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Subject: After the finish... rss

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Erin Sparks
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This is probably more of a house rules question, but...

The first to cross the finish line wins, that's fine. But on the Monaco circuit, there is a turn right after the finish line. Often, just for fun, we like to shift into 6th when charging for the finish (because we don't often get into 6th in Monaco). It is technically possible to cross the finish but wreck because you overshot the turn AFTER the finish line. Do you play that you have to successfully END your move when you cross the finish line? Or once the car crosses the line, is it immediately off the board?

Also, if three cars cross the finish and are still in the game, you may need to brake hard after you finish, which could wreck your car. On the one hand, in a real race, if a car finished then crashed it would still get the win. But in the game, if you have to SUCCESSFULLY finish, you might choose 5th gear instead of 6th (to avoid overshooting) and you might roll low and not finish at all...it might reduce the "foregone conclusion" problem of the endgame. How do you play?
 
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Matt Davis
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I've always played that once you cross the line, you're done, whether or not you do a victory wipeout in turn 1. But the rules seem vague on this to me, too.
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Wulf Corbett
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I play it like the real race it simulates. If you crash in 6th gear, you die. Dead people are losers.
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Phil McDonald
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Even if you crashed after crossing the line in F1, you would still be classified as the winner. Therefore, that is how I play it.
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Louis Brenton
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The problem is that all the Formula D/De tracks are imperfectly scaled-down versions of the originals. I'm fairly confident the real Monaco track's finish line is located on a straight which is long enough for cars to finish at speed. No one designs a track where people are slowly going toward the finish line.

(I think this is reflected in the old Formula De variant where each straight space counts as 2 squares rather than one, to more accurately simulate the size of the real track.)

I think it's more in the "spirit" of the game (obviously, this is a somewhat subjective term) to have cars finish safely regardless of what gear they're in. Also, I'm sure the F 1 rule is that a car has completed the race the moment it's crossed the finish line, regardless of what happens afterwards (I know this is the case in NASCAR, where a couple of years ago, I watched Clint Bowyer slide across the Daytona finish line in an upside down car).
 
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Phil McDonald
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As an F1 fan I can assure you that the cars rarely finish the race at full acceleration. More often than not they cruise over the line waving to their pit crews.
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Dan Kelly
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I also play it that crossing the finish line ends the move and the winner is declared, but I have wondered what would happen if I let them continue. In my first game, I was curious enough to run another lap, just to see meeple

philmcd wrote:
As an F1 fan I can assure you that the cars rarely finish the race at full acceleration. More often than not they cruise over the line waving to their pit crews.


(Spoiler)
That reminds me of the end of the 1980 film, Silver Dream Racer. Granted, it is bike racing, not F-1, but still...
 
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Erin Sparks
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Quote:
As an F1 fan I can assure you that the cars rarely finish the race at full acceleration. More often than not they cruise over the line waving to their pit crews.


I haven't followed F1 in years (I got very tired of Michael Schumacher), I need to get back into it. But those "slow finishes" are when there's no chance of being overtaken. In FD, there could be someone breathing down your neck ready to overtake on a lucky roll.

I think it's less like real-life racing, but I think I'm leaning toward having to finish safely, if only to put some drama into the final straightaway rather than "crank it to 6th and there's no chance of failure." But I'm glad there are diverse opinions!
 
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Phil McDonald
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There's oly a 'contested' finish in about 10% of F1 races, that is exactly the point
 
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Erin Sparks
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I guess it depends on whether you want to play FD as a simulation or as a game. As a sim, you should stick strictly to "Whoever crosses the finish line first" but as a game, I think it works better to have to finish safely.
 
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Wulf Corbett
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Personally, I think it works better as a sim if you consider the survival of the car & driver!
 
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Yan
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Wulf Corbett wrote:
I play it like the real race it simulates. If you crash in 6th gear, you die. Dead people are losers.

Wulf Corbett wrote:
Personally, I think it works better as a sim if you consider the survival of the car & driver!

Let's not over dramatise this. First, like pointed befor, no one put a finish line right in front of a corner. In real life you could finish at full speed and have plenty of time to slow down. Second, unless you crash really bad, odds are that you will survive a F1 accident. Frame are designed to break in a special way that absorb inertia in a very effective maner. Pilots are wearing ignifuge clothing that will protect them for a very limited time from fire. Allowing them to get away or get rescued in time. In most severe case, the pilot may get very severe burns, but dying because of this is extreme. Pilots are not incompetent fools. They know how to handle a F1. They wont have a monumental crash that easily even if their F1 is in very bad shape. Especialy in a straight...

Now when the rule say that you are eliminated, they don't mean dead. Just that your F1 (or car) is in no condition to carry on with the race. But if the race is over, it does not really matter does it ? Then again, the one paying the bills do I guess.
 
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Erin Sparks
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Find the video of Ayrton Senna's crash...no matter what the safety precautions or equipment, that crash'd kill anyone.

 
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Phil McDonald
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And no-one has been killed in F1 since. In the sixties it used to be 2 or 3 a year.

In any case, an extreme example hardly disproves a general rule, and it wasn't at the end of a finishing straight anyway.

