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Subject: Twilight Imperium or A Game of Thrones? rss

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I don't know anything about these two games other than what I have read here. I am curious about them, and thinking of buying one of them.

Anyone got any thoughts?
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Brad D
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I've played both, though only a couple games of each. TI has a more balanced starting iirc. AGOT is fun, and the expansions add depth. But the game isn't exactly balanced, which can be good or bad depending on your style and preference.

TI does take a longer amount of time to play, but the dynamic board set up adds to the replay value.
 
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And TI3 has a lot more options and strategies, I've played AGOT, but wasn't blown away.
IMO TI3 is far superior, but the two games are so entirely unlike that there is no way to really compare them.
 
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Yes it's hard to compare but Agot is the better game, unless you want a 8 hour saturday session of TI.
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David C
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Heliconia wrote:
Yes it's hard to compare but Agot is the better game, unless you want a 8 hour saturday session of TI.


I can't give this post three thumbs up, so I'm going to quote it and say, "HEAR HEAR"

For a game of TI:3, you basically need
a) Four players. Yeah, you could get away with 2, and you could play with 3, but really, I'd recommend 4-5 players for the game to really be all it can be.
b) Seriously, no exaggeration, no nothing...it's not uncommon for a game of TI to run 8-10 hours.

I didn't completely like TI:3. I thought it was a wargame with weird eurogame goofiness thrown ontop of it ('everyone votes for victory points!')
 
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Kåre moll Christiansen
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....I'm currently looking to trade my copy og AGoT away. Not because it's a bad game, but since I've got many other games that I enjoy playing when gathered 4 or 5 friends for an evening. TI3 on the other hand a very unique game that will never ever leave my collection.

Admittedly TI3 is a (very very) long game, and yes it is a monstrous patchwork of different game mechanisms from a broad variety of euro and ameritrash games, but as such it offers a brilliant gaming experience of epic dimensions that I've not encountered in any other game.You build civilizations, make diplomacy, take political decisions and engage in war and trade agreements. You've got the modular board, lots of different races with different traits and innumerous different cards that pulls every game in a new direction making each game unique and unexpected.

That being said TI3 is both expensive (especially since the expansion Shattered empire is needed to get the full game experience)and difficult to get on the table. These facts are indeed worth taking into account before buying the game.

Are you willing to spend that kind of money on a game that you're probably going to play less than 10 times a year. For me it is not a difficult question - but also I know that I have the friends that are willing to invenst the time to learn the rules and to gather up for a weekend of untamed space coolness once in a while.

the choice is yours
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How long does AGOT take to play?

I understand that TI takes FOREVER, but is AGOT any faster?

Both of them are somewhat outside my standard gaming fare, but I am very curious about both.
 
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Cole Medeiros
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To curb the problem of this game taking forever and willing players never having a whole day to kill at the same time, we set a time limit (5 hr usually) and wjoever has the most points wins. I enjoy playing this game a lot...

AGOT didn't do it for me, but I might have needed more willing players.
 
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AGOT is a lot quicker in my limited experience, and less prone to AP, the first game of AGOT I've ever been in took roughly 2-3 hours (After setup and rules explanations, nobody had played before), though we had relatively little in the way of diplomacy, which I understand is a big part of the game once people get more experienced, so I guess this time is about what you can expect...

A full game of TI3 on the other hand will take at LEAST 5 or 6 hours unless everyone is really experienced (And the comments about the player number are right, I wouldn't play with less than 4, the more players the better, though I've never had an 8-player game of this unfortunately).

In my opinion, it's still worth it, the AGOT experience isn't so unique that I'd pass up the chance to play TI3 even once for it...
 
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Jim Howard
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I'm always hearing around here about how long TI3 takes to play.
I say not so. My group, including 1 AP guy, plays this game consistantly in 3 hours.
 
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Joe Steadman
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GoT
 
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Isaiah Mackler
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Rokin wrote:
I'm always hearing around here about how long TI3 takes to play.
I say not so. My group, including 1 AP guy, plays this game consistantly in 3 hours.


Here! Here! It really doesn't take that long to play, when you're playing with people who understand the rules. When I'm teaching someone knew, I insist (as much as I can w/o being rude) that they go to Fantasy Flight and read the rules, so they come with an idea of how to play. But when you get a core that knows how to play, who have maybe had one or two practice games, the game doesn't take very long. It is a complex game, but its also very rewarding. I think it is pretty much perfect for 5-6 people who want a game they can play every couple weeks for several months; there are lots of different strategies. The board is different each time and there are so many different cards, you'll play for months w/o seeing them all, so there are lots of surprises! And it's epic! I agree that the Shattered Empire expansion, while not necessary, does add some nice tweaks. Its expensive investment, but if you have a group who likes conquest and the space theme, its a real winner! And the production value is top notch, too! Great game!
 
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Joe Steadman
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TI3 is P Rico in Space... Go for GoT, a much better and more evil game.
 
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Jeff Wells
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AGOT is a good game, but TI3 is an EVENT!
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Joe Steadman
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Jeff_Wells wrote:
AGOT is a good game, but TI3 is an EVENT!


Ya, a boring and way to long event... like an Opera.
 
