Matthew Chua
Singapore
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Will be making an order soon and due to some reasons (which I do not wish to elaborate here because it detracts from the point), I need to choose 1 of the above to exclude from the order.

I have been eye-balling these games for some time because they are solid Euros that play around an hour. I usually game with 3-4 and I enjoy interaction or conflict in my games. In other words, games with more subtle interaction like RftG aren't my cup of tea. Please feel free to look at the games I currently own to see what I like and whether any of my owned games play similarly to what I'm ordering and thus can be eliminated.

Would appreciate your opinions (even subjective ones!) on the matter so that I can complete my order. And while I understand some of you will just ask to me to get all 3, for the moment, that would not be possible.
 
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BibKamp318
Belgium
Beerse [near Turnhout]
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Whatever you do, do NOT eleminate In the Year of the Dragon. It meets all of your criteria.
soojin wrote:
I have been eye-balling these games for some time because they are solid Euros that play around an hour.

Check
soojin wrote:
I usually game with 3-4

Check - the game scales extremely well from 2 to 5 players - which I have not seen that much before. Even more interesting is that the strategies to win are dfifferent dependng on the number of players, though there is no solid "guaranteed to win" strategy.
soojin wrote:
I enjoy interaction or conflict in my games

Double / triple check. There are multiple disasters you will need to manage.

You can always try it out on www.mabiweb.com
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Sean Carrick
United States
Beaverton
Oregon
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Well, what do you like?

Chicago Express is an awesome economic engine game.

Year of the Dragon is an okay brutal decision making game.

I have not played Endeavor, though I'd much rather play an unknown than Year of the Dragon.
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Andrew Glassop
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Dubbo
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I have only played one of your list, Year of the Dragon, and I would recommend that very highly.

As mentioned above, it is real solid in Euro terms, plays in about an hour (maybe a bit longer) and the fight for turn order (to get what you want form limited supplies) can be quite fierce.

My only reservation would be that the conflict is indirect, you can't harm another person, only make it more difficult for them to do what they want. That may not be 'conflict' enough for you, but its about as 'conflicty' as Euros get I suppose.

By the way, I used to live in Singapore and would give my eye-teeth for a prata with curry sauce right now. How's the weather - hot?
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The Honorable Mayor McCheese
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Windermere
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I have only played Chicago Express, but if you like economic games that involve very direct conflict, this meets your criteria.
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Stephen Stewart
United States
Visalia
California
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figarojones wrote:
Well, what do you like?

Chicago Express is an awesome economic engine game.

Year of the Dragon is an okay brutal decision making game.

I have not played Endeavor, though I'd much rather play an unknown than Year of the Dragon.



Easy...CE and End..

If you don't like Endeavor, it's new and you can fetch top dollar for a trade....Hmm, maybe trade for YotD and another game...
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Catherine Short
United Kingdom
Bristol
Bristol
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Endeavor is a new and exciting game, you should definitely get that one.
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Matthew Chua
Singapore
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abeniman wrote:
I have only played one of your list, Year of the Dragon, and I would recommend that very highly.

As mentioned above, it is real solid in Euro terms, plays in about an hour (maybe a bit longer) and the fight for turn order (to get what you want form limited supplies) can be quite fierce.

My only reservation would be that the conflict is indirect, you can't harm another person, only make it more difficult for them to do what they want. That may not be 'conflict' enough for you, but its about as 'conflicty' as Euros get I suppose.

By the way, I used to live in Singapore and would give my eye-teeth for a prata with curry sauce right now. How's the weather - hot?


I have that same concern regarding the interaction level after watching the video review. It seems the main interaction comes from the competition for turn order. After that, it seems like a self-development of a mitigation strategy for the disasters to come.

Haha, well, Singapore is ALWAYS hot! But been somewhat rainy these past few days so weather a little cooler. And yes! Prata ruxs though terribly unhealthy :(
 
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Matthew Chua
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ASLChampion wrote:

Easy...CE and End..

If you don't like Endeavor, it's new and you can fetch top dollar for a trade....Hmm, maybe trade for YotD and another game...


Haha, I have to agree with your assessment that Endeavor will be an easy game to trade away given the current hype, especially since it's at a reasonably attractive price point.

Anyone with the games can give me an idea of the relative box size? I presume its CE > End > YotD? I'm asking friends to carry them back so just wanna have an idea. Is the CE box much bigger than the Endeavor box or are they rather close?
 
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Martin G
United Kingdom
Bristol
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soojin wrote:
Anyone with the games can give me an idea of the relative box size? I presume its CE > End > YotD? I'm asking friends to carry them back so just wanna have an idea. Is the CE box much bigger than the Endeavor box or are they rather close?


YotD is a standard Alea size box, Chicago Express is much taller (lots of air!) and Endeavor is squarer.
 
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Mark Slater
United Kingdom
Newport
Newport, South Wales
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Ive played all 3 (Endevour only once)
YotD and CE play quicker than Endevour.

I would cut Endevour, there is less conflict in it than the other 2, the conlfict will occur nearer the end when all the fortresses are built.

Its also the most expensive and heaviest.
 
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Bruce Murphy
Australia
Pyrmont
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qwertymartin wrote:
soojin wrote:
Anyone with the games can give me an idea of the relative box size? I presume its CE > End > YotD? I'm asking friends to carry them back so just wanna have an idea. Is the CE box much bigger than the Endeavor box or are they rather close?


YotD is a standard Alea size box, Chicago Express is much taller (lots of air!) and Endeavor is squarer.


CE is the standard medium quuen box as per Timbuktu, Thebes, Eketorp. It is taller and deeper then the others. Endeavor is the standard Kosmos/Ravensburger square big box, as per Ubongo, Diamonds Club, etc etc.


