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Subject: My Tikal Fear - Would Timing Work ? rss

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Shane Walsh
Australia
Adelaide
South Australia
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I must say from the outset that I have thought about purchasing Tikal for a year or so (OK - along with gazillions of other titles !)
It floats in and out of my purview as I trawl the forums here on the Geek .

I love Kiesling's effort with Vikings (Try it - VERY good )and Kramer's offerings have been recent but much admired acquisitions (El Grande and Princes Of Florence).

So, whilst I love the look and the gradual revelation of territory and some other elements the ONE concern I have is the recurring postings of angst with regard to AP with this game .
Our playing group is small and knowing their likes/loathes gameically (is that a word?) speaking this could be a potential killer for us .

All of this leads to my question :
Would timing each players move (i.e. 60 seconds or whatever ) work ?

I apologize if this question seems naive or unworkable - I'm just trying to get a feel on whether or not this title is something I should snap up .

All thoughts appreciated !!
 
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Daric Morris
United States
Tucker
Georgia
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I think it would work just fine. You introduce a timer into any game and it changes the dynamic of the game, of course. But personally, I think it would improve Tikal. I've been debating getting a G8 game timer, mostly for this game alone. There is nothing in this game that would interrupt a players turn, which often kills the timer idea. When it's your turn, you can't get interrupted by another player, you don't have any combat, should not be any rules questions once everybody has played once, nothing like that.
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Shane Walsh
Australia
Adelaide
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Wow !!

Swift reply - thanks Daric !!

This helps so all gratitude to you .
 
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Shane Walsh
Australia
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South Australia
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Thanks for the response .
I do not have Java as a reference point which you intimates moves more slowly but I appreciate your view that Tikal for you has little AP difficulty .

I appreciate your post !!
 
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Max Jamelli
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Chambersburg
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60 seconds may be a little short. I've spoken to a lot of gamers who have played Tikal and many of them have the same AP concerns. The consensus we came to was 2 minutes, so we would double that.
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Shane Walsh
Australia
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sigtaulefty wrote:
60 seconds may be a little short. I've spoken to a lot of gamers who have played Tikal and many of them have the same AP concerns. The consensus we came to was 2 minutes, so we would double that.


Thanks Max of the many,multitudinous and meglifarious microbadges (How'd you get SOOO many ?)

Your suggestion is noted and undoubtedly helpful . Thanks .
 
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Maarten D. de Jong
Netherlands
Zaandam
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sigtaulefty wrote:
60 seconds may be a little short. I've spoken to a lot of gamers who have played Tikal and many of them have the same AP concerns. The consensus we came to was 2 minutes, so we would double that.

That's a helluvalot of time to consider your move. The objective is to have some fun, not turn into a human computer. You might as well program a little pocket computer with an optimisation scheme---them buggers sure are fast these days, so Tikal should be doable---and have it do the work for you.

Tikal should be played with a bit of schwung: if it turns into a beancounting exercise you're doing something very wrong. That you calculate a bit more during a scoring round is understandable. But if you succumb to the temptation to start calculating every move, you should seriously consider changing your habits or decide on something else instead. With a bit of training your human brain becomes quite good at guesstimating the near-optimum result given various boundary conditions such as 'maximising my own point total', 'play defensively', 'play agressively', and so forth; and it will be quite quick, too, at most half a minute per turn or so. Don't put the AP-mechanism first: you'll be doing the game a great disservice if you do.

In other words: look at the board and think of a general strategy or tactic, then work out how to go about seeing it through in AP terms. Don't start calculating straight away. You will find that the computational burden is greatly reduced this way and that timing is no longer necessary.
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Chris Shaffer
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If your group suffers from AP, a timer would be a good idea. I'd recommend two minutes per turn, as stated above. Regardless of how some of the people in this thread feel people should behave, AP is an issue for some players and exhortations about how those players should approach the game won't change human nature. A timer, combined with a strong recommendation to consider your actions while other people are playing, would be a good idea.

With the right group, Tikal can be quick. With the wrong group, it can be painfully slow.

p.s. Some people enjoy "beancounting exercises" and, in fact, it's one of the appeals of Tikal to me. Maarten may think it's not the way I should play the game, but that's OK. He doesn't get to decide what others should or shouldn't enjoy, fortunately.
 
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Miguel
France
Caen
(from Valencia, Spain)
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My latest game: Big*Bang, a simple abstract about the first minutes of the Universe
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My best-rated game: TETRARCHIA, about the tetrarchy that saved Rome
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I've just got Tikal on a MT and I may try a time limit depending on the people I game with. A few of them want to be sure EVERY turn that they have analysed ALL the possible actions they could have taken, even if I try to explain that guessing and/or intuition in games is fun too... and does not make fine games drag on forever!

Last time that hapenned was playing San Marco, at the end of the game they had all liked it but one said "it's a bit too long"... Then I explained that if you take twice/thrice the time to play every turn, then a game designed for 1h becomes automatically 2/3h. Next time I'll use my watch chronometer.
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Steve N
United Kingdom
Macclesfield
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I have never been bored during a game of Tikal. Other games cause me to "zone out" when people are taking their time, but Tikal somehow keeps me engaged. I think its probably because other people's moves directly effect your own...is black going to make a dash for my pyramid? Will red claim that last treasure? Will white move enough men away from that pyramid so that I can rush it? This makes the game really gripping even if others are taking a minute to think.
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