Recommend
1 
 Thumb up
 Hide
17 Posts

Chaos in the Old World» Forums » Rules

Subject: Franz's Decree as the last card of the game ? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Joel Schuster
Germany
Bretten
Baden-Württemberg
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Theoretical Question:
What if Franz's Decree is drawn as the very last card of the Old World deck so there is no more card to be drawn in addition ?

Logically, it seems you just dont play another card but you still play the actual turn, since checking for end of the game conditions occurs during the last phase of each turn. But when you draw a new Old World card a new turn has just started so it is still played.

Anyways, the cards text doesnt mention this occasion. Any clarification on this or some entry I am missing ?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Michael Jordal
United States
Austin
Minnesota
flag msg tools
badge
Ike Clanton painted by me for Wild West Exodus
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I agree. I would imagine you attempt to fulfill the request of the card, realize you can't and continue on your merry way
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
DONALD McLeod
United States
Gastonia
NC
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmb
I agree. Much as you can't fulfill the requirements for placing warpstones, heroes, etc, sometimes, if you can't flip a card you still play a turn out. Of course, this might result in not having a card to flip on the beginning of the next turn and thus an Old World win...
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
brian
United States
Cedar Lake
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mb
Good question. I forwarded it to FFG for response:

Quote:
As with any other game effect that requires components no longer available
(such as an effect to place a noble token when there are no more noble
tokens to be placed), the players fulfill as much of the effect as they
can and proceed. If no other victory condition is triggered before the
event deck evaluation at the end of the current round, the game will end
and the Old World will have won.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rich P
United Kingdom
Sheffield
United Kingdom
flag msg tools
I didn't know what to do with my UberBadge, so I left it as a GeekBadge.
badge
Planning...
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Who the chuff is Franz, anyway? shake
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joel Schuster
Germany
Bretten
Baden-Württemberg
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
You dont know Fritz's brother ? shake
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
brian
United States
Cedar Lake
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mb
Umbratus wrote:
You dont know Fritz's brother ? shake

You mean Hanz's brother?

2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
brian
United States
Cedar Lake
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mb
woodnoggin wrote:
Who the chuff is Franz, anyway? shake


Quote:
The Emperor Karl Franz is said to be the greatest statesman in the Old World. He is acclaimed as a patron of the arts and science, as a military innovator, and a valiant warrior. Thanks to his efforts, the Empire has flourished during his reign . The Imperial Engineers' School has grown, the colleges of magic have thrived, and the army has marched from victory to victory.


http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?...#
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joel Schuster
Germany
Bretten
Baden-Württemberg
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Ah, thx for that clarification.

I am not into the Warhammer World at all actually. I always thought thats the weird thing with orcs operating tanks and laser guns which is pretty unappealing to me.

I now realize that this is the Warhammer 40k thing only, so that 40k is actually quite an important addition.

Not sure if I'll ever look deeper into the classic Warhammer world.
But this game is certainly very appealing to me as it is - mechanics/gameplay and theme/setting alike
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
brian
United States
Cedar Lake
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mb
Ditto. I know nothing about it. Just what I have googled to get a better understanding of the theme.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rich P
United Kingdom
Sheffield
United Kingdom
flag msg tools
I didn't know what to do with my UberBadge, so I left it as a GeekBadge.
badge
Planning...
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
ColtsFan76 wrote:
woodnoggin wrote:
Who the chuff is Franz, anyway? shake


Quote:
The Emperor Karl Franz is said to be the greatest statesman in the Old World. He is acclaimed as a patron of the arts and science, as a military innovator, and a valiant warrior. Thanks to his efforts, the Empire has flourished during his reign . The Imperial Engineers' School has grown, the colleges of magic have thrived, and the army has marched from victory to victory.


http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?...#


I know who they're referring to on the card, my complaint is over the use of the name 'Franz'. The Emperor's full name is Karl-Franz I von Holswig-Schliestein. His first name is double-barrelled. 'Franz's Decree' makes no sense to me. 'Karl-Franz's Decree' would be better, or just 'The Emperor's Decree', although then you lose some of the flavour. Yes, I'm being picky and it doesn't matter one jot to how the game plays, but it's my right to get annoyed by things like this.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
brian
United States
Cedar Lake
Indiana
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mb
woodnoggin wrote:
I know who they're referring to on the card, my complaint is over the use of the name 'Franz'. The Emperor's full name is Karl-Franz I von Holswig-Schliestein. His first name is double-barrelled. 'Franz's Decree' makes no sense to me. 'Karl-Franz's Decree' would be better, or just 'The Emperor's Decree', although then you lose some of the flavour. Yes, I'm being picky and it doesn't matter one jot to how the game plays, but it's my right to get annoyed by things like this.

