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A few years ago I bought the Final Edition.
Does to moves and a new child I didn't get to pull it out and start playing.
Now I have time and I need clarity on what the main countersheets include.
I remember playing WiF years ago and the group we played with had PiF. It seems to me that the air units included in the final edition are the same ones. Is PiF now part of the basic countersheets, or is there a separate PiF still as well? (I know there is a distinct CPiF as well.)
Likewise, are the ships in countersheets 1-6 the SiF units? It would make sense given that the Final Edition set also cam with Cruisers in Flames, but it would be good to have this confirm.
Thanks,
Matty
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Patrick Bauer
United States
Reading
Pennsylvania
Waste Water too
Mid-Atlantic Air Museum
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WiFFE includes:
WiF classic
Africa Aflame
Asia Aflame
Planes in Flames
Ships in Flames
Mech in Flames
& I believe Leaders in Flames (at least I have the counters and don't remember buying it)
You should be able to differentiate the classic planes from PiF ones by the back of the counter. The Classic planes have both the cost and the clock on the back, PiF planes have just the lower cost on the back. You play with on set or the other.
Like wise the Classic ships are different from the SiF ones. The Classics have 2 capital ship names on each counter, SiF has one counter for each ship.
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Isaac Citrom
Canada
Montreal
Quebec
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Matthew here is some information from a text file on Patrice Forno's WiF website. There you will find all the information you want about WiF and what's the latest and greatest. Pay special attention to the Excel spreadsheet that you can download. It organizes every single counter in the WiF universe.
(CS stands for counter sheet)
WiF FE Kit CS# Latest Previous
WiF FE Classic (1-6) 2003 1997, 1996
Planes in Flames (7-9) 2007 2000, 1996, 1993, 1992
Fatal Alliances II (10-12) 1993 -
Days of Decision II/III (13) 2007 2000, 1993
Africa Aflame (14) 2003 1997, 1994, 1993
Asia Aflame (15) 2003 1997, 1994, 1993
Days of Decision II (16) 1994 -
Days of Decision II/III (17) 2007 1994
Ships in Flames (18) 2007 2000, 1995
Ships in Flames (19-22) 2007 1997, 1995
Mech in Flames (23) 2007 1995
WiF FE Classic (24) 2007 2000, 1996
Leaders in Flames (25) 1998 -
America in Flames (26-28) 1998 -
Carrier Planes in Flames (29) 1998 -
Politics in Flames (30) 2000 -
Patton in Flames (31-35) 2000 -
Cruisers in Flames (36-37) 2003 -
Convoys in Flames (37-38) 2003 -
Factories in Flames (39) 2008 -
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That's a pretty comprehensive site.
OK, so my FE doesn't have hips, Planes, Leaders or Mech in Flames.
Might need to get Planes in Flames and Ships in Flames, the others seem marginal.
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Isaac Citrom
Canada
Montreal
Quebec
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kissybooboo wrote: That's a pretty comprehensive site.
OK, so my FE doesn't have hips, Planes, Leaders or Mech in Flames.
Might need to get Planes in Flames and Ships in Flames, the others seem marginal.
Matthew, I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the other countersheets and kits as "marginal". It is of course quite subjective. There are some people who say that anything beyong the 7 countersheets of WiF Classic is unnecessary chrome. On the other hand there are many more people who view the entire system as a whole and quite like all of it, as do I.
WiF has been evolving for a long time and continues to evolve adding more and more aspects to perhaps the best WWII simulation. People looking for a comprehensive simulation appreciate the broadness of the treatment. On the other hand those people looking for a faster WWII game don't mind at all that their lighter game of choice is highly stylized and abstracted.
So, it depends on your gaming tastes. I wouldn't think it correct to view the various kits as marketing gimmiks. For example, the latest one, Factories in Flames, I think really improves the system, even though super WiF-ers argue over the minutiae of these new rules.
You'll want to visit ADG's website to review the various marketing packages to see how WiF is sold. I'm thinking you are after the Deluxe version, which is in between the basic "classic" set up and the whole hog "super deluxe".
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Isaac Citrom
Canada
Montreal
Quebec
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Matthew, I would also advise that you download the rulebook and ask questions here before spending money. A very legitimate criticism of WiF is that the whole thing is very confusing. There is no such thing in the WiF universe as opening the box, punching the counters, reading the rules and you're off.
All of the information is scattered and disjointed. It is the result of so much evolution of the system. The latest versions of the rulebook help in that now there is just the one rulebook that brings together all the rules. But, even that is not 100% complete. Learning WiF is most definitely a chore and a labour of love.
I only wish that someday somebody might sit down and write a WiF bible and bring order out of the chaos. That is, a single volume where you start on page 1 and by the time you get to the last page, one has covered everything there is to know about WiF.
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Patrick Bauer
United States
Reading
Pennsylvania
Waste Water too
Mid-Atlantic Air Museum
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Sounds like you have the "Classic" version. Mech in Flames has some extra divisional counters, plus of course extra mechanized counters. Here's the pic of the countersheet: http://www.boardgamegeek.com/image/78827
I tend to view it as a map clutterer. In truth I've owned every iteration of WiF and I liked 2nd edition best. The extra detail of the maps, the planes, even the ships each takes a little of the playability of what was a great system. Didn't stop me from buying all the new stuff, won't stop in the future.
I can't wait for July 27 release of Matrixgames computer version.
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I will also be buying the computer version ... once it is patched enough times.
I didn't mean to 'dismiss' Mech in Flames as being poor quality, but for someone just getting back into it, it's less important right now. Marginal to me, at this stage of relearning the game, especially as I have never played with it.
The basic six counter sheets should provide plenty of solo play, and I will only be adding Planes in Flames because I remember it adding a lot of fun without adding a lot of complexity or counter mess.
The set came with Cruisers in Flames, but I won't be using that, at least not initially, for the same reasons: lots of extra clutter for not enough extra play value. For me. At this point.
For a new player (or newly returning) the law of diminishing returns is an important one.
Thanks for all your comments.
And nif you are ever on the West Coast of Vancouver Island ...
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Mike Young
United States
Independence
Missouri
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The new 2008 annual with Factories in Flames is a good addition. We've been playing WiF since 1989 (!) and have gone through all the official stuff plus a lot of non-official stuff. The Line of Communications rules for Vichy France are involved, but a good add. Leaders in Flames was a good idea, but just isn't something we used past the first time. Cruisers and Convoys are both unnecessary in our view. Our group liked Days of Decision (the first edition) but the changes since then spoiled it for our group. I have a tendency to like the additional kits, and have to work to get the group to play with them. We will not play without Ships or Planes, and we are just now starting a game with Factories. I have a feeling it will be a permanent part of our game. This is all personal preference. Absolutely read everything you can about a kit before buying, and you might want to join the yahoo wifdiscussion group to ask questions. A lot of players there that have been involved in designing some of these kits, and always glad to answer questions. have fun!
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