Recommend
5 
 Thumb up
 Hide
21 Posts

Advanced Squad Leader» Forums » General

Subject: Critical Hit's Scam rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Lawrence Davis
United States
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I ordered some personal named counters from the Critical Hit website. Sad to say, 5 months later I have nothing for my $20, and they aren't returning my email inquiries.

Be warned. The personal counters are a scam!!
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
John Brady
United States
Arlington
Virginia
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I've dealt directly with Critical Hit in the past...while they may be a tad slow from time to time, I've never been ripped off. I'm really surprised to hear this.

2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Thompson
United States
Homewood
Illinois
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Well, I've been ripped off by CH, but that was many years ago (pre-BGG, if you can believe time existed before that).

But still, give them some time to answer your emails. Perhaps even a phone call is in order. I'm pretty sure they are not in business today to take people's money for nothing.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Todd Pytel
United States
Chicago
Illinois
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Yeah... CH is an odd company sometimes, but they're in it for the long haul. No way they're simply going to take your money and run. Are you sure your emails aren't getting caught in a spam filter? Have you tried a phone call?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Isaac Citrom
Canada
Montreal
Quebec
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
DocD wrote:
I ordered some personal named counters from the Critical Hit website. Sad to say, 5 months later I have nothing for my $20, and they aren't returning my email inquiries.

Be warned. The personal counters are a scam!!


Lawrence, this is par for the course for CH. Go to ConsimWorld to the CH forum. Post such a comment and Ray will have his wife contact you immediately. Works every time; he hates bad press (he has earned so much over the years). However, tone down your comment and make it more polite. Don't imply a scam. Ray is quite the geeky type and you have to treat him as such. He frequently flies off the handle and you don't want to be banned by him if you want continued support from CH. "The customer is always right" is not a creed he subscribes to.
.
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Lawrence Davis
United States
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Well, I'm glad to report that I did receive a refund today from Critical Hit. It would seem though, I'm banned from ordering from them again (or at least that's what the message said that came along with my refund), but I'm happy that they realized, that 5 months after placing my order, I was very unhappy, and they decided to just refund me my money and cut ties.

I do hate that it ended the way it did because I was so looking forward to getting those personal named counters. But maybe it's not right to charge up front for something you know or even guess might take more than three months to deliver. (and NO, I wouldn't have even bothered to place an order if I knew it would take that long). In today's age of quick internet scams, it's best not to have the customer guessing.

Hell, even Paypal, who I have always trusted to resolve disputes, can't help you after 45 days, so SELLER beware. Send item ASAP.

Anyway, I appreciate the responses and again am glad to report that Critical Hit DID NOT SCAM ME!!
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Isaac Citrom
Canada
Montreal
Quebec
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I told you. Banned. You're a baaaad boy!

And, it doesn't at all take 5 months. CH is a mom & pop shop. Your order probably just got misplaced.

As for taking orders without having stock on the horizon, that's also par for the course for CH. Ray does it all the time. Go to his web site. Everything is always "in stock". The order will go through even though a next printing isn't even yet contemplated and then you're left wondering what the hell is happening for months and months. Yours is one of many identical stories.
.
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Lawrence Davis
United States
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
isaacc wrote:
I told you. Banned. You're a baaaad boy!

And, it doesn't at all take 5 months. CH is a mom & pop shop. Your order probably just got misplaced.
I too would have believed that would have been the case, except for the fact that I had emailed them one month after ordering and again a month after that, so they knew I had an order for at least 2 or 3 months.
Quote:

As for taking orders without having stock on the horizon, that's also par for the course for CH. Ray does it all the time. Go to his web site. Everything is always "in stock". The order will go through even though a next printing isn't even yet contemplated and then you're left wondering what the hell is happening for months and months. Yours is one of many identical stories.
.
Yeah, I don't have a problem with ordering from dealers that need time to actually fabricate the merchandise. My problem is when they aren't up front with their customers about that very fact. Maybe they won't get as many sells and I can understand that, but to have a customer thinking they are going to receive something in 30 days, when the seller really knows it might be 6 months is just wrong. And I too have "customers" who ask me about services, and I always try to be upfront. If they take their business elsewhere so be it, but I have never gotten anybody back saying "you never said it was going to take this long!"
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jason Johns
United States
Unspecified
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Nah, I'd guess that it wasn't misplaced. When I emailed them about the personal leader counters, the lady said that they would hold them until there were enough to print a set. No skullduggery or scam. Just business.


isaacc wrote:
I told you. Banned. You're a baaaad boy!

