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Subject: I need RSP's help on sex & money rss

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Catchy thread title eh?

A couple weeks back you folks helped me by answering a poll which I was using to get unscientific opinions about cheating on your spouse. I'm nearing the 80% done point with my new bestseller and have run into a glitch.

My daughter is editing it for me. She was not pissed by what I wrote, but was troubled by whether too many people might take me seriously. Despite the obvious fact that nobody has ever taken me seriously I have given this more thought. I would like some more raw data before any serious editing or rewriting.

Can you respond to the following and, if you have the time and willingness, answer as to why. I don't want a poll, I want some opinions.

The situation - You are traveling on business. A golden opportunity presents itself in the form of a superbly crafted example of feminine beauty and sexual magnetism. And, for whatever perverse reason, you know that you can actually score.

Disclaimer - I know you love your wife/GF/Whatever. She is hot in whatever way hot is for you. That's not what this is about. Think of it as sort a male version of Erica Jong's Zipless Fuck. A body and sexual allure beyond what you are used to having. And you can taste it for a few hours and not ever look back. There is zero chance your wife/GF/Whatever will ever discover your indiscretion.

Answer- Do it? Not do it? Why?

The second question...

The Situation - You have observed the trauma that takes place in lives when couples divorce or separate after cohabitating. Money becomes the arena and the anger, angst and acrimony is literally off the scale in many cases. Even over modest sums. But still... you love her. Yet, you understand that no matter how secure "you" feel, there's a 50/50 chance you'll end up splitting and an even better chance you'll be a lot worse off financially if the cards run against you.

Disclaimer- I know your little life is perfect and your honey is a real honey who would never ask you for anything she didn't deserve if you split the sheets. You trust her. Right? You're a team. Right? So ask yourself then, how many men who got drug backwards through a knothole in divorce court and then dumped into a tree shredder by the judge's decision didn't see it coming? This isn't about her... or "you & her"... it's about you.

Answer - Do you keep money secrets? Hide some. Squirrel away some acorns for a rainy day that only you know about? If so, why? If not, why not?

I know answering openly in this thread is a liability... which, if you think that means you already have secrets about your real mindset from the little lady. feel free to ignore the thread if that's the case or perhaps GM me. I am beyond trustworthy and would never let your wife/GF/whatever know. Unless she's like super-HOT and I can score that is.
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DCAnderson wrote:
The problem with your poll is that when most of these types of situations come up in real life, what you actually do will probably have little or nothing to do with rational thought.

When we're sitting here answering your poll we can sit down and think the answers through rationally, so the answers we give are going to have little or nothing to do with what will actually happen.


True. I'm still interested in the facade of rational, proper thinking that most men try and exhibit. I also know that events like the Zipless Fuck one never happen if you go looking... but (and this is scary I think) often present themselves when you would never expect it.

The money question seems a little more oriented towards rational risk analysis and self-preservation... especially if kids are involved. I got divorced when I had two elementary school kids and had arranged things in such a fashion that no changes were needed in our lives in the wake of the divorce. Even my ex wasn't surprised that I seemed to have adequate funds afterward.
 
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Just a note... according to national averages after a divorce women and children usually end up living at a lower standard of living and men's standard of living goes way up. So in general the idea that men tend to get screwed over in these break-ups is not really accurate.
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A. Rationally, I won't do it. While morality differ for everyone, marital infidelity is morally wrong for me. I am fine with mild forms of white lies, but living honestly is rather important to me. I think this level of dishonesty would be too much for me to accept myself.

B. I don't keep secret money. Divorce has not crossed my mind. I guess I'm still blissfully naive in that regard.
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DWTripp wrote:
The situation - You are traveling on business. A golden opportunity presents itself in the form of a superbly crafted example of feminine beauty and sexual magnetism. And, for whatever perverse reason, you know that you can actually score.

Disclaimer - I know you love your wife/GF/Whatever. She is hot in whatever way hot is for you. That's not what this is about. Think of it as sort a male version of Erica Jong's Zipless Fuck. A body and sexual allure beyond what you are used to having. And you can taste it for a few hours and not ever look back. There is zero chance your wife/GF/Whatever will ever discover your indiscretion.

Answer- Do it? Not do it? Why?


No, for my own mental health. I'd think about it endlessly and it would invariably screw up my own wellbeing and happiness, and ability to function as a fully-committed partner in my marriage. Then that would screw up my marriage, which is better than a one-nighter.

Quote:
The Situation - You have observed the trauma that takes place in lives when couples divorce or separate after cohabitating. Money becomes the arena and the anger, angst and acrimony is literally off the scale in many cases. Even over modest sums. But still... you love her. Yet, you understand that no matter how secure "you" feel, there's a 50/50 chance you'll end up splitting and an even better chance you'll be a lot worse off financially if the cards run against you.

