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Subject: Chunky Fighters: Dungeon Crawl rss

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Rob Freeman
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This is a solo variant (or maybe could be run like a DnD campaign?) for Chunky Fighters.

So far i have a few ideas:

-Exploring system
Thinking of another great pnp game Zombie in my Pocket using premade tiles for different rooms that one draws and then places accordingly and then draws from event deck seeing how many monsters appear or an Inn or a blacksmith or merchant (this would all take some play testing to figure out whats what) seems easy to make and still portable. players can make team go back and forth to kill monsters or to look for certain events? or to grind experience(if leveling is implemented) maybe a time system like ZimP but definitely a "inside/outside" mechanic where you can't go to the Dragon's Lair right away.

-Player Sheets
The player has a sheet with their team (a melee, a healer/mage, and a long range [ I think a bowman is necessary]) You start out with your medium stats and need to buy upgrades and can't first aid past your start stats unless upgraded (from blacksmith) keeps track of turns, gold, potions, party order, etc.

-Shared Monster dice
Sticks with the normal pack of 16 but no weapons die for the multitube of monsters
1 stack is boss and the other 3 are monsters
Monsters are in different sizes small (1) medium (2)and large (3)
-Smal: could include Rats or Demons with 1 face being on each die so having lots of them!)
-Medium: I was thinking Goblins or Kobolds (themed as miners w/ pickaxes and hats why else are they in the dungeon/cave? )
-Large: Bat ( [w]{b}[w]* set sideways needs a long range attacker to shoot wings off) or snake [h]{b}{b} that can poison) or stood upright as skeletons or something?)
a set amount of max monsters based on the die available would need to happen so possibly 3 small 1 med as a combo in a room or 3 med 1 large?
(I'll explain monster combat later)
*w = wings

The boss is a big dragon that has a weapon die fire fangs blah blah blah
but is shaped like...[w]
.......................[h]{b}[l] so it has a lot more defense and can fly away! but you still roll him as per normal
I feel like monsters should have health based on size so small monsters would die after 1 hit and med after 2 of each body part.

-Monster combat die: a normal d6 with 2 blank sides, 2 sides with 1, 1 side with 2, 1 side with 3. This is who the monster aims at and a body hit die is still used but will always be 1 point of damage (unless snake poison) So order is important you want your damage taker upfront and range matters in some cases hence an archer character.

-Leveling
Maybe leveling could be a mechanic, after so much exp. then can get level ability cards discussed in the other thread (p.s. sorry for hijacking it)

-Characters
-Knight is a must he is perfect for this. He can take the damage and deal it)
-Mage maybe can first aid more in this variant or splash damage?
-Archer in order to kill flying things
-Maybe others I'm not sure tell me what you think
Player has a pawn that he places on the map to represent the whole team.
I don't think it should be overly complicated and I fear i might have done that but I think a little more depth and strategy might make this game more appealing to other gamers? Hopefully this project can turn into something amazing!
(I wish I had a scanner to show some drawings but i hope my "diagrams worked out)
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Nick Hayes
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Great ideas so far. Here's what I'm thinking.

All fighters can take on the dungeon, not just fantasy themed ones. So choose your favorite guys and go at it.

Game shouldn't be too complicated/deep so that it is on the same level as the original game. So no character sheets, since all the info you need is already on the fighter.

I wouldn't include Exp, but I do like the idea of working for more HP and weapons.
-Fighters start with weakest weapon. Must get money and return to weapon shop/armorer to upgrade weapons.
-Each fighters weapons have a cost, and can be bought individually! So, for instance, the Soldier starts with the survival knife, and can buy a pistol, rifle, etc. on up to the rocket launcher. Amazon can buy a bow and arrow or spear, etc.
-Ranged weapons already exist (laser, guns, magic, etc.), you just have to get enough money to buy them.

Raising HP-hmm... money? number of kills? OH! What if you can turn in enemy body parts/heads for money or levels? There would be a headhunter's shop or something.

