Vasilis
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I was browsing the summary sheet
http://www.academy-games.com/images/stories/downloads/summar...
and noticed a few things.

1} The cost for Hasty Defense hasn't been changed from 8 AP to 7 AP.

2} I've noticed a row in the FORTIFICATIONS & DEFENSIVE COUNTERS table that mentions
Vehicle +0AP for FOOT Movement, +1 for WHEELED, +0 for TRACKED and so on.

What's this about? Towing? Moving into a hex with another Vehicle? I couldn't figure it out.

The same row can be found in the manual, page 10, Section 4, 14.0 Vehicle Movement

3} The +1AP cost for entering trenches & bunkers is not fixed in the summary, unless these rows are meant for moving in a hex with trench/bunker and not actually entering the fortification.

4} The new rules regarding smoke haven't been updated. It only mentions that the DM bonus affects fire going in the hex and not originating from the hex.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
After checking the new rules I saw a problem that needs clarifications.

Look at:

Section 7.63 Same Hex and Close Combat (CC)
• Units in CC must use red FP against units with red DRs.



then look at the large example at page page 13 above Section 5:
Quote:
..............The
Soviet rifle then moves onto the
tank for 1AP. The tank reacts for
3CAPs and CC attacks with 7FP.
The Soviet only has an 11DV.
The German rolls a 2 and misses!
The rifle squad’s FP is increased
to 7FP, but halved to 3FP since
the tank’s flank 14DV is blue. The Soviet modifies his roll with 1CAP, now
needs a 10 to hit and succeeds! The tank pulls a vehicle red gun disabled
hit counter. The Soviet rifle has 0APs left and passes. The German plays
a command action card. The tank can only fire with its blue FP since it
has a red gun disabled hit counter.
The tank CC fires at the Soviet rifle
with 4FP (5 blue FP +4 CC modifier x 1/2 since blue is firing at a red
defense). The Soviet has an 11DV, so the German must roll a 7 to hit..........


So I'm guessing that units in CC are forced to use their Red Firepower rating UNLESS they can't {because of damage for example as above}.
If that is not the case then they MUST use red FP.

What happens in CC if there are enemy units with red FP and with blue FP? Can I choose to attack with my blue FP and announce that I'm targeting the armored unit {even though I know that the unarmored unit will get hit too }
 
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uwe eickert
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Vaslis,
Good catch. Units in CC always fire against the opponents flank rating. So a unit with a front blue and a red flank would be considered a red target in CC.
Uwe
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Vasilis
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uweeickert wrote:
Vaslis,
Good catch. Units in CC always fire against the opponents flank rating. So a unit with a front blue and a red flank would be considered a red target in CC.
Uwe


Thank you for your reply.

What about this section from the manual?
Quote:
Section 7.63 Same Hex and Close Combat (CC)
• Units in CC must use red FP against units with red DRs.

After reading the above passage in the rules I have two questions:

1} Can a tank {that's in a hex with an enemy tank and an enemy rifle unit for example} choose to resolve CC with its Blue FP or it is forced to use Red FP as per the above rule?

2} A tank {that's in a hex with an enemy tank} is forced to use its Red FP in order to resolve CC with the enemy tank or it can choose to use its blue FP rating?

EDIT: Doh! The tank has blue DM. Disregard this question...zombie

Also, what about the VEHICLE row in the FORTIFICATIONS & DEFENSIVE COUNTERS table? What the +1AP cost for Wheeled movement means in this case?
The same row can be found in the manual, page 10, Section 4, 14.0 Vehicle Movement.
 
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uwe eickert
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Ahhh.. This means that it costs an extra 1AP for a wheeled vehicle to move into the same hex as any other type of vehicle. We put in this rule, because wheeled vehicles usually follow a road or track much more than a tracked tank, etc.
 
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Alex Treacher
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uweeickert wrote:
Ahhh.. This means that it costs an extra 1AP for a wheeled vehicle to move into the same hex as any other type of vehicle. We put in this rule, because wheeled vehicles usually follow a road or track much more than a tracked tank, etc.

When I saw that entry on the chart that's exactly the way that I interpreted it. However I was a bit surprised to find no other mention in the rules confirming it.
 
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Vasilis
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Prodromoi wrote:
uweeickert wrote:
Ahhh.. This means that it costs an extra 1AP for a wheeled vehicle to move into the same hex as any other type of vehicle. We put in this rule, because wheeled vehicles usually follow a road or track much more than a tracked tank, etc.

When I saw that entry on the chart that's exactly the way that I interpreted it. However I was a bit surprised to find no other mention in the rules confirming it.


