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Subject: Cycling through one's deck and its importance. Any thoughts? rss

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Richard Hutnik
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The thread on the value of the adventurer had me wondering about the importance of cycling through one's deck. I am of the belief that the more times you can cycle through the deck, the better chance you have of getting cards you acquire into play, and and improving. This is why a card like the Adventurer are useful, with the secondary benefit getting cards you acquired into play.

Anyone else want to comment on its importance? For example, how important is cycling through a deck next to additional buys or additional actions?
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Trevor Schadt
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docreason wrote:
The thread on the value of the adventurer had me wondering about the importance of cycling through one's deck. I am of the belief that the more times you can cycle through the deck, the better chance you have of getting cards you acquire into play, and and improving. This is why a card like the Adventurer are useful, with the secondary benefit getting cards you acquired into play.

Anyone else want to comment on its importance? For example, how important is cycling through a deck next to additional buys or additional actions?


As always seems to be the case with Dominion, there is no easy answer aside from "It depends." In this case, it depends on what's already in your discard pile versus what you have left in your draw pile (which, in turn, depend not only on what you've drawn in previous draws, but also the Kingdom cards available). While getting into circulation the cards you've just bought on recent turns is usually a good thing (unless they're Victory cards), will the cards you've discarded dilute or improve the quality of the rest of the deck? Are there special combinations (Moneylender/Copper, Baron/Estate, Treasure Map/Treasure Map, etc.) that either require, or would at least be greatly assisted by, an immediate reshuffle?
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Brandon Richards
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Deck cycling just to do it is not all that great. Just ask anyone who has seen Village, Village, Village, Smithy, Village, Smithy . . . buy Village. Yeah they were able to cycle their entire deck, but didn't improve it one bit.

However, ask the person who buys one Witch and cycles their deck every turn whereas the others players can't, and guess who will probably win.

What I am getting at is that deck cycling is great to get your good cards into play faster than your opponents can. That is why Chancellor is such a good card if you can consistently buy 5 and 6 cost cards. You will see your good cards quicker than your opponents.

As for Adventurer, again like hunting for treasure, you don't know definitevely how much of your deck it will cycle through. At times it will find treasures as your next two cards, and at other times it will cycle through a third of your deck. I wouldn't purchase Adventurer just because it cycles through cards.

What I have found to be the best deck cyclers are Chancellor, Laboratory, and Cellar (make sure you cycle all your Coppers away with Cellar).
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Andrew Hardin
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filovirus wrote:

What I am getting at is that deck cycling is great to get your good cards into play faster than your opponents can. That is why Chancellor is such a good card if you can consistently buy 5 and 6 cost cards. You will see your good cards quicker than your opponents.


filovirus has hit on the key benefit of deck cycling. In theory each time you buy an Action Card or a Treasure your deck should be improving in quality (if it isn't then you should consider not buying in the first place).

So as you buy cards you want them back in play, but they start in your discard. The sooner you can play them the better and deck cycling is a key part of that.

It can also be huge to cycle your deck after using up your main power in your deck (something the Chancellor does better than any other card and one reason the card is undervalued). When you have used up your 2-3 best cards it can be helpful to have cards that allow you to get back to your power quickly.

Quote:
What I have found to be the best deck cyclers are Chancellor, Laboratory, and Cellar (make sure you cycle all your Coppers away with Cellar).


Ah yes, the Cellar, another example of the key flaw in Dominion. A very useful card that costs 2. Too many of 2 cost cards are better than the 3 cost cards and make the 5/2 split unfair. I am also finding that I like the Warehouse as a better (but more expensive) version of the Cellar.

I include any +3 Card or +4 Card Action as a good deck cycling card. You get a double benefit since you not only cycle your deck you get to keep the cards you draw. This is why Smithy/Silver is probably the best non-Chapel, non-Garden, 4/3 opening in the Base 25.

Anything that has +Card helps cycle your deck and increase your average Coin per hand. Those effects are well worth acquiring.

- Lex
 
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Kirk Monsen
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For cycling, I like Scout, as it pulls useless cards from your next hand, and lets you organize the next few cards for any +card +actions you have (wishing well, spy, pearl diver, warehouse, etc).

-Munch "Scout with Great Hall is a very nice cycling machine" Wolf
 
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Keith S.
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Well, deck cycling to get to the meat of your deck is all well and good, but is there not also value in deck cycling to go on a shopping spree? A combo like Village x2, Market x2, Smithy x2, Cellar gives you 3 buys and a handful of treasure to spend.
 
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Roger Yelton
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Cycling is my most important thing in Game Play. I buy cards to lay out strategies, and not until i get past the pesky estate and copper can i truly grasp that sweet sweet Province, and possibly a Duchy. One thing that blows is The curse factor of cycling. Tears up everything in the time of need......tisk.....tisk.
 
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