Sorry, didn't catch the sarcasm.

Like I said, I just google it. I see that "Karl Franz" usually goes together but I don't see it hyphenated, even on GW's product page. So maybe FFG thought using his "last" name was acceptable and fit better on the card anyway.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rich P
United Kingdom
Sheffield
United Kingdom
flag msg tools
I didn't know what to do with my UberBadge, so I left it as a GeekBadge.
badge
Planning...
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Maybe FFG should do more research. Even if it's not hyphenated, using Franz still doesn't make any sense. That would be like me calling this post "Andrew's Post". (Nobody calls me Andrew - it's my middle name.) The same mistake over the Emperor's name appeared in the rulebook for Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay (2nd edition), so Chaos in the Old World is in good company.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Simon Crowe
United Kingdom
Sheffield
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
woodnoggin wrote:
Maybe FFG should do more research. Even if it's not hyphenated, using Franz still doesn't make any sense. That would be like me calling this post "Andrew's Post". (Nobody calls me Andrew - it's my middle name.) The same mistake over the Emperor's name appeared in the rulebook for Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay (2nd edition), so Chaos in the Old World is in good company.


Sorry Andrew, sounds like you're using out of date information. FFG hold the rights to current Warhammer background, and the current Empire army book lists his first name as Karl, last name as Franz. No von Holswig-Schliestein anymore.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Drake Walker
United States
Colorado
flag msg tools
Well, Karl-Franz I von Holswig-Schliestein means Karl Franz the first from Holswig-Schliestein. It's like saying Rich P. from Sheffield.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rich P
United Kingdom
Sheffield
United Kingdom
flag msg tools
I didn't know what to do with my UberBadge, so I left it as a GeekBadge.
badge
Planning...
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
ConditionOfMan wrote:
Well, Karl-Franz I von Holswig-Schliestein means Karl Franz the first from Holswig-Schliestein. It's like saying Rich P. from Sheffield.


Well, kind of, if you translate it literally. In this case, von is used to indicate he's a noble and Holswig-Schliestein is his family name, although it might also be a place (in which case it's probably land owned by his family).

Scrowe wrote:
Sorry Andrew, sounds like you're using out of date information. FFG hold the rights to current Warhammer background, and the current Empire army book lists his first name as Karl, last name as Franz. No von Holswig-Schliestein anymore.


I don't believe it to be out of date information. Can you point me to a source that indicates there has been a change? It wouldn't surprise me if the latest Empire army book didn't bother to include his name in full. Are you seriously telling me the Emperor's surname is now officially Franz?

FFG don't hold the rights to the Warhammer background - that IP is still Games Workshop's. FFG have to get GW's approval over anything they publish involving Warhammer. Of course, I doubt GW would object if FFG wanted to officially drop the Holswig-Schliestein bit.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris K.
Germany
Berlin
Berlin
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
woodnoggin wrote:
ConditionOfMan wrote:
Well, Karl-Franz I von Holswig-Schliestein means Karl Franz the first from Holswig-Schliestein. It's like saying Rich P. from Sheffield.


Well, kind of, if you translate it literally. In this case, von is used to indicate he's a noble and Holswig-Schliestein is his family name, although it might also be a place (in which case it's probably land owned by his family).



Actually, no.

For the record I am basing this on actual conventions for real world nobles before the 20th century first. So if Warhammer actually has others laid down somewhere just disregard this.

The part after the "von" is in nearly all cases the name of a location. Usually it will be the name of the castle or lands of the noble family or sometimes even just the country they come from.

It is pretty much a short form of "The first by the name of Karl Franz of the noble family that hails from Holswig-Schliestein"

It is not actually the family name. It is merely the fact that it is often used in a similar way.

So it is entirely possible that Franz is the actual family name, allthough it is more likely that Karl Franz are both first names as we would be understanding them today. If it isn't hyphenated it is customary to use one as the "calling" name, omiting the other.

And for completenesses sake the reason why this is only true before the 20th century: Some time last century Nobility was abolished in germany. So the previous "titles" became regular families. So now actually the whole "von Holswig-Schliestein" would be the actual family name. If the Franz already was a family name then now "Franz von Holswig-Schliestein" would be the family name as an inseperable unit. The "Von" is not a seperate part anymore and apart from the historic connotations has lost all meaning.

That is one of the reasons why it is so "simple" these days to become nobility. Especially the name "Prinz von Sachsen Anhalt" is used for that, as that family adopted a few people for financial arrangements, therefore giving those people that family name.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.