If someone wants to adapt the rules for their own use, that's one thing. Just don't try and justify it from F1 cos it simply doesn't wash.
 
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Erin Sparks
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Well my last several posts have been justifying it from a gameplay perspective, so I'm not sure who you're arguing with...
 
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Phil McDonald
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What has a video of Ayrton Senna's death got to do with gameplay??
 
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Mike Thomas
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Easy tiger. I play it that the drivers have to quickly show having crossed the finish line how they would successfully negotiate any obstacles. After all at the end of the first lap of a 2 lap race thats exactly what you would be doing. So why just because you have finished should you be going at a ridiculous speed on the second lap? Also means those cars with plenty of brakes etc can slow down more easily having crossed the line.





If someone wants to adapt the rules for their own use, that's one thing. Just don't try and justify it from F1 cos it simply doesn't wash.[/q]
 
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Yan
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rockhpi wrote:
Find the video of Ayrton Senna's crash...no matter what the safety precautions or equipment, that crash'd kill anyone.

Now I never said that it is impossible to die in an F1 accident.
Zhab wrote:
Second, unless you crash really bad, odds are that you will survive a F1 accident.

Quoted for enphasis.

I clearly admit that possibility. I simply say that it may not be as deadly as you may think.
 
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Rick Teverbaugh
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To me it doesn't matter what happens after the finish line from either a gameplay or sim perspective. Once a car has passed the finish line it will immediately slow down using brakes and downshifting, which isn't reflected in using the full dice roll for the move that causes the car to cross the line. You must remember that even using a car's last braking point in FD doesn't mean the car no longer has brakes. It simply means that it is no longer capable of hard braking.

Rick T.
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Ethan Hanks
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I always felt that the game is played in rounds. how the turn order is played out I feel that its trying to recreate what all the cars did in a few seconds. Like they are all moving at the same time.So even though one player crosses the finish line, that only triggers the end round. Finish order wouldn't be tallied til after the round. Which means you need to be going at the correct speed if a turn is coming up.
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Phil McDonald
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Qualifying fastest gives you track position at the start. cars at the back of the grid have to travel a hundred yards FURTHER in the race. You cross the line first, you win,
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Patroclus
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rickert wrote:
To me it doesn't matter what happens after the finish line from either a gameplay or sim perspective. Once a car has passed the finish line it will immediately slow down using brakes and downshifting, which isn't reflected in using the full dice roll for the move that causes the car to cross the line. You must remember that even using a car's last braking point in FD doesn't mean the car no longer has brakes. It simply means that it is no longer capable of hard braking.

Rick T.


the voice of reason!
well said!

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Mike Thomas
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hardly the voice of reason when on completing the first lap of a two lap race you have to succesfully negotiate the obstacles and corner at the start of the second lap, yet mysteriously can disregard all at the end of the race


Patroclus wrote:
rickert wrote:
To me it doesn't matter what happens after the finish line from either a gameplay or sim perspective. Once a car has passed the finish line it will immediately slow down using brakes and downshifting, which isn't reflected in using the full dice roll for the move that causes the car to cross the line. You must remember that even using a car's last braking point in FD doesn't mean the car no longer has brakes. It simply means that it is no longer capable of hard braking.

Rick T.


the voice of reason!
well said!

 
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Phil McDonald
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mikeathomas wrote:
hardly the voice of reason when on completing the first lap of a two lap race you have to succesfully negotiate the obstacles and corner at the start of the second lap, yet mysteriously can disregard all at the end of the race


Patroclus wrote:
rickert wrote:
To me it doesn't matter what happens after the finish line from either a gameplay or sim perspective. Once a car has passed the finish line it will immediately slow down using brakes and downshifting, which isn't reflected in using the full dice roll for the move that causes the car to cross the line. You must remember that even using a car's last braking point in FD doesn't mean the car no longer has brakes. It simply means that it is no longer capable of hard braking.

Rick T.


the voice of reason!
well said!



I never like to hear 'the voice of reason' quoted because that depends entirely on your own viewpoint.

However, this game seeks to emulate (albeit in a gamey fashion) Formula 1. In the relatively rare occasions when a real F1 race is still contested at the final corner, drivers will use maximum acceleration through the exit of the corner, and cross the finishing line at maximum possible speed, knowing that they can decelerate with ease using their carbon brakes before the end of the winning straight.

Therefore, by all means mod your game to reflect your own personal tastes, but don't claim that the game is 'wrong' in it's implementation.
 
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Mike Thomas
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I never like to hear 'the voice of reason' quoted because that depends entirely on your own viewpoint.

However, this game seeks to emulate (albeit in a gamey fashion) Formula 1. In the relatively rare occasions when a real F1 race is still contested at the final corner, drivers will use maximum acceleration through the exit of the corner, and cross the finishing line at maximum possible speed, knowing that they can decelerate with ease using their carbon brakes before the end of the winning straight.

***(Therefore, by all means mod your game to reflect your own personal tastes, but don't claim that the game is 'wrong' in it's implementation.[/q]***

???where have i said that the game is wrong??? The game doesnt cover what happens after the finish - i merely stated that if after one lap of a 2 lap race u have to safely negotiate whats next, then why not the conclusion of the 2nd lap too. It makes for exciting gamesplay
 
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