Joshua Speelman
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I have a guy lined up with all three starter kits. I'm going to get them no matter what but I was wondering if between the three kits if all the rules are covered or will I still need the Core Rulebook eventually?
 
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Cosmo Kramer
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Yes you will. As far as I understand it there are things not covered in the Starter Kits that are in the rulebook (one is Bypass Movement if I remember correctly).
 
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Dan Dolan
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Go get the core rules and after your first ASLSK game use the regular rules. There are enough players around that are always willing to teach ASL. Are you near Northern NJ?

 
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Joshua Speelman
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Phlegm wrote:
Go get the core rules and after your first ASLSK game use the regular rules. There are enough players around that are always willing to teach ASL. Are you near Northern NJ?



No sir. I'm in Southeast MI.

So are you saying I should skip the starter kits and just buy the Core Rulebook? Does the Core Rulebook come with counters?
 
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Colin Hunter
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I'm going by your profile here, but full ASL (that is not the starter kits)seems like a bad idea. It comes with no counters or maps so you have to buy Beyond Valor as well. This will run you in excess of $170. Just get the starter kits, if you like it then move on to the full blown game. It is a massive investment and given by looking at your profile you haven't played any wargames before it is going to be an astronomical learning curve.

Each starter kit is complete in and of themselves. So you don't even need all three, you can get 1, 2 or 3 (you don't need all of them). If you like them you can then buy another one.

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Cosmo Kramer
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I have the rulebook and trust me on this. You will have a very difficult time learing the game just reading them. Get the starter kits, they will help you learn the basics and then slowly work the full rules into your play.

I'm in SE Michigan and am trying to learn ASL as well.
 
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Todd Pytel
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I'll echo Colin - you don't appear to have any idea what you're in for here. Buy SK1. Just SK1. See how that goes first before you lay down any more money.
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Martin Gallo
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After buying, reading and playing all 3 starter kits you will not have all the rules to 'full on' ASL, but you will have a terrific introduction to the system. The ASL rule book has 'more of the same' as the starter kits, a LOT more.

I agree that trying SK1 before you go any further is a good idea.

There was some resistance to the SKs in the beginning, because people felt that they might be being ripped off since all those counters, maps and scenarios would be useless if they then bought all the ASL rules/modules. This is not exactly true as there are plenty of ASL scenarios being published/released that use the maps, and the counters are still usable since they are identical to 'regular' ASL counters. The SK scenarios are mostly still playable under ASL rules, but there are some balance issues with some of them (from what I have been told). I found the SKs somewhat difficult to play because as a long time ASL player I go confused over what got left out, but still have had fun. They are a great way to learn a great system - wish they had been around 20 years ago!
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Scott
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Ditto on SK1. Get it and if you like it move on to SK2. SK3 is a big jump, and I would recommend playing on VASL so you can get some help. I learned full ASL from reading the book. Its tough but doable. When/if you learn full ASL, learn it like the SK's introduce the rules; infantry first, AFV's last. Just my 2 cents.

Scott
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Robert Wilson
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SK1 was one of the worst purchases I ever made, It has cost me about 2 grand in ASL gear and WW2 history books

Of course I'm just kidding, SK1 is probably one of the best wargame bargains of all time, around 20 dollars and a lot of fun and replayability , plus there are some great people here on BGG that are eager to help out.
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Joshua Speelman
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Thanks everyone for your help. I've ordered the first 2 starter kits and that should tide us over for a while. I informed my friend and he can't wait till they get here. I'm excited too. We both had a brush with Warhammer 40k a few years ago and never got the itch for a wargame out of our system. Thanks again for all the advice.
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eric hill
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Good Luck.
I actually do recommend the SK's.
Having not played SL for quite a few yrs and wanting to get into ASL when I ran across an SK at my FLGS I bought them slowly over about 6 months as I retrained my mind to think in wargaming terms/concepts.

When I felt I was ready I gave up my SK set to my nephew (who was my wargaming buddy at the point) and did the plunge into full ASL.

enjoy
ejh
 
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John Brady
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The first chapter of the full ASL rulebook is 60 pages of small text, written in a style uniquely as to be virtually incomprehensible to mere mortals .