Able to earn your fighters special ability. Although some probably wouldn't translate well at all in this game. So maybe not.

Monsters
-I like the small, med, large enemies. I think I'd just assign specific hit dice to each monster. Rats use the weak die, orcs use the med die, etc.
-I like the idea of long monsters (snake), but I would avoid new body part types, like wings. For some monsters, you'd have to indicate (like in a bestiary or something) which part is the head, legs, etc. Rats would obviously be all body.
-Most monsters appear with a set number of HP. Only some of the larger ones should be rolled.

Exploring
-This goes with keeping the game simple. I love the zombie in my pocket idea, but I wonder if we should use it. What about a simple hallway board (which could even be optional to use) and a deck of room/event cards.
-Cards show which enemies appear and which room your party is in. Could still be the hallway, even.
-Some cards could be just treasure, or maybe a new weapon?
-Should you get money for defeating enemies? Probably not, I think, since you can collect monster parts for other upgrades.
-But how would we work returning to specific locations?(blacksmith, inn, etc.)

Well, that's all I can think of now. This is exciting.
 
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Rob Freeman
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-I just thought the character sheets would make it easier to track upgrades, gold, and status
-lol Yeah i forgot about the amazon's bow, tentacles, soldier's gun and that makes it more like your idea of random fighters together
-Does the party order idea work? I think it would help keep damage centered on the "tank" especially with the player hit die.
-Turning in heads might be hard because there'd be less enemies near the end but that could be good too but by the time you are there you'd be fighting rats with strong weapons. I think this would be more complicated but tokens as heads? or a place to count heads on a player sheet
-I don't think wings would be become a problem if there is a bestiary tracking all possible monsters to find
-I don't think the room tiles would complicate things I think it would organize them. It would help keep track of specific locations and such and add an exploring feeling because you don't know whats in the next room a dead end or a blacksmith.

On the subject of monsters besides a dragon boss there could be a troll/giant boss who is 2x3
I can't think of any other small things besides rats...
 
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Nick Hayes
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One thing I think I need to keep in mind is that this is going to be a separate game (and entry) from Chunky Fighters. So we don't have to keep it to just dice.

With that in mind, I do like the room tiles. A lot. And now that we've broadened our possible components, we can also have tokens, markers, or whatever.

So why not track treasure/money with tokens? It is very simple to have a token with one coin on it, another with three coins, one with a gold bar, etc. That way, players can actually pick up and keep the treasure they find in the dungeon. By the same token (no pun intended), you could track kills with tokens, too. That's easy.

As far as tracking levels, that's simple: the levels are the different health levels on each body part. Or beyond that, we could even designate HP levels for each fighter at specific levels (e.g.: level one: head 1HP, body 2HP, legs, 1HP).

Upgrades are also easy. The only thing you can upgrade is a fighter's weapon.

Abilities. The fighter ability cards from the main game won't work, so they cannot be used. However, maybe we can include a list of generic abilities that a fighter can eventually earn. I am thinking that a fighter can only ever earn one ability. So, why not just have ability tokens (one token per ability), and when a fighter earns an ability, you choose which one he gets and take that token.

Edit: Needed to finish the post

I understand your idea about party order. Basically shaped like an upside-down T-block in Tetris, right? The guy up front gets hit most often, then the guys on the sides, and the guy in the middle has the least chance of getting hit. I do like this idea.

My suggestion was going to be a bit simpler. Whenever you encounter monsters, you just have to choose who fights which monster. Maybe your Wizard has taken a beating, so you face him off with the rat. Your Tentacle Monster is still healthy, and a high level, so you pit him against the orc, etc. You could choose to have any number of fighters per enemy, so teaming up is possible. And if the enemies outnumber you, then one fighter might have to fight two monsters at once.
Of course, boss fights would use the whole party.

