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Subject: annoying gate burst rule rss

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Fortune
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So what exactly is the point of the gate burst rule stating that if there is an elder sign on a location (it's sealed) but there's a red sign there, a new gate opens nonetheless? What's the point of spending 5 hard earned clue tokens to seal a gate at an unstable location if it can open up again?
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Mark Johnson
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It's simply to make the game harder. People find this necessary because certain gates have a greater frequency of appearing than others. Once this is discovered, if players focus on sealing those gates specifically, the game will become much easier. With the gate-bursting mythos cards players would need to re-think their strategy on which gates to seal first.

True Arkham fans are masochists, trust me on this one. goo
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The Grouch
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The point is to increase the challenge of the game and force players to change up their strategies.

Without Gate Bursts, most players seal the Big Four (Woods, Indy Square, Witch House and Univisited Isle, IIRC). But in addition to being the ones which OPEN most often, those will also be the ones which BURST most often. So your strategy changes.

Get first few seals which open less frequently and are therefore more likely to stay sealed, then seal a couple of the Big Four for Teh Win. Of course, this means you're going to face more Monster Surges and therefore a more quickly mounting Terror Level, if the monsters aren't dealt with. This in turn calls for more and/or better armed bruisers clearing paths through the monsters for the gate closers.
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Rauli Kettunen
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Fortune wrote:
So what exactly is the point of the gate burst rule stating that if there is an elder sign on a location (it's sealed) but there's a red sign there, a new gate opens nonetheless? What's the point of spending 5 hard earned clue tokens to seal a gate at an unstable location if it can open up again?


Because not every Mythos card will be a gate burst (not even against Atlach-Nacha ). For all other Mythos cards, your seal works like it should.

Personally, gate bursts are the greatest thing since base-AH, without them and their risk, the game loses much of the tension. Not to mention difficulty when you get multiple gate bursts.
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Eric Taylor
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Fortune wrote:
So what exactly is the point of the gate burst rule stating that if there is an elder sign on a location (it's sealed) but there's a red sign there, a new gate opens nonetheless? What's the point of spending 5 hard earned clue tokens to seal a gate at an unstable location if it can open up again?


I would also like to point out that when a sealed gate "bursts" you DO NOT put a doom token on the doom track. It sucks spending that much effort to seal a gate that bursts open, but it does stop monster surges for a while and prevents you from getting another doom token when it re-opens (rather than if you simply closed it).
 
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Fortune
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Eeeville wrote:
It's simply to make the game harder.


The game is challenging enough as it is. This rule only makes it longer and more frustrating, but not considerably harder.
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Jim Kiefer
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Fortune wrote:
So what exactly is the point of the gate burst rule stating that if there is an elder sign on a location (it's sealed) but there's a red sign there, a new gate opens nonetheless? What's the point of spending 5 hard earned clue tokens to seal a gate at an unstable location if it can open up again?


Yeah, its a rather inelegant way to make the game more difficult. We don't change our strategy because of them however and just take our lumps. It makes the game harder by making the game longer and without reference to any flavorable Old One.

Gate bursts have a secondary purpose of moving the fliers around a bit more.
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Wouter Dhondt
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Fortune wrote:
Eeeville wrote:
It's simply to make the game harder.


The game is challenging enough as it is. This rule only makes it longer and more frustrating, but not considerably harder.


It makes it more fun for me. With 4 gates sealed you can have an easy ride to the end without any tension at all. Bursts keep the tension level up. If you think that is frustrating then maybe this is not a game for you.

That said: if you don't like the bursts simply ignore them and treat them as regular. Not that hard is it?
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Nick Short
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Kwakkie wrote:
Fortune wrote:
Eeeville wrote:
It's simply to make the game harder.


The game is challenging enough as it is. This rule only makes it longer and more frustrating, but not considerably harder.


It makes it more fun for me. With 4 gates sealed you can have an easy ride to the end without any tension at all. Bursts keep the tension level up. If you think that is frustrating then maybe this is not a game for you.

That said: if you don't like the bursts simply ignore them and treat them as regular. Not that hard is it?
Or just don't buy the expansions that have them.
 