You won't regret your decision to start with the ASLSKs. In the mean time, do yourself and your buddy a HUGE favor and look at Jay Richardson's tutorials. The first one is here http://www.boardgamegeek.com/filepage/35936

Grab the VASL mod and set the counters up and play along. By the time you have the games in hand, you'll be familiar with the concepts, and you'll spend a lot less time scratching your head in confusion, trust me.

Once again, I'll take the time to thank Jay for his incredibly well done ASLSK tutorials...he's done MMP a HUGE favor, not to mention all the folks who he's helped ease into the Starter Kits.
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Jason Johns
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Joshua the Gamer wrote:
I have a guy lined up with all three starter kits. I'm going to get them no matter what but I was wondering if between the three kits if all the rules are covered or will I still need the Core Rulebook eventually?


I have played ASL for years, though I did have a hiatus for about 10 years that ended recently. The best way to learn ASL is playing with someone who knows how. That is not always possible. However, there is something called VASL (virtual ASL) where you can play online simultaneously with another person(say with Skype or something like that). Check that out.

I have never played the SKs, so I can't comment on them. Some people like them and take that route first to "full" ASL. Others dive right into "full" ASL. You'll have to decide that for yourself.

There is some wisdom in the advice to just get SK1 and see if you like it. However, this goes strongly against the prevailing view of ASL products. That is "If it's out now, buy it NOW. Who knows when it'll be out again?" For example, the Japanese, Chinese, Marines modules have not been reprinted from the mid-90's. So, these two hypotheses are in conflict and then you have to add in the money factor to come up with what is most feasible for you. (For example Pegasus Bridge is $15 from MMP. They will probably never reprint it.)

Finally, there are a lot of people here and over at gamesquad.com/forums (click boardgames then ASL) and possibly consimworld, who are willing to answer questions for the newbies. Don't be afraid to utilize them. Also read through what is already posted. It can help in learning.

Therefore, welcome to ASL, whether the full-blown addiction or SK version. This is an awesome game that should give you years of enjoyment. Good luck in making your choices on it.

Jason

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Paul Kuykendall
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Joshua the Gamer wrote:
Thanks everyone for your help. I've ordered the first 2 starter kits and that should tide us over for a while. I informed my friend and he can't wait till they get here. I'm excited too. We both had a brush with Warhammer 40k a few years ago and never got the itch for a wargame out of our system. Thanks again for all the advice.


Fair warning... The difference between WH40k and ASL is vast. Where 40k is simplified down to almost complete abstractness while (full) ASL has a rule for pretty much everything. The starter kits cut almost all of the special/wierd conditions out which does help learning the mechanics and basic tactics. I'm pretty new to ASL myself (having gotten into it by borrowing a friend's copy of SK1 then buying SK2 myself) but it is an absolutely awesome game.

From one newbie to another here are some general thoughts:

1) You will mess up. It's okay, just learn from it.

2) If you play against anyone with any sort of experience with the game, you will loose. Alot. Badly. Roll with the punches as it will make your (eventual) victory that much sweeter.

3) Start small. SK1 is great for this. Infantry can do a lot of things. While vehicles are all sexy and such, the Poor Bloody Infantry are the ones that will carry the day.

4) Read the rules on terrain. Then read them again. And again. They aren't that complex, but the concept of Terrain Effects Modifiers (TEM) is crucial to the survival of your troops. Carefully advancing through cover is good. Taking a stroll in the open is bad.

5) Related to the above, if you are opposing someone with a dug-in mortar at the top of a level 3 hill, stay out of the woods!!! Mortars firing against guys in woods hexes get a bonus to their ability to hurt you. It sucks. Bad. Trust me on this. I had it done to me a couple of weeks ago.

6) The most important thing of all, though is have fun. I know I have!

If any experienced hands out there have any contradictions to the above, please post them. That way I can learn more too!!!!

/Paul
 
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Jason Johns
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pkuyken wrote:
Joshua the Gamer wrote:
Thanks everyone for your help. I've ordered the first 2 starter kits and that should tide us over for a while. I informed my friend and he can't wait till they get here. I'm excited too. We both had a brush with Warhammer 40k a few years ago and never got the itch for a wargame out of our system. Thanks again for all the advice.


