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Descent: Journeys in the Dark» Forums » General

Subject: Quest 4 "Spoiled Brat" starting glyph? rss

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Franck@DoW
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Hi all...

While getting ready to play the fourth quest tomorrow, I noticed that on this quest there are 2 active (white) glyphs on the map...

Is it normal? And in this case can the heroes choose to split and start the game on or near both of them?

Or is it a misprint and should only one of them be used as the starting glyph, putting the other one its inactive side up (and in this case I'm pretty sure the Hero players will be happy to get the chance to earn some extra Conquest Tokens for the second one)?

Sorry if this question already was asked but I couldn't find it on the boards... And thanks in advance...

 
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Andy Watkins
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no idea but it is the next mission i shall be playing so i am interested in the answer.

i am assuming it is deliberate and you can split the heroes
 
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Ed Rozmiarek
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There's nothing in the FAQ about it. Given how long the base game has been out and that there is no mention of it in the FAQ, I would have to assume that having two starting glyphs is correct. And after looking at the quest, it seems reasonable.
 
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Jeremy Lennert
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Rules, page 6 wrote:
Starting with the first hero and continuing clockwise, each hero player places his figure on the map on or adjacent to AN activated glyph, with no more than one figure in each space.

It's uncommon, but there's no reason the quest can't have more than one glyph start active, and I am aware of no reason to think it is a mistake in this case. There is at least one expansion quest where they make a big deal of the heroes starting on different glyphs.
 
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Franck@DoW
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Thanks to all of you for these quick answers...

You must be right and I can now see at least one use of them here: Maybe it's only to remove the possibility for the overlord of early spawns in the case the heroes can't battle their way around the middle rubbles...

By the way, I'll be the bad guy today and I can already laugh in advance to when I will say to the players: "Too bad that glyph was already active earlier... You could really have use of those 3 conquest tokens now, nyark, nyark, nyark or is it Mouhahahaha"
 
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Franck@DoW
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Hello!

The game took place yesterday and as I had planned, I managed to take away the last Conquest Token from my Heroes right while they were grouping and preparing to open the door to the last room...

As we usually don't play twice the same quest (I don't know what's the general feeling here about this, but we tend to think that Heroes knowing the dungeons in advance spoils the fun for both sides) I couldn't resist to
Spoiler (click to reveal)

show them that a Glyph and a silver chest were waiting for them just behind the door...

Doing this I forgot about the "Too bad that glyph was activated in the first place" sentence but it's even more evil like that... Mouhahahaha

Spoiler (click to reveal)

Funny enough, as the princess started to be a real pain for them (having one of them forced to run across the dungeon instead of teleporting to town and back) they started to joke about the girl being a *beep*, and "we're not baby sitters, we're adventurers sorts of puns"...
That's the moment I realized I didn't tell them how the quest was called and found it was a good time to let them know ;-)


This evens things out in our group:
Heroes: 2 (first two quests)
Overlord: 2 (last two ones)

More to come...

The game was a blast (as usual).
And there's a new fan out there as one of our friend was doing her first Journey in the Dark and enjoyed it

Thanks for your help sorting the starting glyph mystery out

We are wondering about starting playing with Treachery (possibly in its randomized variant version) for the next quest... If we do, I plan to give the heroes access to the expansions potions types and skill cards to even things out
Is it too early according to you?
 
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Jeremy Lennert
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In terms of complexity, treachery is actually pretty easy, so I certainly don't think it's too early for you to understand and exploit it.

In terms of balance, I don't think the extra skills and treasures boost the heroes' overall power very much (except in the specific case of Landrec or a caster with Prodigy using the Sunburst rune), and the WoD treasures actually make the treasure decks more balanced between melee, ranged, and magic, and arguably less powerful on average. Adding just the skills and items is probably closer to your current balance point than adding them and treachery. So I'd probably add the new items and skills immediately, but only add treachery if you think your heroes are ready for an increased challenge (you may wish to note that quests 5 and 7 are considered quite hard, but quest 6 is considered very easy).
 
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Franck@DoW
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Antistone wrote:
In terms of complexity, treachery is actually pretty easy, so I certainly don't think it's too early for you to understand and exploit it.