B>
 
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Jonathan Morton
Sweden
Vällingby
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I've played all 3. The one I would eliminate is Endeavor.

1) ItYotD and Chicago Express have shown themselves to have some degree of staying power, while Endeavor is still benefitting from being a hot new game - will it hold up?

2) Endeavor is the least thematic of the 3

3) Endeavor is the least original of the 3

For the record, I rate them as follows (1 play each):

In the Year of the Dragon 7.5
Chicago Express 6
Endeavor 6

Despite the last 2 having the same rating, Chicago Express is a design I respect much more.
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Mitch Willis
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Kathleen
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Tough decision...I've played all 3 and really enjoyed each of 'em. I'd definitely keep Chicago Express since it plays best with 3 or 4 and it's a rarity: it's a game with very simple rules but very deep game play. Looking at the games you own and have rated, I'd probably keep Endeavor as well...

Bottom line though, they're all good games so you can't go wrong no matter which 2 you choose...
 
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Jamey Philipp
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Muskego
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I would drop Year and keep Endeavor and Chicago Express, though there is the least amount of conflict in Chicago Express so you may want Year and Endeavor and drop the train economic one.
 
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Bruce Murphy
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Superhawk2300 wrote:
I would drop Year and keep Endeavor and Chicago Express, though there is the least amount of conflict in Chicago Express so you may want Year and Endeavor and drop the train economic one.


Least amount of conflict? YOu mean apart from deliberate railway sabotage by cube-wasting or blocking?

B>
 
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Steve Duff
Canada
Ottawa
Ontario
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Kill Chicago, Endeavour and Dragon are both excellent.
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Matthew Chua
Singapore
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I tried YotD against AI which gave me a good indication of the flow of the game. I like that the actions are simple (basically 2 phases) so it will be easy to intro to others. However, I'm not sure I was particularly intrigued by the level of the interaction. The interaction basically comes in the jostling for actions and people, but somehow felt rather indirect, and most of the game I was planning largely with regards to the timing of the events. It's a solid Euro no doubt but I'm not sure it's something I need to own.

I think I'm definitely going with CE at the moment. The price and box are the most unattractive of the lot but I suspect it will be a game I will actually keep.

Endeavor is still largely a mystery to me - too bad no AI to try against. I've read the reviews and have gotten an idea of the flow, yet I guess it's one of those where you got to try it for yourself. Honestly, I am concerned somewhat about the interaction (or lack of) level, as it seemingly only kicks into action in the late game.

Perhaps I should be looking for something else?
 
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Mitch Willis
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Kathleen
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I saw that you own Age of Empires III (one of my favorites!) and rate it highly. To give you a point of reference, having played Endeavor once with 4 players, I'd say that it has about the same level of interactivity/conflict as AOE3. Depending on your group, you'll probably have a little direct conflict over cities (to control either connections or card draws)...you'll probably have more indirect conflict over trade tokens, shipping lanes, and perhaps buildings (it's possible to be locked out of the better buildings)...
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Pedro
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Superhawk2300 wrote:
(...) though there is the least amount of conflict in Chicago Express so you may want Year and Endeavor and drop the train economic one.


Least amount of conflict? Wow! I never played Endeavor, but to have more conflict than CE, it must be spilling conflict from the sides of the box!

CE is a mean, mean game, where, among other things, it's normal to destroy your neighbor's company (by forcing it to spend its cubes or money in senseless routes), while looking him in the eye. More direct conflict than that and you'll be shoving your cubes up his... nose!
 
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Dave Eisen
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Menlo Park
CA
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These are all fine games. All meet your requirements and you should be appropriately sad that you cannot get them all.

That said, Year of the Dragon does not scale down as well as the second poster here said and would thus be the one I would drop. With fewer than the maximum of 5 players there is more and more unfortunate luck injected into the game based on which actions get tied together in the random draw each turn. It does not make the game unplayable, but it makes it less brilliant than it deserves to be.

The others scale just fine to 3 or 4, although I have not played enough Endeavor to be certain here.

I note that without that requirement I flat out would not reject In the Year of the Dragon. It is such a fine and clean game as well as richly interactive.
 
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Emily H.
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Chicago
Illinois
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Chicago Express and In the Year of the Dragon are both really good! I haven't played Endeavor, but the comments from the posters above about it being the least original seem like something to consider when compared with the other two, which are both much more original than a lot of the standard eurogames that are popular today.
 
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William Springer
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Brooklyn
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I've not played Endeavor, I'm a fan of Chicago Express (rate it a 9, I believe) and I think Year of the Dragon is just so-so...but a number of my friends like it.

That that for what it's worth..
 
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Scott Halvorson
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Lake Geneva
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Drop Chicago Express from your order and go with the other two. While people say that Chicago Express is a good economic game, there seemed to be only one path to victory when I played it the last couple of times - buy shares of the green train, and drive the green train to Chicago first before anything else. Put up shares of trains for auction, just to not win them, and make train routes you have a vested interest in longer, despite the fact that somebody else has more shares of it than you do. Not a good path to victory, but usually it is the only one available to you, unless you happen to be the lucky one with the most shares in the advancing line. Then you let others drive you to victory.

Definitely a game to hold off buying. The other two are much more fun, even though I haven't played Endeavor before. But it can't be much less fun than Chicago Express, in my opinion.
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Jamey Philipp
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Muskego
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Every move in Endeavor is taking something someone else wants. It is impossible to not do a dick move. CE can be cut-throat, but it doesn;t have to be.

Every move in Endeavor is a dick-move, like it or not.
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