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Subject: Official Rules Correction for Step 3 rss

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Henning Kröpke
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To stop the confusion about the rules change in the actual boxes of Power Grid regarding the beginnig of Step 3 and shuffling the power plant draw stack, these are the correct rules as of February 2009.

The complete rules are already uploaded at the Rio Grande Website (on page 7 you find the "new" version number 02/2009). The next print run will include this rules version.


Step 3:
When the »Step 3« card is drawn from the draw stack, step 3 begins at the beginning of the subsequent phase of the game. This can happen in one of three ways:

1. If the »Step 3« card is drawn in phase 2 (Auction Power Plants), treat the card as the highest power plant and place it at the end of the future market. Immediately shuffle the draw stack with the remaining power plants (the power plants that were placed under the draw stack during steps 1 and 2 of the game), and place it face down next to the game board. Continue the auction of power plants and draw replacements as necessary until all players have their chance to buy a new power plant or pass. After finishing phase 2, remove the lowest numbered power plant and the »Step 3« card from the market and do not draw replacements! Step 3 starts in phase 3.

2. If the »Step 3« card is drawn in phase 4 (Building) for replacements of too small power plants, remove this card and the smallest numbered power plant from the game and do not draw replacements. Shuffle the draw stack with the remaining power plants and place it face down next to the game board. Step 3 starts in phase 5.

3. If the »Step 3« card is drawn in phase 5 (Bureaucracy), remove this card and the lowest numbered power plant from the game and do not draw replacements. Shuffle the draw stack with the remaining power plants and place it face down next to the game board. Step 3 starts immediately.

During step 3, there are only 6 power plants in the power plant market and all of these power plants are in the actual market and are available to be auctioned (there is no future market in step 3).

In step 3, every city can have three houses. The building price for the third house is 20 Elektro. Please check the tables for the changed re-supply of resources.

In phase 5 in following rounds of step 3: remove the smallest numbered power plant from the game and draw a replacement from the draw stack. During the last rounds of the game, it is possible that the draw stack becomes exhausted. The game continues and in each phase 5, the players remove the smallest numbered power plant. It is possible to run out of power plants if this goes on for several rounds.


Sorry again for this confusion, have fun with Power Grid!

Henning Kröpke
(for 2F-Spiele & Rio Grande Games)
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Mike Jones
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Thank you, but I must have missed some other change.

If we take all the 'remaining plants' after setting up the first 8 plants and shuffle those with the '13' on top and 'step 3'. Then during the game we are either 'removing from play' or placing under the 'step 3'. Then when we get to the 'step 3' card, isn't the only cards left those that were placed under the 'step 3' card.

"...Immediately shuffle the draw stack with the remaining power plants (the power plants that were placed under the draw stack during steps 1 and 2 of the game)..."

Hasn't the 'draw stack' been drained down to only those plants place under during steps 1 and 2? Where did the second stack of cards come from?
 
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David desJardins
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Guantanamo wrote:
"...Immediately shuffle the draw stack with the remaining power plants (the power plants that were placed under the draw stack during steps 1 and 2 of the game)..."

Hasn't the 'draw stack' been drained down to only those plants place under during steps 1 and 2? Where did the second stack of cards come from?


I don't think he mentioned a second stack. "The draw stack with the remaining power plants" all refers to that one stack. The word "with", here, has the same meaning as "containing".
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Mike Jones
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Oh! ... to me it's telling me to shuffle the 'draw stack' with the 'remaining power plants that were placed under the step 3'.

And at this point in my games it's one and the same. The draw stack IS only the remaining power plants. So, I don't see that I'm shuffling it with anything, I would have just shuffled "the draw stack of the remaining plants that were under the 'step 3' card".

So, that's why I was asking, it now has me trying to figure out if there are two stacks and where it's coming from, and I've been rereading the rules trying find if there was anywhere where it might have been placed randomly in a bottom stack to give a more varied start.



