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Manoeuvre» Forums » Rules

Subject: Bombard/Volley and Withdraw rss

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Matt Drown
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Played my 4th game last night and realized that there was one questionable item. Can you withdraw from a bombard/volley?

The rules seem to say no cards can be played in defense, but the description of the card says playable during any "combat", and "bombard/volley" is listed as a combat. Is this another thing that should have said "assault/ambush"?

The FAQ seems to imply that you can't play the withdraw, rule #13 in the post here on bgg. But it's not explicit.

We started the game playing that you couldn't, but started questioning our choice near the end.
 
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David desJardins
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No, you can't withdraw from bombard or volley. This seemed very clear to me, although I don't have the rules in front of me.
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Was George Orwell an Optimist?
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I agree with David - look at your Manoeuvre Reference Card. There are separate sections for Bombardment or Volley and Assault or Ambush, detailing the explicit sequence of events for each procedure. Assault or Ambush includes withdrawals in step 2. The Bombardment or Volley section doesn't have withdrawal.
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Kent Reuber
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If you look at the rules section 6.1 (Assault/Ambush) vs. 6.2 (Bombard/Volley), you'll find that Withdraw isn't mentioned in the latter.

Section 6.1 wrote:
Step 4: If the defending unit did not Withdraw in step 3, the defender may now play Unit Cards matching the defending unit to increase the Defense Total. The defender may also play one Leader Card and use its Combat value to increase the Defense Total."


In 6.2, you go straight to die rolling.
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Matt Drown
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Yea, it's how we played it. But 9.2 (Other HQ Cards):

"Withdraw
These cards allow the defending unit to voluntarily Retreat before a combat is resolved. It is played as the defender's only card. The defending unit retreats and the attacker advances possibly executing pursuit. The combat is completed and the unit card used to initiate the attack is discarded."

The use of the word "combat" which is "ambush/assault/bombard/volley" in other sections of the manual. This was causing my confusion. We played it that you couldn't withdraw because that seemed to be the point of the bombard/volley.
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David desJardins
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The Withdraw card would let you withdraw from a Bombardment if you played it.

Unfortunately, you don't have any opportunity to play it.
 
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Matt Drown
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DaviddesJ wrote:
The Withdraw card would let you withdraw from a Bombardment if you played it.

Unfortunately, you don't have any opportunity to play it.


If you have played other games where cards take precedence over rules in the manual (which is common many games), than these cards aren't always clear.

In the end we made the judgement call that matched the intent of the rules and still had fun. I love the game so far in my handful of plays, so no worries.



 
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Kelly K
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Great game, but this is an example of why the rules need much more clarity. My girlfriend tried to play the Withdraw card like this, too, and was quite disappointed when I had to correct her because the literal reading isn't very helpful. But this is the least of the ambiguities in the rules. A rules revision or a FAQ would be great. For example, we were confused about when exactly the Withdraw must be played and when exactly the dice get rolled. When the dice get rolled for each card isn't mentioned clearly. So we had it all jumbled up.
Thankfully, playing on Wargameroom helped me figure some of this out, although WGR's system has it so that ties go to the attacker (excuse me, the assaulter/ambusher--let's be precise!).
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Tanks Alot
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I think "Faint" would be a better word so its known its for the attack and not defence.
Your humble opponent
 
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