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Subject: Short example of play rss

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Ralph T
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The game conceptually is a little tricky, but once you get the hang of it, it's one of the simplest games of its length. I'm going to give a short example of play to show the basic actions.

Let's say you're the first player. You put the orange marker where your meeple is currently on the turn track. You can do as many actions until you reach this turn track. Your turn can also not end where another player's meeple is.

You start with a woodcutter and hunter's lodge, let's place both in a forest hex. Now imagine next to this hex are empty plains and mountain hexes. Ok, what next? You want to produce victory points. So you need to build a victory point building and supply it with the required input resources. Let's try for an easy one, the Abbey. The Abbey will require stone to build, and supplied with cloth it produces two victory points.

You need wool to make cloth. You need wood to make a shepherd's hut to make wool. Looking at the woodcutter, you need food to make wood.

First, you put a worker on the hunter's lodge to get food. Advance your meeple 1 space on the time marker (producing a good is takes up actions equal to the distance from the further input good required to produce the good, but minimum 1 action--in food's case, no input, so just one action). Total actions: 1

Now to make wood. Move your meeple from the hunter's lodge to the woodcutter hut. Advance your meeple 1 time (here the input good is 0 distance away from our woodcutter hut, so we go with the minimum one time). Note that you removed the meeple from the hunter's lodge because you just consumed the food--removing a meeple always takes zero time. Total actions: 2

Ok, now make the shepherd's hut. Put the shepherd's hut tile on the plain hex and remove the meeple on wood since it's been used. Since the hex is right next to the wood resource, it costs zero time. Time to build is furthest distance from input resources - 1. Total actions: 2

Next, make the wool. Wool requires no input resources, so put a meeple on the shepherd's hut for one time (minimum time to produce good is one). Total actions: 3

Now make the weaver mill in the plains hex. We need wood to make the weaver hut. Place a meeple on the hunter's lodge again. 1 time. Move the meeple to the woodcutter. 1 time. Build the weaver's mill on the plains hex next to wood and remove the meeple on wood. 1 distance - 1 = Zero time. Total actions: 5

Make the cloth. Place a meeple on the weaver's hut, consuming your wool. Remove the shepherd's hut meeple. 1 time. (Distance 0, minimum 1). Total actions: 6

Ok, we need stone next to build the building.

So we need a stone hut first to make stone. Put a meeple on the hunter's lodge for food. 1 time. Move the meeple to wood. 1 time. Build the stone hut in the adjacent stone hex (remove the meeple on wood). Free.

Total actions: 8

Now to make stone. Again, food is required to make stone. Place the meeple on the hunter's lodge. 1 action. Move the meeple to the stone hut. 1 action.

Total actions: 10

You just moved your maximum number of actions. (Note you could have stopped earlier if you chose.) Now you lay down your meeples on the weaver's hut and stone hut. This will mean the meeples still have access to the resource but if you don't use it next turn they disappear.

Next turn you can build the Abbey with your stone, and then produce the victory points by consuming your wool and placing a meeple on the abbey (1 time).

That's basically all the mechanics to the game. Making resources, and building buildings, and moving the time marker forward. If you try to make a resource that requires two or more inputs, you just calculate time as the furthest resource away.
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David Short
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Very informative. Thank you very much. I don't know what it is about this game, but I have been having a hard time wrapping my head around it. Your summary gets me one step closer to getting this on the table for the first time.

One note... I think this statement:

ralpher wrote:
You need wool to make cloth. You need wood to make a shepherd's hut to make cloth. Looking at the woodcutter, you need food to make wood.

... should read "You need wood to make a shepherd's hut to make wool."

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Ralph T
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Made the change. Thanks for spotting it.
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Freddy Dekker
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Yeah thanks!

It surely nudged me towards the, want to buy, edge of the fence.

For some reason this is one of them games one wants to like.
Maybe it's the fun components.
 
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Joseph Arthur Ellis
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Thanks for the helpful example. I still haven't played this but am looking forward to it.

Question:
If the stone and plain tiles are next to each other, the next player could steal the Abbey from the first player, right? I know a strategy tip wasn't the point of this article but I'm trying to wrap my mind around how the game works myself. Would the below work for the second player, assuming the stone and plain tiles used in the first turn are next to each other as well as being next to the forest?

Produce food using player 1's hunting lodge. 1 total point.

Produce wood using that food plus player 1's wood cutter's hut. 2 total points.

Since player 1 is using the stone hut (s)he built, build your own stone hut in the same stone tile with theirs using your new wood. 2 total points.

Produce food again, and then produce stone with your new stone hut. 4 total points.

Build the Abbey with the stone on the last available spot on the stone hex. 4 total points.

Produce wool with player 1's unused shepherd's shed. 5 total points.

Produce food then wood again, then build your own Weaving Mill in the same plains hex. 7 total points.

Produce cloth with the wool. 8 total points.

Take your cloth to the Abbey, using either 1 or 2 points, depending on how far away it is. This is 9 or 10 points total. However, you can't go 10 moves because that's what the other person did and the time marker doesn't move for the first round of turns.

So if the first player doesn't put those buildings on opposite sides of his/her initial forest, all their work just helped player 2 steal the Abbey point.