Disclaimer- I know your little life is perfect and your honey is a real honey who would never ask you for anything she didn't deserve if you split the sheets. You trust her. Right? You're a team. Right? So ask yourself then, how many men who got drug backwards through a knothole in divorce court and then dumped into a tree shredder by the judge's decision didn't see it coming? This isn't about her... or "you & her"... it's about you.

Answer - Do you keep money secrets? Hide some. Squirrel away some acorns for a rainy day that only you know about? If so, why? If not, why not?


No, for the same reason. I think the ability to compartmentalize is largely an illusion, at least for myself. In my experience, it's easier for me to be happy if I am virtuous, and it's easier for me to be virtuous if I act virtuously, and it's easier for me to act virtuously if I think of myself as a virtuous person, and it's easier for me to think of myself as a virtuous person if I don't do unvirtuous things, and ... (repeat until fade).

So basically, I think I'm too lazy to put in all the work that living an effective, believable lie requires. Now if only sloth was a virtue....
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Poll: Compartmentalizing Behavior
1. Can human beings successfully compartmentalize their behavior, so that immoral/unethical behavior in one part of their life has no effect on the other parts of their life?
Absolutely.
Almost always.
Usually.
Sometimes.
Usually not.
Almost never.
Absolutely not.
2. Can you personally successfully compartmentalize their behavior, so that immoral/unethical behavior in one part of your life has no effect on the other parts of your life?
Absolutely.
Almost always.
Usually.
Sometimes.
Usually not.
Almost never.
Absolutely not.
      52 answers
Poll created by dysjunct
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Chief Slovenly
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1. No. Like Kevin, I was cured of any ability to cheat I might've had while in college. A former girlfriend, wronged and possessed with the fury of a thousand suns, screaming at me on my front porch, on Christmas Eve in front of my folks, tends to have the rolled-up newspaper effect (and then some) that cures whatever urges come up as soon as they appear.

Plus there's the whole guilt thing that I couldn't live with -- and truth will out -- so the zipless fuck is impossible. There are some secrets I'm excellent at keeping, but others I'm incredibly shitty about keeping to myself in any form. That's one of them.


2. Yes, but only if I already recognized the marriage was doomed -- and even then I'd run straight into Kevin's patented sloth, incompetence and guilt. So probably not regardless.
Although it's a bit of a trick question for me, anyway: my wife and I have a common pool of money, but each one of us has our own individual accounts where an equal amount of money is deposited with every paycheck (we would still fight like other couples, but never over money... this arrangement was great for that little bit of sanity) -- or at least that was the case before the huge financial meltdown happened and we were both unemployed. Now we're doing all right, with only my wife unemployed, but it's still a lot of budgeting without frivolous expenses. So we don't have the individual accounts so much any more, with good reason -- we're watching every nickel.
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bbenston wrote:
Kevin's patented sloth, incompetence and guilt.


That's right, jerks! It's patented, and you all owe me royalties!

(Payable in GeekGold.)
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The first: If I was certain that the hours of play with the strange creature was going to add to my life and especially my life with my wife then I'd be swimming/diving/drowning/surfin'. If I wasn't certain and I was drunk then I'd probably make myself certain. And I've made sure I've discussed this scenario with my wife. Not that we came to an agreement - just it would not be a bolt from the blue.

The second: I like people close to me having the opportunity to make rational decisions. Sure they won't always but at least I am not setting them up to be unable to base their actions on reality. So if the amount of money was significant then "no secret".
 
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1. No -- I had an experience like Brian's that cured me ever wanting to do something like that again. Never have I felt worse about hurting someone else.

2. Again, like Brian, we have three acoutnts: two individual accounts and a joint account (this definitely alleviates the scrutiny of buying a new game or pair of shoes -- all leave it to you to figure out who buys what, but let me say I love these heels). And, hell, if I get divorced I suppose I could always make more money, so I am not too terribly worried about it. Definitely not worried enough about it to squirrel away my own money with having a "guilty secret" as the cost.
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I doubt strongly I could have a one night stand and be unchanged. Historically, my brain has to be turned on for anything else to follow suit. I tried to get around it a few times, but felt the worse for it. If I'm stimulated enough to want to fuck somebody, I'm most likely stimulated enough to want to date them. There would be a wedge in my heart.

I have been tempted, but my perception of extramarital sex is that it's a very elaborate form of masturbation. It's cheaper and much safer to just "roughen up the witness" and get the impulse out of your system.

