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Subject: Napoleon dies one turn too soon... rss

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Choubi Gogs
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I've introduced my friend Bassem to this game directly with the full game.

So let's see, it's not an easy jump but it definitely is manageable. However, Rules explanation took 1 hour with us being very concentrated and all. Be a little less concentrated and I expect this will just do no good.

The game itself took 4 hours... But hey, at least we have a new player!
So, how did the game go?

Bassem starts pretty hard and concentrates on production, taking both phase I upgrades for farms and mines. I take Aristotle and grab every piece of technology I can get my hands on (I'll have all blue technologies from age I !!)
Building the Pyramids very fast and teching justice system allows me to gain a good advantage on civil actions (despite Bassem's Hammurabi (? + 1 civil, -1 military)) but at the cost of my production which will be low for quite long.

Bassem discovers he has big problems getting rid of his food as he produces too much very early (almost 4 per turn before he even started paying consumption!). This will hinder him significantly for a while.

Militarywise, nothing quite extraordinary is happening except I plan on going heavy military with a good tactics card (+4 for 3 cavalry), a cavalry in hand and tons of science to spend. Moreover, I keep getting military-favoured event cards that I play almost every turn. Moreover, Bassem having just 1 military action, he was quite in a rough spot.

I'll manage to get in 2 aggressions, destroying his level 1 lab and then making him lose resources.

Bassem will let too many occasions of building wonders while I continue with trying to get many science with Universitas Carolinas and libraries. I also build arenas for happiness. I'm kind of mass teching in this early game while Bassem is mostly mass-producing but without seeming to do much with his resources.

He'll finally managed to get a good wonder with China wall. However afraid of the military boost Bassem would have, I decide to take action and manage to destroy his wonder just before he finishes it. Right now, I'm in the drover's seat military wise. And I'm also gaining ground each turn on culture, almost on a par with him despite his +6 culture and +5 culture played early.

I have put ALL events as of now in the future events and they all favour military where I have a +10 advantage on Bassem and getting better with Napoleon and a better army on the way. I have tons of bonuses with my special technologies. 7 civil actions and 5 military ones (still with my despotism government!) vs 7 and 2 for Bassem. I produce as much food as Bassem, have upgraded a better mine, though I still don't produce as much as Bassem (10 to 5 for the moment but I have 2 mines waiting to be upgraded). I win more points and more science each turn...

I have basically won this game...

Except...

Age 3 starts.
With Napoleon in play I have a HUGE advance on Bassm and I declare a war on population. Bassem will manage to upgrade pretty fast with Churchill but will still be left behind 18 points! After small sacrifices, Bassem loses 6 pop from his reserves while I win that much. Unfortunately, Bassem didn't really care and it was already a little bit too late for him to be hindered as he already had tons of guys standing around. He might have gotten problems with happiness but just one temple built and problem solved. At that point he builds Fast Food Chains and wins tons of points and get another big boost.

And this is where I'll make my biggest mistake, right after having declared my previous war, I was supposed to attack right away and build a airplane.
Producing 7 per turn, I didn't really pay attention to what I spent the turn before... Except that I had to pay corruption for 1 and the turn after that, I just had 6 resources with 7 needed. I couldn't build my airforce now. I couldn't launch my attack therefore as Bassem with vastly superior units and big advantages in resource production (and military costs thanks to Churchill) could get ahead. Next turn, I wanted to declare the war over culture I wanted, this time being able to build my airforce (which brought me: 5 + 9 for my army + 9 because the bonus is doubled by Napoleon... giving me, as Bassem had caught up with me a 23 strength advantage, with Bassem unable to build more (no man left for him))... Well no... Because before the war is resolved, age 3 would have ended, I would have lost Napoleon (ie: 36 in strength!) which would have left me WAAYY behind.

So no war, no points... Well I build a spaceship for 23 points and finish 1 point behind Bassem with a sucker production and without even being able to really make my military pay off...
Except he got good age 3 events cards and he will win tons of points there too.

Final score:

Bassem: 153
Choubi: 137
 
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Marc Dave
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Hello

It's a very good game for 2 players but, in my mind, with 2 players, you remove the wars and the pacts.

Rivaro
 
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Jeff Bridgham
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The wars remain in a two player game, but the pacts do not.
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Choubi Gogs
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jebry wrote:
The wars remain in a two player game, but the pacts do not.


Yep, we didn't play with the pacts.

You remove the wars only in the advanced game.
 
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Marc Dave
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OK

Most of the time, we removed the wars by choice with more than 2 players. Maybe we decided to do the same with 2 players and now we are convinced it's the rule.