Is that all accurate??

(edit: a couple annoying typos)
 
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Ralph T
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I would need to set up the game and see, but you are probably right... it is entirely possible, and a good strategy, for another player to use the all ready built buildings and finish the prestige building before the player who put the work into the buildings.

This why you may want to go slow and keep your goal open or you block other people from using your buildings by leaving a meeple there.
 
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J C Lawrence
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Nobody owns buildings. There are no his building and my building. Buildings mere are. The only question, ever, is whether you have a product marker on a building. Players own product markers and there may only ever be one on a building.

It is often valuable to drop a farm or hunting lodge in the central hex as a way of reducing transport costs.
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Joseph Arthur Ellis
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clearclaw wrote:
Nobody owns buildings. There are no his building and my building. Buildings mere are. The only question, ever, is whether you have a product marker on a building. Players own product markers and there may only ever be one on a building.

It is often valuable to drop a farm or hunting lodge in the central hex as a way of reducing transport costs.


I very much appreciate that fact; It's just faster to say "his building" when he just built it than to say "the building he built."
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Freddy Dekker
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Have been trying to learn the Eggert version of this game and the rule book got me no where.

It must be among the worst rulebooks I ever read.
To me there doesn't seem any logic in how they set this up, the thing is too small and the example of play (probably also because they are very small) only helped to confuse me even more.

Funny that cause all this time I had the idea this actually was quite a simple game, allthough fairly tricky to explain.

Luckely I speak German and therefore I was able to understand the video instructions on the Offensive site (it's the internetstore where I bought this). Suddenly it became (almost) all clear to me.

I was right, it is a simple game ones you 'get it'

Only thing they seemed to fail to menton was the minerals on the buildings board.
Silver and iron, if I'm not mistaken.
Now I understand it's use, for building the buildings on the other card.
But somehow, and maybe I just mist it, I can't find any explanation on how to get this.
Not in the video, not in the rule book....

It must be different from the other stuff cause it has special chits, rather than have a meeple on a tile indicate it's production.

So how do I get them, and how do I use them.

Please remember I have the Eggert rules, from the little I've read, the Z-man rules seem very complicated.
 
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J C Lawrence
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It takes wood to build a mine. When placing the mine select there minerals of any combination of white, gray and black and place them in an ordered stack atop the mine you built. The mine produced the minerals stacked on it in the order stacked. When the mine is exhausted (all minerals removed) it is removed from the board.
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Freddy Dekker
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It is clear to me you must play by the Z man rules.

According to the video review [or could this be wrong] you simply renew the minerals after they are gone.
I assume this portrays your meeple digging for the stuff and if it's all gone, a next player must dig for his own.


What I was refering to are not the minerals in the mine.
On the board that shows all the buildings you have four 2 sided chits.
one side showing iron, one side showing silver.

Now what how exactly do I use those?
 
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J C Lawrence
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sagitar wrote:
It is clear to me you must play by the Z man rules.


The Z-Man rules produce a significantly less interesting game. I recommend playing by the first edition rules.

Quote:
Now what how exactly do I use those?


They are an unnecessary Z-man addition. I recommend not using them.
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Freddy Dekker
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Really?
cause I'm sure I have the Eggert edition.

It says so, right here on the box.
 
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Breno K.
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clearclaw wrote:
sagitar wrote:
It is clear to me you must play by the Z man rules.


The Z-Man rules produce a significantly less interesting game. I recommend playing by the first edition rules.

Quote:
Now what how exactly do I use those?


They are an unnecessary Z-man addition. I recommend not using them.


1st edition rules are best, I agree.
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Jason Reid
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sagitar wrote:
What I was refering to are not the minerals in the mine.
On the board that shows all the buildings you have four 2 sided chits.
one side showing iron, one side showing silver.

Now what how exactly do I use those?


I have the Z-man edition, but play by first edition rules.

I use those chits when I take a meeple off of a mine, and move them to a smelter. I place the chit on the smelter next to the meeple so that all know whether my meeple currently represents smelted iron or smelted silver.

EDIT: To clearclaw's point, these aren't really necessary. One could just as easily move the mineral along with the meeple to the smelter, I suppose. If you were playing by Z-man rules with the random mine draw, however, you'd need to use the chits since the minerals should go back in the bag.
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J C Lawrence
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Do you have this (first edition):



Or this (second edition):



?
 
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Freddy Dekker
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2nd.

Comparing the pictures that looks much prettier than the first.
Doesn't that come with a timeline border?
 
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J C Lawrence
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Then you have the second edition with the extra bits and silly rules and yes, timeline border. I recommend playing by the first edition rules and ignoring the extra bits.
 
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Freddy Dekker
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AAAAAAH?

But they are so beautifull, I love my extra bits....soblue

What makes 1st edition better?
 
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J C Lawrence
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That has been exhaustively discussed in the Neuland fora. Dig out my posts there for starters and you should find the threads easily.
 
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Ralph T
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There are really only a few extra bits: the wheelbarrows, the free wood/food tokens and the drawstring bag.
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Chris Marling
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Thanks a lot for taking the time to put this together - it really helped us get to grips with the game, which we really enjoyed.
 
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