The only way a monster could end up fighting a different fighter than the one(s) you choose is if it kills that fighter. Then you have to pick a new fighter to face it. Or perhaps the fighter can run away, in which case you'd put in a different fighter. I think there'd have to be a penalty for running, though.
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Nick Hayes
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A quick question:
Making dice can be a real pain, especially if you're folding and gluing paper. I've been working on some ideas for this dungeon game, and I want to make sure the number of dice doesn't get out of hand.

The game will include more than the standard 20 dice from a C.F. expansion, but how many more?

Question:How many dice is too much?
 
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Rob Freeman
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i never expected the die to be more than the basic set thats how i was planning the dungeon crawl in my head hence the shared monster dice are the best solution to the problem

i think making the hps different from the die will create too much complications but maybe create caps like at level 1 you are allowed to upgrade 1 body part level 2 1 body part and one weapon level 3... etc.

for the order i just meant 1 2 3 in a line but a t-block makes much more sense and i agree your way is simpler but harder to defeat large mobs of enemies and harder to level a party of three and also could be harder to keep track of when against 8 rats but scraps of paper would help that

should a die of some sort be created to decide chance encounters like running away poison or whatever chance things could happen in this game
 
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Rebekah B
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I enjoy making dice, so I may not be the best person to answer, but I would guess that most people who are willing to make 20 dice aren't going to be put off by making 30, 40, or maybe even 50 dice if the game is appealing enough. If some or all of the characters can do double duty as Chunky Fighters, I think it would make it more likely that people would put the effort into making it.

Are you planning on making it so you can reuse the same dice during the game? So you would only have to make one rat, for example, that you would roll (or whatever) every time you meet a rat in the game?

Black Canyon wrote:
Making dice can be a real pain, especially if you're folding and gluing paper. I've been working on some ideas for this dungeon game, and I want to make sure the number of dice doesn't get out of hand.

The game will include more than the standard 20 dice from a C.F. expansion, but how many more?

Question:How many dice is too much?
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Nick Hayes
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Ok, here's some of the stuf I have written so far. Keep in mind that this is the pre-testing, still-brainstorming phase.
Quote:
Use Chunky Fighters (original,EX, MX, etc.) as your explorers. Most everyone should have these made already. The game calls for a party of four Fighters, so choose your favorites and see how they fare in the dungeon. The game will support 1-4 players. So at the most, each player will be using his one favorite Fighter.

The Fighters start off in a town, and can chose to explore three different regions: Forest, Labyrinth, and Caves. Exploring is similar to Zombie in my Pocket or Munchkin Quest where players move from randomly placed tile to tile. Each region can be reached from each other region. For example, when exploring the forest, you might find an entrance to the caves. Then, while exploring the caves, you could come out the other end back into the forest and then stumble upon the labyrinth.

The goal of the game is to find the boss monster's lair and destroy the boss monster. This lair (randomly chosen from three, one for each boss monster) is randomly inserted into one of the regions at the beginning of the game.

Along the way you will encounter random groups of monsters (which can also be used in a traditional game of Chunky Fighters, by the way). There are six different monsters (not including three boss monsters), and they are either one, two, or three dice tall. All monsters are rolled up just like a normal Fighter.

By killing monsters, your Fighters will earn tokens that can be spent to level up (increase total HP). Or if you can find the Fighter's Guild, you can spend your hard earned tokens there to learn powerful new abilities.

Each room will also contain a random amount of treasure. Of course, you can only claim these valuables once you defeat the monsters standing in your way. Treasure can be used back in town to buy new weapons and heal your Fighter's wounds.

After whittling down the monster list, and including three new dice unique to the game, there will be 45 new dice to create. At first, I was shocked by this number. But now I'm kind of happy with it, because it allows for a great variety of encounters in the game, and it's just slightly more than the size of two expansions.

The game will also include 24 location tiles, 12 fighter markers (one for each fighter from all the expansions) and various counters for gold, kills, potions, and abilities. All in all, it will be a pretty hefty PnP game, worthy of its own game page here on BGG.