Anyway, most of my friends think the wars are the less interesting features in the game. A weak player (in term of military strenght) has enough disadvantages with the aggressions, most of the events and no possibility to gain colonies, so we think we don't need to add the wars.

They have a "all or nothing" effect and we think it's rather unpleasant.
 
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Choubi Gogs
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rivaro wrote:
OK

Most of the time, we removed the wars by choice with more than 2 players. Maybe we decided to do the same with 2 players and now we are convinced it's the rule.

Anyway, most of my friends think the wars are the less interesting features in the game. A weak player (in term of military strenght) has enough disadvantages with the aggressions, most of the events and no possibility to gain colonies, so we think we don't need to add the wars.

They have a "all or nothing" effect and we think it's rather unpleasant.


I probably don't have enough plays under my belt to disagree about anything on this game but I rather like the tension brought by the wars. The huge effects can really turn a game around and forces the interaction between players I feel.

Anyway, I can understand your point of view too.

Cheers
 
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Jose Augusto Moreira
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A question...you said wich detroyed the wonder before finish..like you make it? is possible destroy a wonder?
 
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Choubi Gogs
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jaugusto72 wrote:
A question...you said wich detroyed the wonder before finish..like you make it? is possible destroy a wonder?


There is an aggresion card that makes you destroy an unfinished wonder of your opponent. I destroyed his Great Wall (+5 military and +1 per infantry and archer unit).
 
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Tim Seitz
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Choubi wrote:
jaugusto72 wrote:
A question...you said wich detroyed the wonder before finish..like you make it? is possible destroy a wonder?


There is an aggresion card that makes you destroy an unfinished wonder of your opponent. I destroyed his Great Wall (+5 military and +1 per infantry and archer unit).

The French version must include some changes I'm not aware of. In the English version, the Great Wall does not provide +5 military. Maybe this is due to French love for fortifications (i.e., The Maginot Line)?
 
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Choubi Gogs
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out4blood wrote:
Choubi wrote:
jaugusto72 wrote:
A question...you said wich detroyed the wonder before finish..like you make it? is possible destroy a wonder?


There is an aggresion card that makes you destroy an unfinished wonder of your opponent. I destroyed his Great Wall (+5 military and +1 per infantry and archer unit).

The French version must include some changes I'm not aware of. In the English version, the Great Wall does not provide +5 military. Maybe this is due to French love for fortifications (i.e., The Maginot Line)?


Actually there are no french version and I think you are right.

I wasn't sure if it did so since you're contradicting me, I guess I was wrong.

It would seem overpowered in fact. As it is, it already presents a very nice boost in strength.

So yes, Great Wall = +1 per infantry and archer unit and that's it.

Thanks for the correction!
 
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Eric Phillips
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Napoleon has died the turn before I really need him almost every time I've taken him. It's a bad habit.
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howl hollow howl
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Fortuna wrote:
Napoleon has died the turn before I really need him almost every time I've taken him. It's a bad habit.

Same with me... I'm glad someone else said it. blush
 
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Choubi Gogs
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Dave wrote:
Fortuna wrote:
Napoleon has died the turn before I really need him almost every time I've taken him. It's a bad habit.

Same with me... I'm glad someone else said it. blush


Well that prevents it from being overpowered I guess, as you can very fast have a huge bonus with him, him not surviving to age IV makes it harder as it's often th etime where he'll be most valuable.

Then again I don't have that much experience but for the moment I feel that with Napoleon one more turn, I would have won very easily!
 
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Tim Seitz
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Choubi wrote:
Dave wrote:
Fortuna wrote:
Napoleon has died the turn before I really need him almost every time I've taken him. It's a bad habit.

Same with me... I'm glad someone else said it. blush


Well that prevents it from being overpowered I guess, as you can very fast have a huge bonus with him, him not surviving to age IV makes it harder as it's often th etime where he'll be most valuable.

Then again I don't have that much experience but for the moment I feel that with Napoleon one more turn, I would have won very easily!

There's been a couple of games where I have taken Churchill and declared war on Napoleon. Then the age would come to an end before the war was resolved and Napoleon had died.
 
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Eric Phillips
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out4blood wrote:
There's been a couple of games where I have taken Churchill and declared war on Napoleon. Then the age would come to an end before the war was resolved and Napoleon had died.


You don't get Churchill's bonuses unless someone else declares on you. Isn't that right?
 
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Tim Seitz
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No, you always get his cheaper tech bonus and defense card bonus. The unit cost bonus is the one that only applies when someone declares on you.

If you can combine Churchill's cheaper tech bonus with a Scientific Cooperation pact, you can pretty quickly lay down numerous Age III military techs and then ramp up to a large military score.
 
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