Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
10 Posts

Small World» Forums » Rules

Subject: Can the Diplomat target a player with no Active Race? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Allen Doum
United States
Orange County
California
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
A discussion in another thread has brought up this question.

The rules say: "At the end of your turn, you may select one opponent whose Active race you did not attack this turn as your ally."

Does this mean that you cannot target a player who just put his current Race in Decline and has not yet chosen his New Race? If so, a new Race could attack the Diplomat.

Note that this would be a change from Vinci, where a player chose his new civ on the same turn as putting the old one in decline.

I am also interested in how the non-English rules handle this.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joachim Pehl
Germany
Daubach
Rheinland-Pfalz
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Re: Can the Dipomat target a player with no Active Race?
AllenDoum wrote:
A discussion in another thread has brought up this question.

The rules say: "At the end of your turn, you may select one opponent whose Active race you did not attack this turn as your ally."

Does this mean that you cannot target a player who just put his current Race in Decline and has not yet chosen his New Race? If so, a new Race could attack the Diplomat.

Note that this would be a change from Vinci, where a player chose his new civ on the same turn as putting the old one in decline.

I am also interested in how the non-English rules handle this.


The german rules are equal.

But I think that they are pretty clear. Player A puts his race into decline, so he has no active race. Now its the turn of player B (with diplomat), he don't attack the active race of player A (after all A has no active Race at this point), so hee meets the condition to choose player A as an ally (the power says choose an opponent not choose a race !). Now it is the turn of player A, he chooses his new active race, but he can not attack player B since they are allies.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Allen Doum
United States
Orange County
California
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I agree that it can be read that way.

The trick is does "opponent whose Active race you did not attack" refer to:
A) Any player who did not have an Active race attacked.
B) A player with an Active race that was not attacked.

After all, the rule could have said: "The player selected could not be one whose Active race was attacked."
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Thornsen
United States
Nottingham
Maryland
flag msg tools
designer
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
A better way to say it in English would be "If you attacked that player's Active Race during your turn, you may not make them an ally"
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joachim Pehl
Germany
Daubach
Rheinland-Pfalz
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
AllenDoum wrote:
I agree that it can be read that way.

The trick is does "opponent whose Active race you did not attack" refer to:
A) Any player who did not have an Active race attacked.
B) A player with an Active race that was not attacked.

After all, the rule could have said: "The player selected could not be one whose Active race was attacked."


Hm,
I think that B) implies more information than actually given, but I think I get what you mean (after all english isn't my native language).

I rechecked the german rules, thanks to a well-placed comma (,) it is clear that A is meant.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
H-B-G
United Kingdom
Halesowen
West Midlands
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
tech7 wrote:
AllenDoum wrote:
I agree that it can be read that way.

The trick is does "opponent whose Active race you did not attack" refer to:
A) Any player who did not have an Active race attacked.
B) A player with an Active race that was not attacked.

After all, the rule could have said: "The player selected could not be one whose Active race was attacked."


Hm,
I think that B) implies more information than actually given, but I think I get what you mean (after all english isn't my native language).

I rechecked the german rules, thanks to a well-placed comma (,) it is clear that A is meant.


I agree with this, I can see nothing in the English rules that could possibly suggest that B is correct.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Richard Dewsbery
United Kingdom
Sutton Coldfield
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
It's not either/or - I'd say that it was both; with B simply being a smaller subset of A.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Allen Doum
United States
Orange County
California
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
tech7 wrote:
AllenDoum wrote:
I agree that it can be read that way.

The trick is does "opponent whose Active race you did not attack" refer to:
A) Any player who did not have an Active race attacked.
B) A player with an Active race that was not attacked.

After all, the rule could have said: "The player selected could not be one whose Active race was attacked."


Hm,
I think that B) implies more information than actually given, but I think I get what you mean (after all english isn't my native language).

I rechecked the german rules, thanks to a well-placed comma (,) it is clear that A is meant.

It seems the English translation is not as "tight" as the German, but then again, neither are the original language.

As I said, I can accept that. But an official answer would be nice, as the English is ambiguous, IMO.

I also thought it would be a "better" interpretation, particularly in a 2 player game. arrrh
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mark Eddy
United Kingdom
flag msg tools
We had this come up lastnight....

My thoughts are that the players are just virtual controllers of the Races..... Therefore surely your Race would create diplomatic relations with another race..... and therefore an active race at that.

I don't see how your race can be diplomatic with a race that does not exist yet......

Just my 2 pence worth.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tony M
United States
Chicago
Illinois
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Thematically, this seems pretty odd. You would think you ally with a race, not with a player.

However, the rules seems pretty clear the alliance is at the player level, not the race level, so rules as written say if you dont attack a players active race (even if he does not have one !), that player may be selected.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.