Edit: I miscounted the number of dice and tiles. It's 24 tiles and 45 dice.
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Scott Armstrong
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So, I have read the other ideas on here about dungeon-esque gameplay, but have not been on in a while. But, while I was away, I had some ideas, so here they are! My version may be a bit more compact, but it could also incorperate some other ideas from other people. I have some ideas as to what the cards would look like. Once I get around to drawing them, I'll post them.



A deck of cards will be the 'dungeon.' Players go through the dungeon by flipping one card at a time and dealing with what shows up. Cards will have different backs based on their 'level' of the dungeon. The first dungeon expansion could have 45 cards, 15 at each level. Players would shuffle the cards by level, and then stack them with the level three pile at the bottom, two in the middle, and one at the top.

There would be three key aspects to the face of the card; the enemies, the loot or rewards, and the action section.

Action section: This is an idea I haven't fleshed out yet, but perhaps there could be some sort of modifier for this fight only.

Enemies: There would be a visual representation of what enemies are present and their strength (either preset or random). Different enemies would have different attacks and sizes (rats being one die, ogres being three). There could be more than one enemy per card, fight them as you would two seperate enemies!

Loot or reward: I can see four seperate rewards occuring and each fight giving the player a certain combination of them. The four rewards are Weapon, Experience, Gold, and Potions. A Weapon reward would raise the level of ONE character's weapon. Experience can be shared among the characters and helps level them up (more on this later). Gold can be used at the end of each level of the dungeons to buy potions and weapon upgrades (again, more later). Potions would heal a person or give back mana (once again, more later).

Loot would be kept track of on dice; weapon upgrades would immediately change the weapon on the weapon die, gold could be kept track of on a D20 (or two D10s, or paper, but a D20 would keep gold a rare commodity by limiting a player's money pouch to 20, if potions were three gold each and weapon upgrades were ten), XP tracking will be mentioned below, and potions on a die as well (one health potion die, one mana potion die).

How to begin: While the recommended amount of adventurers is three (hypothetically), a players could choose as many characters as they want to go through the dungeon. A challenge would be to take only one all the way through! Tougher, but that character would get all the loot and might be quite formitable at the end! Perhaps a different challenge would be to start with one character, and add a new, level one character after you finish each 'level' of the dungeon.

A player would roll their characters as normal, but always start with the weakest weapon. Characters could also start with some entry level supplies, like a potion or five gold. Then, they start flipping the cards and fighting!

Levels: With the new character cards coming out, maybe there could be a dungeon version. I see two ways of dealing with leveling. Firstly, the player keeps track of XP on a piece of paper or using two D10s, adding XP as each character gets it. There could be six or ten levels, and different powers would be raised each level. For instance, any special powers could do more damage or at level one a health potion cures one health, but at level six is cures three. Or a cleric's healing spell costs more mana (if there will be mana) but cures more. Or, sans mana, would just heal more. Perhaps an adept warrior (soldier or knight) would get two attacks per turn at level six, or an extra attack against certain enemies.

Another way to track XP that would be a little cumbersome, but nostalgic, would be to have a player keep XP on a set of dice consisting of a D4, D6, D8, D10, D12, and D20. For every XP that is added, a player puts the number showing one higher on the die. Once a player reaches the highest number on the die, they gain a level! So, once a D6 is on 6, that player goes up a level. When they get one more XP, they place a D8 down with '1' showing. This system makes the levels somewhat well spaced, makes it 60 XP to totally level up, and also has that 'D&D' feel to it, while again sticking to dice!

Each character would level seperately, but potions and gold could be a group thing. One D6 for health potions, showing 0-5, same with mana.

So, moving on, enemies could be different dice high, with rats being one die, goblins at two, and skelatons at three. Perhaps there could be a dungeon expansion with a dragon equaling four or more dice! Or maybe a boa constrictor with four body dice! Players flip a card, and set up the enemies as described on the card. Enemies could be rolled, pre-set strength, or a combo of both.

Each expansion would come with new enemies and new cards, for further levels of the dungeon and possibly a few for earlier levels.