And, it doesn't at all take 5 months. CH is a mom & pop shop. Your order probably just got misplaced.

As for taking orders without having stock on the horizon, that's also par for the course for CH. Ray does it all the time. Go to his web site. Everything is always "in stock". The order will go through even though a next printing isn't even yet contemplated and then you're left wondering what the hell is happening for months and months. Yours is one of many identical stories.


DocD wrote:
Yeah, I don't have a problem with ordering from dealers that need time to actually fabricate the merchandise. My problem is when they aren't up front with their customers about that very fact. Maybe they won't get as many sells and I can understand that, but to have a customer thinking they are going to receive something in 30 days, when the seller really knows it might be 6 months is just wrong. And I too have "customers" who ask me about services, and I always try to be upfront. If they take their business elsewhere so be it, but I have never gotten anybody back saying "you never said it was going to take this long!"
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
William Crispin
United States
Wilmington
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Yes, I think the problem is that it may not be clear that they do them with a print run of counters. They do not run a set off for you when you order them. I would suspect that 4-6 months is average but it depends on what is in the pipeline.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Isaac Citrom
Canada
Montreal
Quebec
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb

Ray has a horrible reputation in the ASL community. He's been involved in several lawsuits between himself and people associated with MMP. However, I have never heard of him scamming consumers as such, for example false charges to credit cards or something like that.

He's the quintessential geek. Part of that is that he lacks social skills in a big way. He doesn't communicate well and he's always right, period. Stacked on top of that is Ray's penchant for rules lawyering with his marketing, "the page never actually said it was in stock." Most if not all of the problems people have would disappear if he were more forthright with his advertizing, "be advised, your custom ASL counters may well take 6 months to arrive as we print them in batches..."

This geeky narcissism combines with his refusal as a businessman to take even a ten cent loss. Any retail businessman gives a little something to a consumer to smooth out any misunderstandings, which are a normal part of doing business with the public. He's right after all, if you take my meaning.

The net effect is that there is a strong community that just loves his ATS system to death. Most customers are well served by Critical Hit. Along with that is a regular and steady stream of customers who have had problems with Ray. The problems invariably turn into being "banned" by Ray. Frankly, I have never heard of this before, this general practice of banning customers with whom you have a problem. It's quite childish.

So, I don't see that CH are scammers. However, doing business with Ray is walking on eggshells lest you upset him and get banned. Sound familiar?!


I got banned myself. I purchased a couple of ATS products from my FLGS off the shelf. Inline with Ray's hiding of information, the boxes contained no indication of version. Apparently they were on the shelf a long time. My components were generations behind the current state of the ATS system. As a consumer I thought I was getting the latest version or something near it. Why would I not think that.

I called CH and Ray's wife said no problem, they'd bring me up-to-date, or so I thought. Ray agreed to replace the rules but I was left with other old components.

When I inquired about "the rest," check out what happened. Ray's wife calls me long distance to Montreal. At first I thought, wow that's incredible customer service. I think Ray was by the phone too. She was quite flustered and actually called me, a customer, long distance, to berate me over the telephone, "I never said this and I never said that...you're a liar" I think Ray gave his wife an earful.

I was speechless. I responded, "OK, nevermind, that's fine, don't worry about it..." You know, the tone and language when you're confronted by what you take to be a crazy person. I got into a little back and forth via email with Ray and got banned. Sounds like a soap opera, doesn't it.

I washed my hands of CH and ATS and traded away my two games. I haven't been to the principal's office in a good long while. I don't think Ray and his wife are cheats, just weird in a dysfunctional family sort of way.
.
12 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Yeackle
United States
San Luis Obispo
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
isaacc wrote:
Frankly, I have never heard of this before, this general practice of banning customers with whom you have a problem. It's quite childish.


We usually don't overtly ban anyone*, but we have an unwritten list of people we try not to sell to. It takes a lot to get on the list, and your instance and the OPs as described are a million miles away from what it takes to even get close.

