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Space Hulk (third edition)» Forums » Variants

Subject: Home brewed rules for Termie vs. Traitor combat rss

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Jon Grey
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Looked at the Space Hulk bible, was generally unimpressed so I came up with my own rules.

General

First of all, the Traitor player goes through the same exact turn order that we know from the base rules: Command, Action, Mission Status Phase and all. To ensure balance, each of our squads' had identical load-outs.

Second, to resolve timing disputes it's really up to you. For instance, a Blood Angel termie with AC is overwatching a hallway, then a Traitor termie moves forward/diagonally and fires at the AC termie for 1 AP. This can be played in two ways: 1) Blood Angel gets to shoot first, or (2) Traitor shoots first. I'd say (2), only because the base game has no provide no precedent of interrupting a single action and move+fire is a single action. It's up to your group though!

Moving on. In our variant 3-way FFA (free for all), we couldn't allow Termies to be killing each other as easily as they would kill Genestealers, otherwise its a guaranteed win for the GS player (assuming they have unlimited spawns).

So to balance this, we made up a small set of rules that simulated Terminator armor (which is hear is tough stuff) by allowing a defensive roll during ranged combat situations.

Ranged Combat


1. The Attacker would roll 2D6 (or 3D6 for auto-cannon) as normal and calculate his "hits."

2. In defense, the Defender would then roll 3D6 and on rolls of 5 or 6, he earns a "miss."

3.
Compare the total number of "misses" from the total number of "hits." If the total number of "misses" is greater than or equal to the total number of "hits," then the result is a miss and the defender is allowed to turn and face his attacker at no cost to his APs (applied the same rule that is used in vanilla when a GS attacks a SM from his flanks),

4.
If the total number of "hits" is greater than the total number of "misses" the attack is a success and the target is killed.

5. For flamers, there are no defense rolls, instead a hit is calculated on a roll of 4 or higher (but still 2 or higher for Genestealers).

For example, let's say a Blood Angel with a storm bolter makes a ranged attack on the flank of a Chaos Terminator with an Auto-Cannon.

First, the Blood Angel character throws 2D6 and rolls a 5 and 6. He does not have a sustained fire bonus at this time, so he scores a single hit.

Second, the defender throws 3D6 and rolls a 6 and 5 and 2, which is two misses.

Third, compare the 2 misses from the 1 hit and we see the result of the attack is misses > hits, and therefore it's a miss. At this point, the targeted Chaos Termie w/ Auto-cannon may turn to face his attacker for free (if he were in overwatch this action would cancel that status) and spend an AP to immediately return fire.

The Chaos Terminator player decides to turn and face the attacking Blood Angel (0 AP) and return fire with his Auto-cannon, so he expends 1 AP, then rolls 3D6 as normal and gets a 5 and 4 and 6, which calculates as two hits.

Next the Blood Angel player throws 3D6 in defense, and rolls a 5 and 2 and 1, which is one miss.

Finally, compare the 2 hits and 1 miss and we find that misses < hits, which is a successful attack. The Blood Angel character is therefore hit/killed, and removed from play.

Note: Firing at a Terminator in overwatch does not trigger an overwatch shot, but a CP may be used to return fire in between actions (loses overwatch status however).

Defense


To add some tactical depth, I introduced smoke grenades that can be used to block line of sight. To keep track of the amount of smoke grenades, we simply used the PP track and grenade tokens I created here.



- Each squad starts with 2-3 smoke grenades (up to you).
- A smoke grenade can be deployed in an adjacent space at the cost of 1 AP and blocks LOS both ways. Smoke will remain in the selected space until the beginning of that same player's following turn.
- Smoke does not block movement.
- Use a force barrier or any counter/token to represent the smoke, flashbang, or what have you.

Probably experiment with this rule to allow the grenade to be thrown at x range instead of deployed strictly on an adjacent space.

The result of our first game ended in an overwhelming Genestealer victory (result of poor map improvisation, too many air ducts, too many blip reinforcements). Second game went very well, but the rival Terminators sealed each other's fate in an epic firefight.

All the players had a great time experimenting with new tactics. Here are a couple photos from the first game:






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しんぶん赤旗
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Have you read the traitor terminator rules from space hulk campaigns? They are excellent (except the Contract Revoked mission is flawed).
 
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John "Omega" Williams
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White Dwarf article on introducing Traitor Terminators to the game.

Wasnt there rules for them also in the Genestealer book? Or just the Campaigns collection?

http://spacehulk.barsoom.cc/mirrors/shc/Traitor.htm
 
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Jon Grey
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Omega2064 wrote:
White Dwarf article on introducing Traitor Terminators to the game.