So that is what I have. If anything is unclear, let me know. Sorry for it being a bit TLDR.

-Saej
 
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Nick Hayes
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You have some great ideas in there, Saej.

I like the idea of being able to buy stuff and upgrade between dungeon levels. It's sort of like a break in the action to regroup. You just have to try your hardest to make it to the end of each level. If the dungeon is effectively just a deck of event cards, that is an elegant solution to the problem of finding shops and returning to shops for more stuff.

The main concern I have with an event deck for the dungeon is this: Encounters are predetermined for each card. So with 15-20 cards per section, you will always encounter the same things, just in different order. You will always end up with the same loot, you just acquire it in different order. You mentioned expansions. I imagine those would add more dungeon sections and possibly new monsters. And although this would increase the possibilities of each game, the same limitations are there.

Rob suggested event cards and I even thought about them for a while, too. But because of their lack of randomness, I decided not to use them. My solution is encounter dice. And why not? Chunky Fighters is a dice game. Here's how they work:
-There are two encounter dice, a yellow one (small and medium monsters) and a red one(medium and large monsters).
-Each room tile tells you which encounter dice to roll.
-Each face shows a specific monster or monsters.
-Some faces have a re-roll symbol, meaning you keep that monster and roll again for more monsters.
-There is a maximum monster limit, so if you're unlucky you won't end up fighting a bazillion monsters.

With this system, I can control roughly which monsters you encounter in a given room (red or yellow dice) and how many monsters you will encounter (roll both dice), but the exact number and type of each monster is still random. What's worse, you're rolling to see how many monsters you end up fighting, so there's that tension of hoping you don't have too many re-rolls.

As a side note, treasure is handled the same way. So you will get a random amount of treasure each time, and this time you're hoping you get to keep rolling that die!
 
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Scott Armstrong
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Could there be a possibility of combining the two ideas? The event cards tell you how many baddies to roll, and then how many loot dice to roll? That way you have the advantage of seeing the end of one stage of the dungeon, but also the randomness.

Also, with expansions, I was thinking there would be 15-20 cards per 'level' of dungeon, but perhaps you only use 10? And the 10 are random so you don't know which cards you are missing and which you are going through eventually.

Lastly, perhaps each 'market' at the end of the dungeon could sell different things, or have different prices, and have one special item or deal.
 
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Rob Freeman
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that encounter dice idea is genius
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Scott Armstrong
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Just had a thought on loot dice. Perhaps 3 levels of dice, where a level one loot die would have one gold, two gold, health potion, mana potion, one gold, and nothing. Level two would have more (perhaps a weapon upgrade), and level three would have good loot. After completing a room, that room would say "roll 1 L2 and 2 L1 dice" and there is your haul.

Also, for XP, perhaps 1 XP per body part? So a 3 dice character is 3 XP. It might be slow to level all your characters, but I think that might be a good thing. One 3 dice monster in the beginning might be tough, but you get a good XP haul from him. Later on, one 3 dice monster is not so scary, hence the XP is still 3, but that is not a lot at later levels.
 
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Nick Hayes
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Saej wrote:
I was thinking there would be 15-20 cards per 'level' of dungeon, but perhaps you only use 10.

That's a good option. I actually used that idea in another game I designed.

Three loot dice seems a bit excessive to me. I can see how with your system it could be useful, because it could provide variable treasure, potions, and even new weapons.

Which reminds me, you never fully expanded on mana. Which fighters would use it? I can see the wizard needing it for spells, but who else? And if no one else, can't we find avoid using it at all?

Also, could you explain the exp/level system a bit more? Earlier you said that fighter's abilities would get stronger (spells, potion effectiveness, more actions, etc.). My concern is that, if you try to have too many exp. levels, one of two things will happen: a) the fighter will become way too powerful; or b) there won't be enough of a difference between each level, causing us to devise a secondary system to handle powers gained upon leveling up.
 
