Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
13 Posts

Marvel Heroes» Forums » Rules

Subject: Definitive "Just Rolled" Clarification with examples rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Powers T
msg tools
mbmbmb
A way to finalize this "just rolled" problem, as I can't find the solution anywhere.



Scenario 1:
Daredevil is attacking with 3 dice. 1st Dice (Single Hit), 2nd Dice (Hit + Boost), 3rd Dice Blank. Daredevil have supporting thus rerolls 1 Dice. THe reroll is Blank.

Can I now discard 1 resource card and use Daredevils proximity/radar sense to reroll the FIRST Blank and the Blank cause by the Reroll ?


Answer: Yes or No ? If linked with designers approval, even better.



Scenario 2:
The Lead Villian is having Innocent by Stander as backup. The Hero attack with 4 Dice. 1st Dice (Double Hit), 2nd Dice (Double Hit), 3rd Dice (Double Hit), 4th Dice (Hit + Boost). The reroll of 1 Dice result in a Double Hit.

Now I have been playing that as the Villian I must consider when to play the Innocent Bystander, either before the reroll or after. If I played the ability before the reroll the results would be 6. If I played the ability after the reroll the results would be 8 as it would only effect the dice "JUST ROLLED".

After going through the rulebook again after 1.5 yrs playing like above and BGG, it would seem that the PROPER way to use the Innocent Bystander ability would be to play it after all rerolls have been done and would effect ALL dice not just the rerolled ones. This would lead to the result of the Attack being only 5!.


Answer: 6/8 hits or 5 hits ? If linked with designers approval, even better.

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rauli Kettunen
Finland
Oulu
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
djay16 wrote:

Scenario 1:
Daredevil is attacking with 3 dice. 1st Dice (Single Hit), 2nd Dice (Hit + Boost), 3rd Dice Blank. Daredevil have supporting thus rerolls 1 Dice. THe reroll is Blank.

Can I now discard 1 resource card and use Daredevils proximity/radar sense to reroll the FIRST Blank and the Blank cause by the Reroll ?


Answer: Yes or No ? If linked with designers approval, even better.


No. Though IIRC, DD's ability allows him to reroll "up to 2 dice" just rolled, so could reroll the initial blank die only.

Quote:
Scenario 2:
The Lead Villian is having Innocent by Stander as backup. The Hero attack with 4 Dice. 1st Dice (Double Hit), 2nd Dice (Double Hit), 3rd Dice (Double Hit), 4th Dice (Hit + Boost). The reroll of 1 Dice result in a Double Hit.

Now I have been playing that as the Villian I must consider when to play the Innocent Bystander, either before the reroll or after. If I played the ability before the reroll the results would be 6. If I played the ability after the reroll the results would be 8 as it would only effect the dice "JUST ROLLED".

After going through the rulebook again after 1.5 yrs playing like above and BGG, it would seem that the PROPER way to use the Innocent Bystander ability would be to play it after all rerolls have been done and would effect ALL dice not just the rerolled ones. This would lead to the result of the Attack being only 5!.


Answer: 6/8 hits or 5 hits ? If linked with designers approval, even better.



5 would be my answer.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jorge Arroyo
Spain
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I don't see the problem here. The rules say:

"When an ability refers to dice “just rolled,” this includes both the initial roll and any rerolls from dice boosting."
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Michael Denman
United States
Katy
Texas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
maka wrote:
I don't see the problem here. The rules say:

"When an ability refers to dice “just rolled,” this includes both the initial roll and any rerolls from dice boosting."


This has always been a sore spot with me because the FAQ on the Invisible Woman violates this. Thus I ignore the FAQ here. For those who care, the FAQ says that she uses her power before the boost re-rolls are made but I say that "interrupt" of the process violates the rules and I complete my re-rolls before her power is used. Thus, she does NOT get to negate boosting... just dice with the boosting symbol which is plenty powerful enough.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Dorian Hawkins
United Kingdom
Chesterfield
Derbyshire
flag msg tools
designer
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
My £0.02p for what its worth:

"Just Rolled" refers to the dice literally just rolled.

But special abilities interrupt or modify this.

For example:

1. A character rolls 4 dice for an attack and scores 1 Hit, 1 Hit, Blank and Boost.

2. An opposing player gets to then interrupt at this stage and force a reroll (for say, the Boost and a Hit);

or the acting player could now choose to reroll now;

or roll the boost and then reroll THAT die.