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Chaddyboy
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Yeah, while I knew what it meant from playing the game enough, saying "The draw stack with the remaining power plants" is confusing. It might be clearer if it just said "shuffle the draw stack".
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Rod Spade
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This sounds like the way I've always played. What changed?
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Bill Bass
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If I am reading this correctly, and remembering the original rules correctly, I do not remember there being an instruction to shuffle the power plant cards at any time after the initial setup for the game. Over the course of the game, plants would be cycled to the bottom of the stack, under the Stage 3 card. Once the Stage 3 card appeared, it would be dealt with appropriately (depending upon when it appeared), then you would just continue through the cards that had been cycled to the bottom of the deck earlier in the game. Apparently, it was decided that this added an undesirable memory element to the game, since someone could now know which card was due to come up next if they remembered the order in which the cards had been placed on the bottom of the stack. Shuffling the deck after the Stage 3 card appears would insure that although the players may know which cards are still in that deck, they would not know the order in which they will be appearing.

 
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Mike Jones
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Tazzmann wrote:
If I am reading this correctly, and remembering the original rules correctly, I do not remember there being an instruction to shuffle the power plant cards at any time after the initial setup for the game. Over the course of the game, plants would be cycled to the bottom of the stack, under the Stage 3 card. Once the Stage 3 card appeared, it would be dealt with appropriately (depending upon when it appeared), then you would just continue through the cards that had been cycled to the bottom of the deck earlier in the game. Apparently, it was decided that this added an undesirable memory element to the game, since someone could now know which card was due to come up next if they remembered the order in which the cards had been placed on the bottom of the stack. Shuffling the deck after the Stage 3 card appears would insure that although the players may know which cards are still in that deck, they would not know the order in which they will be appearing.



That's how I remember it too. But, I pulled the 'old rule book' out and it's in there. It's just a line farther down amongst other instructions on Step 3 after describing that there isn't a future market. So, I guess they pulled it up higher into the specific instructions on preparing the deck to make it more obvious. I don't recall us reshuffling.


 
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The rules have always mentioned shuffling the deck after Stage 3 is revealed. What is clarified (I think) is when you draw S3 during auction, you must immediately reshuffle. The original rules could be read as reshuffling only at the end of the auction.
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Sorry Bill, there has always been an instruction to shuffle the deck for Step 3.

As far as I can tell, these "changes" just make explicit and very, very detailed what you always should have been doing.

Now, is there a ruling on the wording that appeared in the Rio Grande rules a while ago (previous reprint?) that some people are interpreting to let you build through connections that are in out-of-play regions back into in-play cities?

 
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vialiy wrote:
The rules have always mentioned shuffling the deck after Stage 3 is revealed. What is clarified (I think) is when you draw S3 during auction, you must immediately reshuffle. The original rules could be read as reshuffling only at the end of the auction.


Yep.

We interpreted it that way for a while, until contact with others, and a quick email to Jay, clarified things.

 
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David Bell
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For those that missed the discussion, it's storytime!
The original rules were effectively the same as this, except they did not specifically say to shuffle the draw pile immediately.
Quote:
If the »Step 3« card is drawn in phase 2 (Auction Power Plants), treat the card as the highest power plant and place it at the end of the future market. After finishing phase 2, remove the lowest power plant and the »Step 3« card and do not draw replacements! Step 3 starts in phase 3.

Strictly speaking, the draw pile doesn't get reshuffled until step 3, which happened after the auction phase was done.

Later, RGG changed the rule so that you don't replace plants AT ALL for the rest of the auction after step 3 is flipped up.
Quote:
If the »Step 3« card is drawn in phase 2 (Auction Power Plants), treat the card as the highest power plant and place it at the end of the future market. During the remainder of phase 2, do not replace power plants that are purchased. After finishing phase 2, remove the lowest numbered power plant and the »Step 3« card from the market and do not draw replacements! Step 3 starts in phase 3.

This made it so that previously removed plants couldn't possibly be made available to anyone on that turn, but notice the rule doesn't actually say anything about filling the market back up to 6 after the auction is done... The general rules for step 3, that there are always 6 plants in the market (or as many plants are left in the game, anyway) kick in, though.

This most recent update changes it back to continuing to draw replacements during the auction step, but makes it clear that you immediately shuffle the draw stack.
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Bill Bass
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I stand corrected. Thanks for setting me straight!
 