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Scott Armstrong
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Perhaps mana can be trashed and instead, the cleric and any other characters that would use magic can just cast a spell instead of attacking.

As far as levels, I'll give you an example of what I think.

Level 1: Potion cures 1 point. Limited to weak weapon. (Starting level)
Level 2: Potion cures 2 points. Limited to weak weapon.
Level 3: Potion cures 3 points. Limited to medium weapon.
Level 4: Potion cures 4 points. Limited to medium weapon. Character gains a power of some sort (additional action again ogres? A healing spell for the mage/cleric dude? An attack spell? Something)
Level 5: Potion cures 5 points. Any weapon.
Level 6: Potion cures 6 points. Any weapon. Second power? Improvement on given power?
Level 7: Potions restores full health. Any weapon.

This could be customized per character, but would hold the same 'frame.' Perhaps a magic user's spell gets more powerful each level, or a totally combat oriented person (Soldier?) get up to 3 actions by the end. Or the Amazon gets a 'free' attack action on any enemy before battle at level 4, and then 2 actions at level 7.

This is a bit deep, but I think this would stop the dungeon crawl from getting to boring.
 
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Nick Hayes
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That is a well thought out system. I like it.

As of now, each fighter only has three different levels. The levels correspond to the fighter's maximum HP and how much it costs to revive them if they die. Potions always heal 3 HP. You can purchase any new weapon if you have the money. So, you can run around with level one fighters wielding strong weapons. You just better hope they can kill everything without taking damage.

One aspect of your system I like a lot is that weapons have a level requirement. I'd like to explore this idea more deeply. Since there are really only three "classes" of weapons (weak, medium, strong), what if the strong weapons are only available to higher level fighters. This would require the player to spend some time leveling up before being able to buy his strongest weapon. This could include medium weapons too, but I think I'd like to simplify it by applying the rule to strong weapons only.

Does that sound like it would work?
 
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Scott Armstrong
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The only 'problem' (option?) I see with three levels is there is not much depth. If you put out dungeon expansions that got 6, 7, 8 levels deep, people will level fully by dungeon 2 and then it is just a fight to the finish. Maybe seven is too many, but maybe not.

Also, I was thinking that characters can always go to their maximum health from level one, but are rolled to begin with. And as potions improve with levels, it will become easier to heal up to max. If level one potions only heal one damage, it might take six or seven potions to heal to full, which is expensive, but it also limits the health naturally in early levels.

With the potions being more potent as you level, it also allows for bigger monsters with perhaps two attacks. Because it would only take one or two potions at high levels to heal completely, you still have actions to attack if you get hit two or three times in between your actions. I hope I explained that right.

Lastly, what about special items? Perhaps one expansion could include a D6 with six different 'items' on it that improve something. They can be bought at the store, but a player can only have one at a time, hence one die. And they cannot be sold. Is this viable later on?
 
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Rob Freeman
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Are levels dungeon floors or levels of the fighter? Because of your plan was for levels of fighters I think 10 would be great but levels of the dungeon sounds much too long
 
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I assumed we were talking about exp. levels for the fighters.

Regardless of how many exp. levels there are for each fighter, the game can be adjusted so that you don't reach maximum level until later in the game.

I guess the main issue is, what changes between each exp. level? Keep in mind that most fighters have between 4 and 10 HP total. Also, they rarely go down to 4 HP before dying. Sometimes, your fighter can die at 9 HP if two of his body parts are at full health. So the most you'd need a potion to heal is only a few HP, to keep HP up on a weak body part.

So I can't see having even more than 5 exp. levels.
 
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Update: I have begun playtesting a prototype of Chunky Dungeon.

I whittled the number dice down again. Chunky Dungeon has 33 new dice. But keep in mind, it also requires four Fighters and combat dice from any of the other Chunky Fighters sets. So for someone who has never built any of the Chunky Fighters, the total is really 53 dice to create a playable copy of the game. But that's still better than it was before.

