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Subject: French edition rss

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edubvidal
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Thanks to trictrac.net:

http://www.trictrac.net/index.php3?id=jeux&rub=actualite&inf...

Release date: Mid-July
 
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desmodus
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Die Ärzte, Bad Religioon, Bauhaus, Dom Perignon, In Extremo, Joy Division, Lacrimosa, New Model Army, Nirvana, Officine Panerai, Placebo, Rammstein, The Sisters of Mercy, Smashing Pumpkins, The Cure, The Mission, Die Toten Hosen, Umbra et Imago
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This game will have no text or only very few as far as I can judge from the first pictures.
I do not understand why we need a french edition that you will pay approx. twice the price of the German edition.
Just for info: I paid 12 EUR on amazon.de for my copy.
Now I'm sure that if there are some promos or expansions to come, they will be compatible with my edition.
I was very disapointed that the envoy and black market promo cards for dominion will not be available in french and that my french dominion will never be complete.
I don't trust this french publisher any more.

Belive me: Get the german or any english copy and you will receive the game faster, cheaper and with all potential expansions!!!
 
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gargll
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Quote:
I do not understand why we need a french edition that you will pay approx. twice the price of the German edition.


Filosofia has obviously joined Ystari's quest to annoy you: http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/332750.

I suggest you stop wondering why french editors translate games in french or why online discounters offer lower prices and let us enjoy life. Thank you.
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desmodus
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gargll wrote:
Quote:
I do not understand why we need a french edition that you will pay approx. twice the price of the German edition.


Filosofia has obviously joined Ystari's quest to annoy you: http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/332750.

I suggest you stop wondering why french editors translate games in french or why online discounters offer lower prices and let us enjoy life. Thank you.


Obviously you're keeping track of most of my posts here.
But just to show you that I can make the difference between necessary and unnecessary translations:
I've now received my copy of Duell der Baumeister and there is far more text on the cards than I would have expected. And far less pictograms than I supposed to be.
So for this game, I have to admit that a translation is necessary unless you speak German.
For many other games of filosofia (Royal Palace, Felicity: The Cat in the Sack, Stone Age, A Castle for All Seasons, Keltis, Finca) there is absolutely no text (=no language) on the game components. So personnally I will keep wondering why it takes ages to translate the rulebook and why this translation will cost such a high premium for the games.
I know it's the wrong thread here, but as filosofia only do limited redactional work for the games, don't need to test any prototypes, can use existing production facilities for the existing games, and does not take any risk by selecting only games from sucessful publishers, I frankly cannot understand why these games are between 50% and 100% more expexpensive in France than in Germany e.g.

Just another example: I bought the french version of dominion and I'm now facing the fact that filosofia is not publishing the envoy and the black market. So I sold my french copy to buy a german one without loosing money. Now I will have my dominion complete!

And I have to appologize if my posts here hinder you enjoying life. But I think I have the right to have my own oppinion. Sorry for posting it here, but I know quite some people that agree with me. Or how do you explain the fact that so many people in my french game group buy their games in Germany? No they are not all fluent in German.They just saw that they can buy 3 german editions for the money of 2 french ones if they download the rules from the internet.

Just my 2 cents.

But I still recommend The Pillars of the Earth: Builders Duel in what language ever.
A nice way to play the Pillars theme at 2 players with a nice mechanism of selecting 3 out of 9 cards and fighting for 1 of your 3 cards.
On top it's game from one of my favorite designer, so go on ... give it a try
 
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gargll
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The point of translating language independent games is simple: most people want the game box and rules to be understandable and don't want to go get the rules online or on a separate sheet of paper. If you are buying a gift for your niece, it makes sense.

The price of translated games includes royalties for the original publisher and is therefore higher. In addition to this, for the specific case of germany, you have competition between the distributors on the price. And then, online discouters reduce their margins. For instance, amazon.de (online discounter) sells Caylus Magna Carta for 13.4 euros, and philibertnet.com (a store in France which also sells online) sells it for 21 euros. In both cases, Ystari (the publisher) earns the same amount.

Karis, the Ystari boss, made a nice post (in french) on trictrac, detailing the pricing of games: http://www.trictrac.net/jeux/forum/viewtopic.php?t=59212&pos...


Cheers,

PS. I don't work for Ystari or Filosofia and I'm not on a personnal vendetta against you. I stumbled upon your two posts by accident and wanted to point out that you have a tendency to whine. Don't whine, it makes people less sympathetic to your cause.

In this case, you chose two pick onto two companies with a rather outstanding (though obviously not perfect) track record. For instance, out of ~25 published games, the lowest average of a Ystari game is 6.35. Personnally, I'd rather have more companies like them and I believe the french gaming community (you included) should be thankfull for their work, which is why I replied to your post.
 
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desmodus
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gargll wrote:
The point of translating language independent games is simple: most people want the game box and rules to be understandable and don't want to go get the rules online or on a separate sheet of paper. If you are buying a gift for your niece, it makes sense.

The price of translated games includes royalties for the original publisher and is therefore higher. In addition to this, for the specific case of germany, you have competition between the distributors on the price. And then, online discouters reduce their margins. For instance, amazon.de (online discounter) sells Caylus Magna Carta for 13.4 euros, and philibertnet.com (a store in France which also sells online) sells it for 21 euros. In both cases, Ystari (the publisher) earns the same amount.

Karis, the Ystari boss, made a nice post (in french) on trictrac, detailing the pricing of games: http://www.trictrac.net/jeux/forum/viewtopic.php?t=59212&pos...


Cheers,

PS. I don't work for Ystari or Filosofia and I'm not on a personnal vendetta against you. I stumbled upon your two posts by accident and wanted to point out that you have a tendency to whine. Don't whine, it makes people less sympathetic to your cause.

In this case, you chose two pick onto two companies with a rather outstanding (though obviously not perfect) track record. For instance, out of ~25 published games, the lowest average of a Ystari game is 6.35. Personnally, I'd rather have more companies like them and I believe the french gaming community (you included) should be thankfull for their work, which is why I replied to your post.


It seems that you are missing one important point. There is a big difference between Ystari and Filosofia:
Ystari develops and published games on its own! That means a lot of efforts, time and money, for prototyping, testing, risk to bomb, etc.
Filosofia only publishes games where all this work is already done. Ok they are paying some fees to publish the games, but they do not take any risk by selecting the good games. For all the things related to printing, etc they save time and money again as they are using the existing production capacities, suppliers for spare parts, etc.

Sorry, but I will stay with my point of view. And I'm certainly not thankfull to Filosofia just because "I should". I do not agree with their "politique commerciale" and at the end of the day I do not need them, because I buy in Germany. So it's a general disagreement.
With Ystari the problem is different. I was personnaly insulted. So I prefer to stay away from this publisher.

But I know very well that on TricTrac it is a recurrent problem when you critizise the holy grails. That's the reason why I no longer read this site. I found that people are much more open minded here.
Come on and admit the reality: You don't have to accept everything from a publisher only because he publishes good games (by the way, my definition of a good game is somehow different than the BGG ranking). Open your eyes, claim for cheaper games, whine because the delays to publish the french version is too long, etc.
We are in democratic states. You can have your own opinion, you may have your own requirements. Don't be a sheep or a lemming accepting to pay twice the price a game is worth.
Stand up for your rights and fight for your conviction.

So please try to be objective and investigate all the work a developing-publisher has to publish a game and compare that to the simple translation exercise of other licensing-publishers. Add some economic fundamentals and you will see, that SOME games are far too expensive in France.

PS: Note that amazon is not a discounter! If you want to see what a online discounter is, go and visit the shop of Magierspiele
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