Recommend
1 
 Thumb up
 Hide
12 Posts

Notre Dame» Forums » General

Subject: Is the plague powerful enough? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Raber Jr.
United States
Warsaw
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
We can stay inside and play games, I don't know...
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I've played notre dame 7 times and it seems to me that the plague doesn't punish a player enough if they choose to ignore the 'rat attack' and let their harbor area get beyond the 9 space. The last couple games i've basically ignored the plague and paid the 2 prestige points and moved an influence marker to the general supply and i still ended up winning (61 points one time). Anyhow, it almost seems as the game is 'broken' but i can't imagine that this facet of the game was overlooked during playtesting. what am i missing???? Or is the plague not intended to punish a player that much?? any thoughts?

raberjr
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Daniel Corban
Canada
Newmarket
Ontario
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I agree with you for the most part. However, maybe the designer intended for this to be a valid tactic. I don't find that either ignoring or not ignoring the plague to be overpowered. Both strategies require you to focus on certain actions.

If the only way to win was to completely avoid the plague, then the hospital cards would never get passed around. They are already very strong.

I do think the game is a tad too balanced, but that opinion may change with more plays. I have only played maybe 10 times.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Destroyer of Islands
Canada
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
You are removing that influence cube from your board, right? And taking it from the area that has the most cubes? After over 500 games on BSW, I have seen people win while ignoring the plague, but it is very rare, and usually only when the other players are playing badly.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ralph Bruhn
Germany
flag msg tools
publisher
mbmbmbmbmb
raberjr wrote:
I've played notre dame 7 times and it seems to me that the plague doesn't punish a player enough if they choose to ignore the 'rat attack' and let their harbor area get beyond the 9 space. The last couple games i've basically ignored the plague and paid the 2 prestige points and moved an influence marker to the general supply and i still ended up winning (61 points one time). Anyhow, it almost seems as the game is 'broken' but i can't imagine that this facet of the game was overlooked during playtesting. what am i missing???? Or is the plague not intended to punish a player that much?? any thoughts?

raberjr
I agree with queenc:
It's possible, but rare to win using this strategy. The game is clearly NOT broken!
You're missing the point, that maybe your opponents are not experienced enough in this game ...
Because 61 points is good, yes, but not very good. With some luck it's possible to gain more than 80 points.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Raber Jr.
United States
Warsaw
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
We can stay inside and play games, I don't know...
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
ahhh...i hadn't considered the 'opponents' variable to this equation. In one game it probably had a bearing on the outcome, the other game i'm not sure it mattered.

However, as i think about this more, this 'might' be the reason while i won: The two games that i'm referring to had ABSOLUTELY HORRIBLE plague values. For instance, the average plague value was around 6-8 in both games. So i reasoned to myself, "hey, i'll just ignore the plague and focus on prestige points instead of focusing all my efforts on killing rats and playing the hospital card". Each round I paid the penalty in the end but i was still netting prestige points (7-8) while others were only fighting the rats and gaining not as many prestige points.

So, maybe this strategy only works with extreme plague values and when others spend their efforts destroying rats. I don't think it would work in lower plague value games when people wouldn't have to use many influence markers to stomp out the rats.

thanks for the feedback,
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Raber Jr.
United States
Warsaw
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
We can stay inside and play games, I don't know...
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
yes, i am removing the influence marker in the sector with the most cubes. that is painful!!!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Adam Smiles
United States
Dedham
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
admin
The ratio of people to cake is too big.
badge
Excuse me, I believe you have my stapler...
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
raberjr wrote:
ahhh...i hadn't considered the 'opponents' variable to this equation. In one game it probably had a bearing on the outcome, the other game i'm not sure it mattered.

However, as i think about this more, this 'might' be the reason while i won: The two games that i'm referring to had ABSOLUTELY HORRIBLE plague values. For instance, the average plague value was around 6-8 in both games. So i reasoned to myself, "hey, i'll just ignore the plague and focus on prestige points instead of focusing all my efforts on killing rats and playing the hospital card". Each round I paid the penalty in the end but i was still netting prestige points (7-8) while others were only fighting the rats and gaining not as many prestige points.

So, maybe this strategy only works with extreme plague values and when others spend their efforts destroying rats. I don't think it would work in lower plague value games when people wouldn't have to use many influence markers to stomp out the rats.

thanks for the feedback,


Sounds like you are doing something wrong. The average plague values should never be that high. they may get that high for a single turn, but not over the course of the game.