Wasnt there rules for them also in the Genestealer book? Or just the Campaigns collection?

http://spacehulk.barsoom.cc/mirrors/shc/Traitor.htm


I must have, my smoke grenade is almost verbatim. So much for originality. shake
 
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Robert Witting
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Excellent post spartan! I have also been having fantasies about terminator vs terminator combat.

My solution is to simply introduce "the armour save". Roll to hit as usual. If the target is hit it still survives by rolling a two or higher.

 
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Jon Grey
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Robert W wrote:
Excellent post spartan! I have also been having fantasies about terminator vs terminator combat.

My solution is to simply introduce "the armour save". Roll to hit as usual. If the target is hit it still survives by rolling a two or higher.



Thanks!

Your variant is clean and simple. I looked to the Brood Lord's rules for inspiration and wanted each "hit" to be addressed directly.

I also have a band of Orks that I'm putting together which will use a similar armor save rule; except Orks will only roll 1D6 (instead of 3D6) on defense rolls; giving them 5APs; ability to side step; close assault penalties to those without melee weapons; the ability to call reinforcements (only costs 5AP, and can only be done by my 1 Nob).
 
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Jon Grey
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Here's my reference table. Haven't play tested Orks yet, but the idea is they can call reinforcement Boyz (up to 5) by way of their burna nob. Probably not true to the lore of WH40k, but I'll probably get into that when I pick up DoWII this weekend.



Now that I look at it, I might remove Orks' defense rolls and only give Nobz 1D6 or 2D6. The idea is I want them to be weak but swarm.
 
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Joe Zimmerman
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With your defense rolls of 5/6 for each hit, I see Termies dropping extremely quickly.

I would recommend using the 2+ armor save against every ranged wound for Termies, including flamer attacks.


Also, I would consider rules for Flamers and Meltas/Multi-Meltas.

Flamer: As Heavy flamer, only 3 tokens.
Melta: Range 12, 1d6, wounds on 5/6, no Save, no Sustained fire, no Overwatch.
Multi-Melta: Range 12, 2AP to fire, no move and fire, 2d6, wounds on 4/5/6, no Save, no Sustained, no Overwatch.
Plasma Gun: --
Plasma Cannon: --
 
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Jon Grey
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So essentially "X amount of hits vs. X defense dice rolled." 1 hit, 1 defense dice rolled. 2 hits, 2 defense dice rolled. Hit doesn't penetrate armor on a roll of 2+

What about for Orks? Roll of 3/4/5 or higher?
 
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Richard Wagoner
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bolter wrote:
Have you read the traitor terminator rules from space hulk campaigns? They are excellent (except the Contract Revoked mission is flawed).


I have not played this scenario, what is the flaw?

Thx...
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Joe Zimmerman
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SPARTAN VI wrote:
So essentially "X amount of hits vs. X defense dice rolled." 1 hit, 1 defense dice rolled. 2 hits, 2 defense dice rolled. Hit doesn't penetrate armor on a roll of 2+

What about for Orks? Roll of 3/4/5 or higher?


Yes. 1 armor save throw for each ranged hit. 3 hits = 3 saves or die.

Treat hand to hand the same.

Orks are tough. They are big and mean. I'd like to stay somewhat true to the feel of 40k, but we don't want to be filling the corridors with 30 Orks either (or do we?). Ok, I don't. I wouldn't want Orks to have more than 15 guys at the absolute most. Making them more mobile will help give them an advantage, so 5 AP seems like a good idea.

For an armor save, 4+ seems good. Gives them a 50/50. If they are going to get a D6-1 in melee, they need to have some good firepower to make up for it. Maybe they rely heavily on flamers (burnas) and heavy weapons.

Orks: 5AP, 4+ Armor Save, D6-1 in melee if armed.

 
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Jon Grey
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SushiJoe wrote:
SPARTAN VI wrote:
So essentially "X amount of hits vs. X defense dice rolled." 1 hit, 1 defense dice rolled. 2 hits, 2 defense dice rolled. Hit doesn't penetrate armor on a roll of 2+

What about for Orks? Roll of 3/4/5 or higher?


Yes. 1 armor save throw for each ranged hit. 3 hits = 3 saves or die.

Treat hand to hand the same.

Orks are tough. They are big and mean. I'd like to stay somewhat true to the feel of 40k, but we don't want to be filling the corridors with 30 Orks either (or do we?). Ok, I don't. I wouldn't want Orks to have more than 15 guys at the absolute most. Making them more mobile will help give them an advantage, so 5 AP seems like a good idea.

For an armor save, 4+ seems good. Gives them a 50/50. If they are going to get a D6-1 in melee, they need to have some good firepower to make up for it. Maybe they rely heavily on flamers (burnas) and heavy weapons.

Orks: 5AP, 4+ Armor Save, D6-1 in melee if armed.



Sounds good! I'll be adopting all of these recommendations.

Just picked up WH40K Dawn of War II last night and it kicks ass.
 
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