Jee Fu
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Ive run into this issue several times now and I seem to remember some sort of official rule on this somewhere but I cant seem to find it.

If you have multiple effects that are adding and subtracting Fight dice, is there a particular order in which you do that?

For example (prepare yourself for this one robot ) : Victor is fighting a Zombie with a Pitchfork (-1 dice to hero) in the same square as Becky. A Stench of Death Zombie is 1 square away (-1 dice to hero). "Stay Together" is in play (+1 dice to any hero in the same space as another hero). Victor has the Garden Shears and may or may not use them (+1 dice for his ability and possibly another +1 dice at some point during the fight if he uses the weapon). Yikes.

Do we just add up everything, and then if its less than 1, bump it to one? In this case, Victor would roll 2+1-1-1+1=2 dice before the applying the shears and 3 dice if he uses them. OR is it like adjusting a movement roll, where you do all the subtraction first, THEN do the addition? In this case, Victor would get 2-1-1=0 which bumps it back to 1 minimum, then gets the +1+1 = 3 dice before the shears and 4 dice afterward. To make things a little more fun, what if Victor is under the effect of TWO Stench of Death Zombies. Does that effect stack?

As a side-question/example, what if the a hero has -2 fight dice to their total (reducing it to the minimum of 1 and essentially "wasting" the full value of the negative) and then gains a dice via a hand-weapon mid-fight? Does the full value of the negative come back, keeping the total at 1 (3-2 = 1) or does the hero get the bonus die for the weapon (bring their total dice up to 2)?

Ha! Thanks to anyone who takes the time to comprehend this madness and Good luck

- Jee



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Rami Finkelshtein
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hmmm this is a weird one (particularly because it falls into the "billy movement question" category)

Personally how we have always played it is you take a net of all your dice (add them all up) so negatives carry over and can't be used in later positives if they don't get them >0 (wow thats confusing pretty much if you are at -2 dice and get +1 dice you still only roll 1 Die)

Not necessarily right but its how we have played it.
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Anders Kernel
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Lol, I know how I would play it, but it might not be right(!).

I agree with DaFink, take all your bonusses and subtractions, add them together and see what you have. If it ends below 1 die, the hero has 1 die. If he wants to use the garden shears, that would in my opinion not buy him an ekstra die, if he allready had less than 1 die (which were bumped up to 1 die...).

Cheerio,
A
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Jee Fu
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It seems odd tho that altering movement would follow a different order of operations than altering #s of fight dice. Perhaps theres an inherent difference between altering the values of dice vs the number of dice? It also seems clunky that dice added during the fight would retroactively be taken away due to existing effects.

I still want to know if Stench of Death can stack with itself ninja
 
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Roman F
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I think a fight is one whole segment, so if a Hero gets down to 0 dice, and then adds Garden Shears or Baseball Bat, he would be at a total of 1 die for the fight, he doesn't get an extra die.

On a somewhat related topic... I can't see why you ever wouldn't use the Garden Shears or Cleaver, but if you chose not to use it, could you roll a 6, then decide to use the Garden Shears to kill the zombie?
 
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Daniel V
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For almost all weapons you can decide after the dice are rolled to apply their Combat bonus if you want.
One of the reasons to wait the "natural" roll result is that if you kill/fend off a zombie without the combat bonus you can avoid a break test or zombie card that can make you lose the item.

I believe that you calculate the "natural" dice a heros can roll (all static bonuses) substract all the zombies maluses. Then if below 1 set the hero dice to 1. And from then on anything that would add dice afterwards will just add up to that 1 die.
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As to the stench of Death question, I don't see why the effects wouldn't stack. It just smells really bad now.
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Jee Fu
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Quote:
I believe that you calculate the "natural" dice a heros can roll (all static bonuses) substract all the zombies maluses. Then if below 1 set the hero dice to 1. And from then on anything that would add dice afterwards will just add up to that 1 die.


Yeah this is the route I eventually took. This sorta makes double-stench kinda moot if there are no passive +dice abilities for the heroes in play.
 
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Dave Leach
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Let me be sure I understand the consensus Inspector Jee and Morgolon have reached, 'cause I THINK I agree 100%.

I've always assumed that Heroes role their "base" (natural) dice before applying any additional combat bonuses via cards, etc. Regardless of negative modifiers, they never receive less than 1 die for this purpose.
These same negative mods then cease to be a factor once the base dice are rolled. In the case of static mods that would otherwise take the Hero below zero (stacked Stench of Death for instance), the Hero rolls his/her 1 precious die and is free to play cards off the result once the initial roll is made.

In other words, negative static modifiers do not carry over once a Hero throws their base "natural" dice, even if there are multiple negative mods in place prior to the first roll of the combat. Like Inspector Jee said in his original post, the value of the negative is "wasted".

Correct?
 
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Jee Fu
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Quote:
In other words, negative static modifiers do not carry over once a Hero throws their base "natural" dice, even if there are multiple negative mods in place prior to the first roll of the combat. Like Inspector Jee said in his original post, the value of the negative is "wasted".

Yeah, this is what Im goin with right now. The game doesnt explicitly differentiate between a "static" and an "activated" modifyer (would like an offcial ruling here..) but this seems to make everything work out without too much clunkyness.

- Jee
 
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Jason Hill
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Correct. It is intended that the Hero rolls their basic Fight Dice with any Automatic modifiers (minimum of 1 Fight Dice), and may then add additional dice with Optional card effects and abilities after the roll is made.

It is important to note that negative modifiers DO stack, but only really matter if the Hero has more than 2 Fight Dice through Automatic abilities or card effects. An 'Automatic' ability or card effect is one that is NOT Optional (usually does not have the phrase 'may add', etc).

For example in Survival of the Fittest, the Unique Item 'Doc Brody's Memoirs' says that "The Hero may roll an extra Fight Dice against Zombies." This is Optional, so may be added after the dice are rolled.

At the same time, in the Hero Pack 1, Victor's 'Rage' ability says, "Rolls an extra Fight Dice for each Hand Weapon he has.". This is Automatic because the Hero does not have the option to roll or not to roll the extra dice; they must roll the extra dice.

Hopefully that makes sense.

- Jason

Jason C. Hill
Flying Frog Productions



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Jee Fu
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Rad. Thanks Jason :-)
 
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Dave Leach
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This needs to be sticky or something. That's pretty huge. Great to finally have an official clarification, thanks Jason! cool
 
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