Excuse me if I sound retarded but I still do not understand what this entry is for.
Here is a pic:


What I understood from your answer is that all wheeled vehicles must spend +1AP in order to move into any hex. But this surely is wrong because
if the cost to move into any hex for any wheeled vehicle was +1AP then why not calculate it on the counter's movement cost anyway?

I guess I'll understand it better with an example... Anyone?



Also, I'm still waiting for an answer to this question:
Quote:
What about this section from the manual?

Quote:
Section 7.63 Same Hex and Close Combat (CC)
• Units in CC must use red FP against units with red DRs.


After reading the above passage in the rules I have two questions:

1} Can a tank {that's in a hex with an enemy tank and an enemy rifle unit for example} choose to resolve CC with its Blue FP or it is forced to use Red FP as per the above rule?

 
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Alex Treacher
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Bowmangr wrote:
Excuse me if I sound retarded but I still do not understand what this entry is for.
Here is a pic:


What I understood from your answer is that all wheeled vehicles must spend +1AP in order to move into any hex. But this surely is wrong because
if the cost to move into any hex for any wheeled vehicle was +1AP then why not calculate it on the counter's movement cost anyway?

I guess I'll understand it better with an example... Anyone?

[/q]
That +1AP on the wheeled vehicle column is an extra AP that the vehicle must spend to enter a hex that already has a vehicle in it, since the advancing vehicle must manoeuvre around it. While the hexes are large, Uwe's earlier comment rationalises this by saying that the vehicles would be following a track rather than going cross-country. (Hence this penalty doesn't apply to tracked vehicles.)

Also, I believe that +1AP penalty is not per vehicle in the hex that is being advanced into - just if there are any vehicles already there.

So, as an example:

A truck advances into an empty open field. For 1AP it may advance two hexes (movement allowance of 1, plus 1 'wheel' bonus).
However - the first hex it advances into has another truck and a tank already in it. The advancing truck must pay an extra 1AP to squeeze past for a total of 2AP to advance those same two hexes.
If there was another tank in the second hex, we'd now be at 3AP for that same movement, and so on...

A tank, of course, would just say 'screw it' and drive off over the turnips...

I'm put in mind of the congestion that slowed down XXX Corps in their advance on Arnhem (which is as good an opportunity as any to plug the film A Bridge Too Far if you haven't seen it!).


I'd be interested in confirmation of your second question too. I read it exactly as written in the rules, meaning "yes, red only". I imagine the justification would be that tanks aren't designed for point-blank exchanges with armour-piercing rounds.
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Vasilis
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Prodromoi wrote:
That +1AP on the wheeled vehicle column is an extra AP that the vehicle must spend to enter a hex that already has a vehicle in it, since the advancing vehicle must manoeuvre around it. While the hexes are large, Uwe's earlier comment rationalises this by saying that the vehicles would be following a track rather than going cross-country. (Hence this penalty doesn't apply to tracked vehicles.)

Also, I believe that +1AP penalty is not per vehicle in the hex that is being advanced into - just if there are any vehicles already there.


I suspected as such but it seemed weird so I had to pull a "stupid guy asking the same question over and over again".

Anyway, it's clear now but I believe that the rationalization behind this wheeled movement "maneuvering around other vehicles" cost should be mentioned in the manual in text form.

Thank you for the quick answer and example.

Now, we need to wait for an answer regarding Blue FP vs Tanks&Rifle units in CC...
 
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James Palmer
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Just this week I asked Uwe the same question about that +1AP while looking over the SoS rules, I had never noticed that rule before, and had never played that way, although I'm not sure the situation ever came up anyways.

The newer CC rules confuse me as well, although luckily as of SoS they won't be relevant anymore. In SoS things are much cleaner I'd say.
 
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Vasilis
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Nick Warcholak wrote:
Vasilis, I just wanted to mention that the AtB rulebook and summary sheet will be updated shortly after the release of SoS to bring everything up to date.


Thank you for the information Nick. It's good to know that.

I'm doing an English to Greek translation of the manual but I stopped it because Uwe wrote to me, about a month ago, that there was a final version coming up. I'll wait for that final version PDF and then I'll resume my translation project.
 
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This is great. It will be timely with Crete coming out early next year!
Uwe
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Vasilis
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uweeickert wrote:
This is great. It will be timely with Crete coming out early next year!
Uwe


Crete cannot come out soon enough!
It's nice to have a game that simulates less-known conflicts of the war.

Plus, I hail from Crete! laugh
 
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