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Peter Kruijt
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What (also) changed, I think, is point 3, when the step 3 card is drawn during the bureaucracy phase. Step 3 now starts immediately, and resources are resupplied as indicated in the step 3 column of the supply table. In the previous version of the (German) rules, resources were resupplied using the step 2 columns.

This seems to be an exception to the
Quote:

...step 3 begins at the beginning of the subsequent phase of the game...

general rule stated at the top of the rules change.

Peter
 
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Mik Svellov
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rodspade wrote:
This sounds like the way I've always played. What changed?


For a brief period, there was another set of rules - actually in the latest printrun of the RGG version
(see this thread - among others).
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peterk wrote:
What (also) changed, I think, is point 3, when the step 3 card is drawn during the bureaucracy phase. Step 3 now starts immediately, and resources are resupplied as indicated in the step 3 column of the supply table. In the previous version of the (German) rules, resources were resupplied using the step 2 columns.

This seems to be an exception to the
Quote:

...step 3 begins at the beginning of the subsequent phase of the game...

general rule stated at the top of the rules change.


Except "immediately" is still *after* the resources have been replenished, so you are still replenishing in Step 2. If they want to make *that* change, they'd need to actually *say* that.
 
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Evan Stegman
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I am making a little card to throw in the box.

Is this right?:




(I've already added an 'If' at the start of the header and spaced the lines of the lists a bit further apart that are not in the version shown)
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Randall Bart
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EvanMinn wrote:
Is this right?:


I always tell people that the change of step occurs at the end of the phase. The word "immediately" in your Phase 5 text violates this principle, and causes you to add explanatory text. Step 3 starts with Phase 1 of the next turn.
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Evan Stegman
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Barticus88 wrote:

I always tell people that the change of step occurs at the end of the phase. The word "immediately" in your Phase 5 text violates this principle, and causes you to add explanatory text. Step 3 starts with Phase 1 of the next turn.


That would probably be clearer.

I added that because that was the first question I had when I read the OP and I went and looked it up to see if the rules specify an order to restocking and market manipulation (since it usually doesn't matter, frequently we have them (and adjusting turn order) happen simultaneously with different players taking care of different chores).

Just saying it starts with Phase 1 of the next turn would mean you don't have to know restocking comes before market manipulation.
 
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fnord23 wrote:
peterk wrote:
What (also) changed, I think, is point 3, when the step 3 card is drawn during the bureaucracy phase. Step 3 now starts immediately, and resources are resupplied as indicated in the step 3 column of the supply table. In the previous version of the (German) rules, resources were resupplied using the step 2 columns.

This seems to be an exception to the
Quote:

...step 3 begins at the beginning of the subsequent phase of the game...

general rule stated at the top of the rules change.


Except "immediately" is still *after* the resources have been replenished, so you are still replenishing in Step 2. If they want to make *that* change, they'd need to actually *say* that.

But in the original German rules, replenishing being still part of phase 2 was explicitly stated. Now it is left out and 2 paragraphs later, it is emphasized that replenishing in phase 3 is different.

I (now) agree with you that replenishing should still be done as a phase 2 action, but to me, this part has not become clearer in the current rewording.
 
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Eric Kwei
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EvanMinn wrote:
I am making a little card to throw in the box.

Nice work. I printed and cut out the relevant section from the "new" rules and taped it over the equivalent section in my "old" rules.
 
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Chris,

I'm not sure where in the rules that others are interpreting that they may connect through out of play cities, but both copies of the rules I have (2007 and 2009) on page 4, second to last paragraph state:

", but he may not use connections through cities in areas not in the game."

Rusty
 
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Yeah, I went looking for the thread after my post, but couldn't find it. AIR, it was posted back when deleting the original post deleted the entire thread, so it may just be gone. Or it's hiding out there somewhere... ;)

It was after one of the rule revisions...and it required a fairly twisted (IMO) parsing of the changed wording; but I've run into more than one person who should know better that believes that change enables play through out-of-play cities.

 
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badgeguy wrote:
", but he may not use connections through cities in areas not in the game."

That rule was added in the 2007 printing. It was pretty vague before.
 
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