansion has a road on the start tile that prevents wrap around fields.

Granted, the end tile from the River and one of the end tiles from River II still wrap around, but with almost 1 in 5 tiles having a road crossing the river, there's a reasonable chance that the wrap around bonus effect will be limited.

And if different people claim farms on opposite sides of the river, the wrap around tile starts farm wars very early and those players can spend a lot of resources fighting for control of the "ultra-field of Doom, Destruction and No Return." This limits them in many other ways.
 
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norman rule
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thepackrat wrote:
I usually play with River I and II, using the variant suggested here of burying the end pieces to ensure the fork gets placed.


I read a variant here that suggests starting WITH the fork and building out in all three directions. We haven't tried that yet, but I can see how that would change the dynamic of the game.
 
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Greg Payne
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mrorwell wrote:
I read a variant here that suggests starting WITH the fork and building out in all three directions. We haven't tried that yet, but I can see how that would change the dynamic of the game.

It makes it much messier. We played this 2 days in a row, with most of the tiles from River and River 2 (removing 1 FSFS and 2 FFSS tiles), with a basic start and end river tile, and the river end tile with the city on, and it splits things up a lot. The largest farm yesterday was 6 cities, and today it was 8 (scoring as 9 for including 1 besieged city), but a lot of other farms scored 5+ cities.
 
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Branko K.
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I use the big Carcassonne city from the Count expansion as a starting "tile", regardless of actually using the count. It works MUCH nicer then any of the rivers and completely eliminates the "big farm" syndrome.
 
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norman rule
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baba44713 wrote:
and completely eliminates the "big farm" syndrome.


I don't understand why so many people object to (potentially) big farms.

The larger the farm, the greater the opportunity for other players to "share" in it. The more players are in it, the greater the chance that one of them will escalate things and attempt to get a second, or even third, meeple in the field. The resulting ag wars can result in 2...3... even 4 players with 2 or 3 meeples in one field.

Even if they ALL share in that field equally at the end, they've all lost scoring potential during the rest of the game.

The largest field I've ever seen (with a full tower of tiles, plus the two rivers) was about 15 cities. Granted, that's 45 points, but with 2-3 meeples tied up for the bulk of the game, how many points are you losing from direct scoring?
 
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Chris Crosbie
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I find that the river(s) make the game far less confrontational at the beginning because players tend to start deploying meeples into various features early. When starting from just one tile, players tend to have a depth of meeples in their stores that they usually use to infringe on the new city that starts to pop up.

This is especially true when I play with my wife. She doesn't like the stealing part as much and the river encourages us to spend meeples on our own direct scoring opportunites rather than fighting for the same city.
 
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