* Exceptions are people who are removed/banned from the building or property by security and/or police due to theft, vandalism, assault, and/or battery.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Cory C
Canada
Ottawa
ON
flag msg tools
badge
100% FUN
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Sounds like the Soup Nazi from Seinfeld.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Shane Woyak
United States
Stevens Point
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
Everybody POLKA!
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
NO GAME FOR YOU!
3 
 Thumb up
0.01
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Isaac Citrom
Canada
Montreal
Quebec
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb

It's amusing but that's what happens. If you piss off Ray, you get a "no game for you". Freaky.
.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Isaac Citrom
Canada
Montreal
Quebec
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
jyeackle wrote:
isaacc wrote:
Frankly, I have never heard of this before, this general practice of banning customers with whom you have a problem. It's quite childish.


We usually don't overtly ban anyone*, but we have an unwritten list of people we try not to sell to. It takes a lot to get on the list, and your instance and the OPs as described are a million miles away from what it takes to even get close.

* Exceptions are people who are removed/banned from the building or property by security and/or police due to theft, vandalism, assault, and/or battery.


That's the second time now that a person from Critical Hit has called me a liar. You guys need to join us in reality. Based on what I have read about Ray's shannanigans over the years, personally I would hold my tongue and not so easily call people liars.
.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Yeackle
United States
San Luis Obispo
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
isaacc wrote:
jyeackle wrote:
isaacc wrote:
Frankly, I have never heard of this before, this general practice of banning customers with whom you have a problem. It's quite childish.


We usually don't overtly ban anyone*, but we have an unwritten list of people we try not to sell to. It takes a lot to get on the list, and your instance and the OPs as described are a million miles away from what it takes to even get close.

* Exceptions are people who are removed/banned from the building or property by security and/or police due to theft, vandalism, assault, and/or battery.


That's the second time now that a person from Critical Hit has called me a liar. You guys need to join us in reality. Based on what I have read about Ray's shannanigans over the years, personally I would hold my tongue and not so easily call people liars.
.


Ummm, please read again! I don't work for Critical Hit. I was referring to where I work since we do ban people from time to time as needed. But like I said, it'd take a lot to be banned, nothing like what was described by you or the OP.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Isaac Citrom
Canada
Montreal
Quebec
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
jyeackle wrote:
isaacc wrote:
jyeackle wrote:
isaacc wrote:
Frankly, I have never heard of this before, this general practice of banning customers with whom you have a problem. It's quite childish.


We usually don't overtly ban anyone*, but we have an unwritten list of people we try not to sell to. It takes a lot to get on the list, and your instance and the OPs as described are a million miles away from what it takes to even get close.

* Exceptions are people who are removed/banned from the building or property by security and/or police due to theft, vandalism, assault, and/or battery.


That's the second time now that a person from Critical Hit has called me a liar. You guys need to join us in reality. Based on what I have read about Ray's shannanigans over the years, personally I would hold my tongue and not so easily call people liars.
.


Ummm, please read again! I don't work for Critical Hit. I was referring to where I work since we do ban people from time to time as needed. But like I said, it'd take a lot to be banned, nothing like what was described by you or the OP.


OK, I get where/how I misread. Thanks for pointing it out.
.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Fabian Schneider
Germany
Hannover
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Wow. Banning online customers? I think even the mention of supporting that practice gets you booted from any business school anywhere.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Neil Amoore
South Africa
Benoni
Gauteng
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
monsterfurby wrote:
Wow. Banning online customers? I think even the mention of supporting that practice gets you booted from any business school anywhere.


Except perhaps at Dunder Mifflin....

In fairness to CH!, I also ordered the personal leader counter sets early in 2008 and was told, very politely, by Maureen that they would be held over for another counter run. I was immediately refunded. It's the inconsistency in the replies that seem to get to most people, I'd guess.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Lawrence Davis
United States
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Well, at first I thought it was bad that I got banned, but after some thought..... to hell with Ray and Maureen.

They are the ones that are not being TRUTHFUL with their customers! If it's going to take 3, 4, 5 or whatever months, they should say that in their fine print....not that endless "your order is on the next batch".

They can ban me all they want because I just BANNED CRITICAL HIT from any future purchasing!!
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.