The game is still a long way from release. But it is definitely on its way.
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John Ashman
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Having just acquired some label paper, dice, and having a lovely boring day at work, my set of original and expansion fighters is complete (well, no d8 yet, grr). Won't be until this weekend when I get to even try it, but already excited for Chunky Dungeon.

Not sure where you're at in playtesting since this is a month old, but what if the size of monster determined what part of the body they could strike? For example, say you were fighting a rat (although I am throwing a vote in for badger, for originality's sake), maybe it should only be allowed to attack the legs and body. Throw a "short monster" icon or somesuch on the die face, indicating head hits are considered misses, like your re-roll marker. This lets you still keep "normal-attack, small monsters" on the yellow encounter die or even have the same monster with different sizes, i.e. sewer rat with icon, dire rat without.

This could allow a bit easier going in the beginning and keeps with the size theme and brings more variation to the way monsters attack. Could go the other way and some strong monsters/bosses get, for instance, a "hit both body and legs simultaneously" icon if they are particularly huge or have multiple limbs. The icon system lets you keep it all on the die, so all you need to remember is what the icon means, rather than "all X-type monsters attack like this."

Of course, this only really matters if potion/leveling balancing is still an issue or more importantly you don't consider it too complicated or not-in-theme. Or maybe I just have nightmares about rats killing me by destroying my head.
 
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Nick Hayes
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John, you brought up a very good point. The funny thing is that I had to figure it out the hard way through playtesting. Where were you last month?!

The small animals cannot hit the head. Firstly, because during playtesting I was often getting killed by small monsters who roll head shots in the early part of the game. Secondly, it makes sense that a rodent cannot attack your head (unless it's a vorpal bunny).

So when a small monster rolls to attack, a head is considered a miss.

As for your dice idea, I like it, but I am desperately trying to keep the number of dice to a minimum by introducing as few new dice as possible. Aside from the monster dice, the only new dice will be the one treasure die and the two encounter dice. And since all of the monsters will be compatible with C.F., there are really only those three new system dice. All the combat can be handled with the original combat die.
 
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John Ashman
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Caldwell
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Many apologies for my tardiness, sir.

Well, with my idea I wasn't adding any dice, but I wasn't the most eloquent so I'll explain briefly. I simply meant you could add a symbol to your encounter die if the monster has a special attack. So, if you rolled a rat, he'd have a fancy S symbol (or whatever) and you'd know he couldn't attack the head. That allows you to keep it on the dice, you only have to remember one or a few symbols, and you don't have to resort to another source/beastiary to see how such-and-such monster attacks. I had the idea from your adding monsters re-roll method.

Making all small monsters have that attribute negates that specific instance, but I wanted to clarify myself. I thought it might give you more leeway for two encounter dice, with small on the same as medium. Say you had a bat, which I'd consider small, it'd still make sense for that to be able to attack your head. Of course it could work for other attacking traits as well: monster always blocks, gets two attacks, regen ability, etc. Just an idea to reincorporate variety with the loss of ability cards.

Edit: I realized having the symbol on the encounter dice seems a bit off, since the monster has dice of its own, but that does allow you to keep creature dice "cleaner" for normal Chunky Fighter. Also, my idea is obviously more long-term oriented, I don't want to compromise the relative simplicity, so might better be implemented in a future expansion if anything. Say, something like a creature-variant die.
 
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Rob Freeman
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maybe a player aid card would also work
just tossing ideas out
 
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Nick Hayes
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Ok, I understand your idea better now. It's good. Right now, I only have two small monsters, two medium monsters, and two large monsters. Each of the two monsters in a size differ from each other, but only the large monsters have anything like special abilities. Anything that is size-specific, like the small monsters being unable to hit the head, is written in the rules. So it's just one very small rule to remember.

I'm really trying to find a good balance between simplicity and complexity for this game. As a separate entity, it can be more complex. As a solo to four player dungeon crawl, it should be more complex. But in that it's related to Chunky Fighters, I don't want it to be too complex. Does that make sense?
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