Given the crazy amount of divorce I grew up with, I know that it is a real possibility for everybody. My dad actually counseled me to keep money on the side, just in case. Couldn't do it.

I learned a while ago that a big component of love was being open enough that something and could happen; if you're guarding yourself, you're not invested enough in the relationship for it to be worth while.
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So far I think Dan is right... when your big head is in control you fear the potential disaster of the woman finding out about your indiscretion.

I expected the money question to be answered as it has been so far. If you fall into that 50% divorce pool and there is some actual money there you may well look back and wish you had done things differently.

You few who answered? You did read the part where I said you'd never be discovered didn't you? Unless, of course, like a fool, you blabbed it out to the wife or GF.

As to Meerkat's data... I've read that too. And I'm unsure about how true it actually is. No doubt many women get dumped back into the workforce unprepared and with kids. Those same women also demand the kids... in most cases. Is this some sort of expected behavior? Do divorced women with children self-immolate by demanding custody be given to them when they know their eventual situation will be a drastic reduction in personal economy... to their detriment and that of their children?

What would the picture look like if the woman went to court and said she wouldn't fight the divorce so long as the father had custody and she was required to pay child support at the going percentage? Would we be a nation with a "deadbeat mom" problem?

I also considered the possibility that RSP'ers tend to have such low libidos that they could be offered a sexual adventure with no downside by a beautiful woman and actually wonder if it would be as interesting as a new expansion for Carcassonne.
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DWTripp wrote:
Answer- Do it? Not do it? Why?

No.

However, I can tell you it would make for a pretty fucking boring story.

(As far as why... I don't know. Partly pride--no matter how hot this person is, they can't control me. Partly laziness--if I only do things I can tell the truth about later, then life is easier. Partly because I have no respect for people who cheat. And partly so that I can bust out the line I'm saving for that situation, ha ha ha. And no, I'm not telling you what it is, because then you'll put it in your book, and I'll have to come up with something else next time I'm at an Arch Enemy concert and Angela Gossow invites me back to her tour bus, or I'm hitchhiking to Koldfoot's house and I get picked up by Lisa Kelly. You have to be prepared for those situations!)

DWTripp wrote:
Answer - Do you keep money secrets?

No. I don't know how much money we have now, or where it is. I just earn it; she's the one who pays the bills, refinances the house, etc. etc. (Which is weird, because when I was a kid, I was way into 12-page character sheets tracking every copper piece of my PCs' net worth. You'd think I would be into that sort of thing in real life, too.)

If things went sideways and she took everything, I think the money wouldn't be that big of a deal; my tastes & hobbies are pretty cheap. She & the kids have been out of town since last week, and I'm getting by just fine on frozen burritos & free porn.
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DWTripp wrote:

I also considered the possibility that RSP'ers tend to have such low libidos that they could be offered a sexual adventure with no downside by a beautiful woman and actually wonder if it would be as interesting as a new expansion for Carcassonne.


Hey, watch it. It is not low libidos. It is just extremely high gamebidos.
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DWTripp wrote:
You few who answered? You did read the part where I said you'd never be discovered didn't you? Unless, of course, like a fool, you blabbed it out to the wife or GF.

Yep. Read it. Still damn near impossible. Truth will out, no matter what. I think the bigger fool is someone who thinks he can cover it up. Or maybe it's just me, guilty conscience, lazy ass and all.

DWTripp wrote:
I also considered the possibility that RSP'ers tend to have such low libidos that they could be offered a sexual adventure with no downside by a beautiful woman and actually wonder if it would be as interesting as a new expansion for Carcassonne.

Dude. Please. Whatever you think of Spike Lee, he does have one great line in the beginning of Do the Right Thing:

Spike Lee wrote:
Ain't never too hot to fuck.

And Carcassonne? That's like Carlin talking about golf:

George Carlin wrote:
It's like watching flies fuck. I get more excited picking out socks.
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kuhrusty wrote:
I'll have to come up with something else next time I'm at an Arch Enemy concert and Angela Gossow invites me back to her tour bus


Get out of my fantasy!
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When this thread runs its course, you may be able to pick out the guys who did NOT answer and answer yes for them to at least one of the questions. I can tell you that I don't have a secret stash, as I watched how lying about money drove a wedge between my brother and his ex. As for the other question, I generally refrain from talking about me and The Deed online. What doesn't happen in my pants stays in my pants. Or something like that.
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1. No. I am generally a pretty honest person, and wouldn't want to put myself in a position where I'd have to lie.