In terms of balance, I don't think the extra skills and treasures boost the heroes' overall power very much (except in the specific case of Landrec or a caster with Prodigy using the Sunburst rune), and the WoD treasures actually make the treasure decks more balanced between melee, ranged, and magic, and arguably less powerful on average. Adding just the skills and items is probably closer to your current balance point than adding them and treachery. So I'd probably add the new items and skills immediately, but only add treachery if you think your heroes are ready for an increased challenge (you may wish to note that quests 5 and 7 are considered quite hard, but quest 6 is considered very easy).


Thanks, that's exactly the type of info I was looking for...

When speaking of "too early", I meant in term of balance not in complexity (sorry if that wasn't clear, but as English is not my mother tongue I tend to "turn sentences around" when I don't know the correct words to tell things blush )

In fact I was already aware of the lack of balance in the treasures between ranged, melee and magic (first time poster here, but long time reader) so I had already added some of the treasures from the expansions in the deck before the first play (basically at the time I had removed the cards which made mention of rules not available in the core set like "bleed", "cursed items" or "prolonged action"). Now I think we are ready to jump in with all those rules and add all items and skill cards as you suggest (by the way, I don't know if cursed items tend to help one side or the other)...

As you pointed, we are quite happy with the balance we have: 2-2 is a good score and for all the games we had (maybe with the exception of Quest #2), it was difficult to find out which side would be the winner for a long time (We had some games with the heroes losing while they had 12+ Conquest Tokens and I lost a game as the Overlord whereas I had managed to bring them down to 1 Token) even if I could have used that "Crushing Blow" card once Battlemage Jaes ended with "Curse of Rot" and "Ring of the Arcan" gold treasures yesterday ninja

We're more looking for added variety and wouldn't mind giving a go to
those new monsters that have been getting bored in the expansions boxes for so long

So I will probably wait to introduce Treachery either that
- Tomb of Ice and the feats cards becomes available in french (they look like treachery for the heroes aren't they?)
- We finish the Quests from the core game and move the the Well of Darkness ones
- We give a try at it in the 6th quest which is considered easy (maybe we could use the variant about using the "Reinforcement Marker" from Road to Legend in this case as well)

In the meantime I'll go as per your suggestion and add all items and skills from Wod and AoD.

Oh... And last question for now : What about adding as well the Overlord cards which don't have Treachery value in the mix? Would this have an impact on balance?

Thanks for the hints and for your time
 
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Jeremy Lennert
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beewee wrote:
Tomb of Ice and the feats cards becomes available in french (they look like treachery for the heroes aren't they?)

They aren't mechanically similar to Treachery, but they do look very much as if they were designed to give the heroes a bonus mechanic to balance out treachery, yes.

beewee wrote:
Oh... And last question for now : What about adding as well the Overlord cards which don't have Treachery value in the mix? Would this have an impact on balance?

A little. Most of them are spawn cards, which tend to be among the overlord's better options, and there are a couple that are just really good (like Danger in AoD, which is the same as a treachery card in WoD), but they also increase the overlord's deck size, which adds uncertainty and makes it harder to get 3 conquest from cycling the deck. They're certainly less significant than adding treachery--treachery helps as much by removing crappy cards from the deck as by adding good ones, and most of the additional non-treachery cards are clearly not as good as treachery cards.
 
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Franck@DoW
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Antistone wrote:
beewee wrote:
Tomb of Ice and the feats cards becomes available in french (they look like treachery for the heroes aren't they?)

They aren't mechanically similar to Treachery, but they do look very much as if they were designed to give the heroes a bonus mechanic to balance out treachery, yes.

Looks good...
Just have to wait for the french version then ;-)

Antistone wrote:
beewee wrote:
Oh... And last question for now : What about adding as well the Overlord cards which don't have Treachery value in the mix? Would this have an impact on balance?

A little. Most of them are spawn cards, which tend to be among the overlord's better options, and there are a couple that are just really good (like Danger in AoD, which is the same as a treachery card in WoD), but they also increase the overlord's deck size, which adds uncertainty and makes it harder to get 3 conquest from cycling the deck. They're certainly less significant than adding treachery--treachery helps as much by removing crappy cards from the deck as by adding good ones, and most of the additional non-treachery cards are clearly not as good as treachery cards.

We might give it a try next game then... Unfortunately I don't see one in the feoreseable future... can't wait to another Hack'n'slash session...

Thanks again for all your help...

 
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