Fair warning... The difference between WH40k and ASL is vast. Where 40k is simplified down to almost complete abstractness while (full) ASL has a rule for pretty much everything. The starter kits cut almost all of the special/wierd conditions out which does help learning the mechanics and basic tactics. I'm pretty new to ASL myself (having gotten into it by borrowing a friend's copy of SK1 then buying SK2 myself) but it is an absolutely awesome game.

From one newbie to another here are some general thoughts:

1) You will mess up. It's okay, just learn from it.

2) If you play against anyone with any sort of experience with the game, you will loose. Alot. Badly. Roll with the punches as it will make your (eventual) victory that much sweeter.

3) Start small. SK1 is great for this. Infantry can do a lot of things. While vehicles are all sexy and such, the Poor Bloody Infantry are the ones that will carry the day.

4) Read the rules on terrain. Then read them again. And again. They aren't that complex, but the concept of Terrain Effects Modifiers (TEM) is crucial to the survival of your troops. Carefully advancing through cover is good. Taking a stroll in the open is bad.

5) Related to the above, if you are opposing someone with a dug-in mortar at the top of a level 3 hill, stay out of the woods!!! Mortars firing against guys in woods hexes get a bonus to their ability to hurt you. It sucks. Bad. Trust me on this. I had it done to me a couple of weeks ago.

6) The most important thing of all, though is have fun. I know I have!

If any experienced hands out there have any contradictions to the above, please post them. That way I can learn more too!!!!

/Paul


I'd have two more.

7) As you get into "full" ASL you're going to find a rule that stumps you. Make a note of it. Take your best guess on how to play it, then ask later. Don't take 45 minutes looking up a rule.

4a) or 8) Move in SMALL groups. period. Try to never move in stacks. One at a time...one at a time...one at a time. (Say that over and over.)

Good luck.

 
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Joshua Speelman
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Another question that I thought of. Once(if) I go into full blown ASL will the counters and maps from the SKs become obsolete or will they supplement the rest of the modules? Thanks again for all the help.

Joshua
 
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Alpha Mastrano
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I don't know any published full ASL scenarios that use the SK maps (SK maps are generally simpler, with fewer 'funky' terrain features), but they can definitely be used for homebrews.

Counters are totally compatible. Full ASL uses the same counters as SK, with some extra rules (see those guys with underscored range? They can use Spraying Fire in full ASL!), so they will certainly come in handy. More counters = good!
 
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Imago wrote:
I don't know any published full ASL scenarios that use the SK maps (SK maps are generally simpler, with fewer 'funky' terrain features), but they can definitely be used for homebrews.

Counters are totally compatible. Full ASL uses the same counters as SK, with some extra rules (see those guys with underscored range? They can use Spraying Fire in full ASL!), so they will certainly come in handy. More counters = good!


I don't have the SKs, I only do full ASL. But a buddy of mine got one of the SKs that has British, because it's hard to get the British "core" ASL module right now. It's in reprint.
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Robert Wilson
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Thats a good idea on the UK stuff!

SK2 has



and SK3 has


 
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iamspamus wrote:
I don't have the SKs, I only do full ASL. But a buddy of mine got one of the SKs that has British, because it's hard to get the British "core" ASL module right now. It's in reprint.


Excellent point!
 
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Stephen Stewart
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martimer wrote:
After buying, reading and playing all 3 starter kits you will not have all the rules to 'full on' ASL, but you will have a terrific introduction to the system. The ASL rule book has 'more of the same' as the starter kits, a LOT more.

I agree that trying SK1 before you go any further is a good idea.

There was some resistance to the SKs in the beginning, because people felt that they might be being ripped off since all those counters, maps and scenarios would be useless if they then bought all the ASL rules/modules. This is not exactly true as there are plenty of ASL scenarios being published/released that use the maps, and the counters are still usable since they are identical to 'regular' ASL counters. The SK scenarios are mostly still playable under ASL rules, but there are some balance issues with some of them (from what I have been told). I found the SKs somewhat difficult to play because as a long time ASL player I go confused over what got left out, but still have had fun. They are a great way to learn a great system - wish they had been around 20 years ago!


The main thing you have to consider when learning the SK system is that you will just have a taste of ASL. You will be eating a hamburger without the Dijon mustard with kosher pickles.

Although, the hamburger will still be cooked to your desire and satisfy your immediate hunger needs, you will be wanting that extra special flavor that will arouse your taste buds and cause you to be engourged beyond saving.

 
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