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Nate Merchant
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wmd8tc wrote:
I don't know anything about these two games other than what I have read here. I am curious about them, and thinking of buying one of them.

Anyone got any thoughts?


How about neither? devil

If you have to buy one, and I mean at gunpoint, TI3 with expansion is the way to go. The previous posters are correct about it being epic and (far too) long. AGoT, on the other hand, is neither here nor there, no matter how many times they tried to patch it.

JoeSteadman wrote:


Ya, a boring and way to long event... like an Opera.


Iniquo! How dare you?

 
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Jacob Fulwiler
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I've played TI3, 3 times and thoroughly enjoyed it. Haven't had a chance to play with the expansion, but it sounds like it would definitely make the game better. It is a very long game like others have said, but if you and your friends are up for it, it can be a great experience.

I'm a huge fan of the AGoT series. I own the core game plus both expansions. Depending on how many people you have, you can play 4 - 6 players with the expansions. Personally, my favorite is 4 players with the Storm of Sword expansion. It adds a new map/board and many new mechanics. It is also, better balanced IMO. If you're playing the standard/original board, the Clash of Kings expansion fixes a lot of balance issues. Greyjoy can no longer instantly take out one of Lannister's naval units on the first turn, etc.

The games are so different, they're really hard to compare. Like I said, I own all the AGoT product and another friend of mine owns TI3. Due to the length of TI3, AGoT gets played far more frequently in our group. The biggest complaint people have about AGoT in our group is that people can suffer quite a bit from analysis paralysis and it can cause some unneeded delay.
 
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I was really impressed to see very little animosity between the proponents of one or other of these games. That should tell you something about the relative value of both, they seem to be very close. In my opinion it depends entirely on what will suit you or your group. Do you get to play 6+ hours, or do you only play in evenings? Do you prefer Sci fi or fantasy? Do you like the diplomatic element, or do you prefer to knuckle down to your mechanics and balancing the bits?

No matter how good TI3 is it doesn't matter if you never get to play it. AGoT gets played in an evening and drives more quickly to a conclusion. But if time is not an issue then TI3 has the better balance, the greater level of replayability, and more diplomacy involved. So it really just depends.

I'm playing TI3 for the first time tommorrow but the drama of getting it to the table and getting a whole day out to play means I will be unlikely to ever get to play again. If I have a bad experience, then that is likely to seal it. Still if I thought I could play it more then I am sure I would push through no matter what because it is somethign of an epic.

On this basis if I was going to recommend a game to buy it would always be AGoT. Besides there isn't a New York Times best selling book series based on TI3 is there. A Game of Thrones is a wonderful literary series.
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David
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As I own TI3 and the expansion (and I've played with and without), I feel qualified to say that if you buy TI3, you should get the expansion. It fixes a bunch of stuff and is worth it for that alone.

Unfortunately I only get to play about once a year as it takes two months to organise a game, but we've got a game tomorrow and it should be EPIC (in a good way).
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Diz Hooper
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Get TI. It does take a long time to play (I usually play with 5 or 6 and it takes about 8 hours with breaks) and it will take a long time to organize all of the people to play, but it is an amazing experience. I can tell you about the games I played three years ago and what happened in them. You can't really say that about many games. TI is a super experience.
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meowsqueak wrote:
As I own TI3 and the expansion (and I've played with and without), I feel qualified to say that if you buy TI3, you should get the expansion. It fixes a bunch of stuff and is worth it for that alone.


The most important fix SE introduces is actually free (Downloadable from FFGs site), using the Imperial II strategy card instead of Imperial improves the game greatly, all other parts of SE are definitely worth it but IMO not strictly necessary (Imperial II is).
 
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Joe Steadman
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citylife wrote:

TI3 has the better balance, the greater level of replayability, and more diplomacy involved. So it really just depends.



What? Are you nuts? LOL... GoT is nothing but diplomacy... TI3 is just Axis and Allies in space mixed with Puerto Rico and incredibly long. In GoT you have to go out and use diplomacy to survive.. TI3 you can turtle and wait till two others are at war and sweep in and win. TI2 was better.

I use to rate TI3 higher but then I was removed from the group I played it with and realized most of why I liked it was them and not the game. I think it is too long and would never pick it know if I had a choice.
 
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Kåre moll Christiansen
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JoeSteadman wrote:
TI3 is P Rico in Space... Go for GoT, a much better and more evil game.




aaahhhhh come on please.

If youre going to take part in the debate, the least you could do is to give us some insight to your outrageous postulations.

TI3 uses the roleselection mechanism from Puerto Rico, but as far as I'm concerned thats it.
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It is hard to add anything to what you have read here already without knowing your circumstances. I love AGOT and enjoy TI3 and have played both this year more than once. You really have to look at your available player numbers and time. For me Vanilla AGOT is ok with 4 and shines with 5. TI3 on the other hand plays 4-6 handily but the expansion becomes necessary after the first few games or it will turn into a giant game of epic Space Turtle.
 
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Twilight Imperium with Shattered Empires is the best 4x game on the market Period.

It is a classic, Space empire game that plays well with 3 to 8 people.

A Game of Thrones is a horrible knock off of diplomacy that doent quite work as a game.

TI3 all the way with no questions asked.

-M
 
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