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Tristan Hall
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Kwakkie wrote:
That said: if you don't like the bursts simply ignore them and treat them as regular. Not that hard is it?


That's what we do and it works a treat.

With just the base plus one expansion I could see how they'd work, but once you've got all the expansions mixed in there's so many plates spinning that there are more than enough ways to lose already. Especially with Innsmouth. Gate Bursts just prolong the agony.

That said we usually play with just two to four investigators. With more players you might need more of a challenge . . .
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Tibs
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Quote:
Or just don't buy the expansions that have them.

That's a rough suggestion. Four of the six expansions, including all three board expansions, have gate bursts. The only two that don't are King in Yellow and Curse of the Dark Pharaoh, and one cannot subsist on those expansions alone.

Gate burst was a great idea. Do I seal the high-frequency gate because it will block more gate openings, or the low-frequency one because it has a lower chance of bursting?
 
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Brian Mc Cabe
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I felt the same way as you do the first one popped up, at a crucial time, of course, so I ignored it.

Now, I use it and have lost a few games in doing so.

It's a trade off. It is more difficult, but without the added difficulty
the game was getting too easy.

With the big-box expansions, I'm getting pounded regularly, but a lot of the games go right down to the wire, becoming more competitive and
thematic. I mean this is an ancient god you're dealing with here.
These are pretty horrific monsters, not of this world.

It does get irritating at the time the game is going on, because at
least some success is essential to having fun. When I get finished, I
realize I should have been having fun, because almost every game is
classic Arkham.

But all of that is as a result of playing almost exclusively solo. If
these were four-player games, rather than solo, I wouldn't think it was
irritating at all. It would be tons of fun, because everyone would be
sharing in the theme of the cultists actually thwarting your every move.

If you've sealed the gate, why wouldn't the AO's minions sneak in behind
you and begin casting spells of their own to reopen it?

I hate drawing the Blight cards in KinY, because The Dean has whipped me
more than once all by himself. But that's where the decision-making
comes in, especially late in the game, when another doomer isn't a very
good idea.

It's all a mindset. If you allow yourself to get frustrated and irritated, you will. If you go with the flow and try to look at the
theme of the game and what "the cultists" are trying to accomplish,
you'll see it actually adds to the experience.

I think part of the problem is that it's a "cooperative" game, but the
game isn't cooperating, at all.

Have fun. Arkham is custom-made for houserules, moreso than any other
game I've seen.

Brian
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Pasi Juhola
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Part of the enjoyment of the experience that is Arkham Horror, is the feeling inevitable defeat. I get upset and a bit disappointed, when we win too many times in a row, and it feel strangely good when the game then absolutely thrashes you.
We built a mini-campaign of four scenarios with added heralds and difficulty, ending with the final confrontation against Atlach-Nacha. Surviving investigators gain experience, and equipment to help them solve the threat of the great big spider.
And we still won all three scenarios last weekend, (losing only three invsestigators of our pool of 14, with six players) and I'm thinking of changing the last scenario even more difficult, but I think the bursts will take care of business. I hope.
But I think I'll still make the next campaign even more challenging, Find Gate spells will definitely be taken out
 
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Fortune
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apatheticexecutioner wrote:
With the big-box expansions, I'm getting pounded regularly, but a lot of the games go right down to the wire, becoming more competitive and
thematic. I mean this is an ancient god you're dealing with here.
These are pretty horrific monsters, not of this world.


This made me lol, but in a good way. I adore your enthusiasm! thumbsup

I see the other points as well. Thanks for the answers.
 
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Tor Sverre Lund
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Uhm.. what's a Gate Burst? Is it anywhere at all in the base game, or only with expansion(s)?
 
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brian
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Gawain wrote:
Uhm.. what's a Gate Burst? Is it anywhere at all in the base game, or only with expansion(s)?

Only in the Big Box expansion and Black Goat.

It looks like a regular Mythos card except the Gate Opening has a Red background. It always places a gate, even if there is a seal at that location. The difference is you do not place a Doom Token on the GOO.

In addition, all fliers move when these cards are drawn as if their symbol was drawn. Most, if not all, also provide two, instead of one, Clues on the board.
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