The 6 brown person cards have 7 total rats on them (0,0,1,1,2,3) which should give you an average of 2.33333 rats per round. The 9 grey person cards also average just under 2 rats per round (A=1,2,2 B=1,2,3 C=1,2,2). So your game average should always be about 4 rats per round. The most you can get in a single round is 8, but then you must by definition have much smaller plagues in the other 2 rounds between scorings.

It is certainly possible to win while getting hit by a plague or two, but completely ignoring rats and getting a plague almost every turn is very rarely a winning strategy.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jay Sachs
United States
Woodinville
Washington
flag msg tools
badge
Despite your hope, there is not even any inherent symbolism; gravity is simply a coincidence.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
asmiles wrote:
raberjr wrote:
However, as i think about this more, this 'might' be the reason while i won: The two games that i'm referring to had ABSOLUTELY HORRIBLE plague values. For instance, the average plague value was around 6-8 in both games.


Sounds like you are doing something wrong. The average plague values should never be that high. they may get that high for a single turn, but not over the course of the game.


I interpreted that to mean the "accumulated rat value per player" was 6-8, not that the "base rats to incur" was 6-8. But now I'm not so sure ...
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Dave Martin
Canada
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
If you get a plague penalty early in the game, it can be very costly (that extra cube lost from the highest pile could easily cost you 3-5 or more points over the game)- and then you're still at 9, and it could happen again. However, at the end of the game, it may be a profitable choice to ignore the rats.

Also, I echo 2 above points: 61 won't win the game in many groups; and there will always be the same number of rats over the course of the game: 37 - whether they come in bunches, and if you're ready for them, is the difference.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Raber Jr.
United States
Warsaw
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
We can stay inside and play games, I don't know...
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
asmiles wrote:
raberjr wrote:
ahhh...i hadn't considered the 'opponents' variable to this equation. In one game it probably had a bearing on the outcome, the other game i'm not sure it mattered.

However, as i think about this more, this 'might' be the reason while i won: The two games that i'm referring to had ABSOLUTELY HORRIBLE plague values. For instance, the average plague value was around 6-8 in both games. So i reasoned to myself, "hey, i'll just ignore the plague and focus on prestige points instead of focusing all my efforts on killing rats and playing the hospital card". Each round I paid the penalty in the end but i was still netting prestige points (7-8) while others were only fighting the rats and gaining not as many prestige points.

So, maybe this strategy only works with extreme plague values and when others spend their efforts destroying rats. I don't think it would work in lower plague value games when people wouldn't have to use many influence markers to stomp out the rats.

thanks for the feedback,


Sounds like you are doing something wrong. The average plague values should never be that high. they may get that high for a single turn, but not over the course of the game.

The 6 brown person cards have 7 total rats on them (0,0,1,1,2,3) which should give you an average of 2.33333 rats per round. The 9 grey person cards also average just under 2 rats per round (A=1,2,2 B=1,2,3 C=1,2,2). So your game average should always be about 4 rats per round. The most you can get in a single round is 8, but then you must by definition have much smaller plagues in the other 2 rounds between scorings.

It is certainly possible to win while getting hit by a plague or two, but completely ignoring rats and getting a plague almost every turn is very rarely a winning strategy.


This is how i'm handling the brown cards. At the beginning of each 3 round period, i'm shuffling the brown cards and then turning two over. in the latest game i'm referring to, the same brown cards were turned up in two of the periods and the plague value was 5 on the two brown cards alone. On the other period the brown card value was more 'normal' but not low.

So, i need to clarify,...should i be reshuffling in the same brown cards that were used in a previous period or do i remove them from the game after they have been used? I have not been removing them and therefore, when high value plague cards (brown ones) were turned up two periods in a row, those did cause the whole game (or at least a large portion of the game) to have a high overall plague value.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Martin G
United Kingdom
Bristol
flag msg tools
badge
Don't fall in love with me yet, we only recently met
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
raberjr wrote:

So, i need to clarify,...should i be reshuffling in the same brown cards that were used in a previous period or do i remove them from the game after they have been used? I have not been removing them and therefore, when high value plague cards (brown ones) were turned up two periods in a row, those did cause the whole game (or at least a large portion of the game) to have a high overall plague value.


You should be using all six brown cards exactly once during each period. You shuffle at the start of the period and flip the top two. At the end of the round you discard those and flip the next two. You do the same at the start of the third round. Then before the next period starts, reshuffle all six and repeat.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Raber Jr.
United States
Warsaw
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
We can stay inside and play games, I don't know...
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
ahhhhhh! looks like i need to review the rules again...
blush

thanks for the input!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.