2. I wouldn't keep money secret, but I do keep money separate without it being a secret that I have it. Currently, my girlfriend and I each contribute monthly to a joint account from which we pay all our joint expenses (rent, food, etc). We also each have our own separate accounts to do whatever we want with. The system seems to work fine for us. I guess it is sort of a secret, since I don't know how much she has in her personal account, and she doesn't know how much I have in mine, but there is no deception involved.
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Re cheating:

DWTripp wrote:
A golden opportunity presents itself in the form of a superbly crafted example of feminine beauty and sexual magnetism.

IT'S A TRAP!

Given my history of such opportunities and current situation, I'll be honest and say that I would seriously consider going for it. However, in that scenario, I'd be 50% "there's gotta be an ulterior motive" and 50% "there's something wrong with someone interested in me" and as a result almost certainly pass; pathetic but true.

Re money:

My wife handles all of the finances and investments. For all I know, she's the one squirreling away the acorns. So my answer is "N/A". However, if I had the opportunity to do so, I would not bother, as I am fortunate enough in that I have high income but am comfortable with living a very modest lifestlye. I also feel dishonesty about money in a relationship is a much greater wrong than your one-time adultery scenario.
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DarthXaos wrote:
First situation:

I do it, and invite my bisexual GF to come and join. Cause I wouldn't seriously date a chick in the first place if she wasn't down with open relationships and bisexual.

Any man who says this but isn't willing to bring another guy into the bed (and get down with that guy for the pleasure of his woman) is no man at all, and worse: a hypocrite.

DW, here are my thoughts:

1. I have no idea how I would react. I've had such offers/opportunities since I got married, but the 'guarantee of secrecy' depended on the discretion of the women making the pitch. That just ain't airtight. There is also the matter of none of them having been more sexually attractive than my wife, although they were pretty.

The consequence-free aspect ain't all of it, though. I was quite the proud slut in my single days, but those were defined by my wolfish ways. 3 years ago I made a pretty important promise, to myself and to another person. On the basis of that promise, I'll say (with my head, now) that I might flirt, but I'd not dally.

2. Much easier to answer. I'm horrible with money. Shenomad's great. She's had full control over all of our income since long before we got married. I do not expect that will ever change. Besides, should things ever go sour her power of her my heart is much more potentially devastating than her control of my money.
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DWTripp wrote:
A golden opportunity presents itself in the form of a superbly crafted example of feminine beauty and sexual magnetism. And, for whatever perverse reason, you know that you can actually score.

Could this hypothetical woman be really tall? Like maybe about 6 foot 1? With a bit of a harsh air about her, hair in a bun? Because my answer might depend on that.

Not that I've been thinking about this lately or anything.
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tommynomad wrote:
DarthXaos wrote:
First situation:

I do it, and invite my bisexual GF to come and join. Cause I wouldn't seriously date a chick in the first place if she wasn't down with open relationships and bisexual.

Any man who says this but isn't willing to bring another guy into the bed (and get down with that guy for the pleasure of his woman) is no man at all, and worse: a hypocrite.


As a man who would be as interested in bringing in another man as another woman (arguably more interested, as I've already done the MFF thing twice), I disagree. There is nothing necessarily hypocritical in saying, "Here are my criteria for a serious relationship," even if you yourself don't meet those criteria.

On to the OP. I've been in situation #1 and passed. I'm susceptible to temptation, so I think it would be dishonest of me to claim that I would never stray, but I think it's extremely unlikely. As you know, at a certain point in your life you have a pretty good understanding of who you are and what matters to you, and that makes it easier to resist instant gratification that isn't worth it. Sex with a stranger, no matter how hot and no matter that Trish would never know, just isn't worth it.

On #2, if we divorced I'd want her to get at least half of our assets, in part because she's the primary caregiver for our children. Even if things got so nasty that I somehow didn't want her to have anything (hard to imagine, but I've seen some nasty divorces), I know that our kids would always be her top priority so I'd still want her to have the money.

Oh, and the 50% stat is B.S.
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1. No, for a bunch of reasons. In no particular order of importance
I am not a liar and I promised in front of my friends that I wouldn't stray.
I would not be able to keep it secret.
Sex with someone I don't know no matter how good looking isn't appealing.

2. No, because I can't keep secrets. I've been known to not discuss certain purchases, but she usually sees the new games anyway. laugh


My great aunt once quoted some famous guy (whose name escapes me) and it stuck with me.

I don't steal not because I am afraid that I'd be caught, but because I am not a thief.

I use that to provide a moral cover for my complete inability to be deceptive. laugh
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Quote:
Oh, and the 50% stat is B.S.


I've often wondered about that. Some "authorities" have it as high as 62% others down in the 40% range. What are you basing your assertion on?
 
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Answer: No, but I would jerk off to it later.

Answer: No, I would split the dough 50/50.
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