As regards ignoring or converting 2 Hits to 1 Hit, this affects all dice showing 2 Hits, even re-rolls from boosts etc.

So in your example with the Innocent Bystander, it would 5 Hits.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jorge Arroyo
Spain
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Trump wrote:
maka wrote:
I don't see the problem here. The rules say:

"When an ability refers to dice “just rolled,” this includes both the initial roll and any rerolls from dice boosting."


This has always been a sore spot with me because the FAQ on the Invisible Woman violates this. Thus I ignore the FAQ here. For those who care, the FAQ says that she uses her power before the boost re-rolls are made but I say that "interrupt" of the process violates the rules and I complete my re-rolls before her power is used. Thus, she does NOT get to negate boosting... just dice with the boosting symbol which is plenty powerful enough.


Well, I don't have a problem with special powers "breaking" rules, because that's what a special power is anyway, but I can understand your change so she's not too powerful.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Michael Denman
United States
Katy
Texas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
That one doesn't really bug me as much as I let on. I DO think they were trying to fix a problem that didn't need fixing though (like the story action). Probably my biggest "house rule" regarding powers is that a power can be used ONCE per combat round. They were consistently ruling this way and then suddenly changed their tune with the FF. I allow the relevant FF powers to be used on any roll, but only ONCE per round. Again, I feel letting them use it with EVERY roll is just too powerful.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rauli Kettunen
Finland
Oulu
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Trump wrote:
That one doesn't really bug me as much as I let on. I DO think they were trying to fix a problem that didn't need fixing though (like the story action). Probably my biggest "house rule" regarding powers is that a power can be used ONCE per combat round. They were consistently ruling this way and then suddenly changed their tune with the FF. I allow the relevant FF powers to be used on any roll, but only ONCE per round. Again, I feel letting them use it with EVERY roll is just too powerful.


Have you tried to (officially) suggested variant for Mr & Mrs Invincible?

Reed affects opponent's Def roll.

Sue affects opponent's Att roll.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Michael Denman
United States
Katy
Texas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Dam the Man wrote:
Have you tried to (officially) suggested variant for Mr & Mrs Invincible?

Reed affects opponent's Def roll.

Sue affects opponent's Att roll.


That's even more restrictive and I'd have to change other characters too if I want to specify which die roll their power affected. My way only does one thing : ENFORCE the once per round rule that other character's powers have. Nothing *I* do contradicts the rulebook. Can't say the same for that FAQ...
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rauli Kettunen
Finland
Oulu
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Trump wrote:
That's even more restrictive and I'd have to change other characters too if I want to specify which die roll their power affected. My way only does one thing : ENFORCE the once per round rule that other character's powers have. Nothing *I* do contradicts the rulebook. Can't say the same for that FAQ...


Well, none of the others were ever OP . Though, which ones are you talking about? Can't recall any other characters affecting opponent's dice like the Invincible Duo.

I wasn't too thrilled with the suggested variant, but I'm sorta come around to it. It leaves Outwitting a viable option against the Invincible Duo, as neither can now negate results in that contest. And luckily, Doom packs a 5 Outwit with his Yellow ability.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Michael Denman
United States
Katy
Texas
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Dam the Man wrote:
Trump wrote:
That's even more restrictive and I'd have to change other characters too if I want to specify which die roll their power affected. My way only does one thing : ENFORCE the once per round rule that other character's powers have. Nothing *I* do contradicts the rulebook. Can't say the same for that FAQ...


Well, none of the others were ever OP . Though, which ones are you talking about? Can't recall any other characters affecting opponent's dice like the Invincible Duo.

I wasn't too thrilled with the suggested variant, but I'm sorta come around to it. It leaves Outwitting a viable option against the Invincible Duo, as neither can now negate results in that contest. And luckily, Doom packs a 5 Outwit with his Yellow ability.


I don't have the characters nearby, but I know there's at least one other hero who can use his power on different stats (Daredevil? Cap?).
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Powers T
msg tools
mbmbmb
So your answer to the Scenario 1 is: Yes, Daredevil would wait for all reroll then use his ability?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rauli Kettunen
Finland
Oulu
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Trump wrote:
I don't have the characters nearby, but I know there's at least one other hero who can use his power on different stats (Daredevil? Cap?).


IIRC, Thor is the only char who can add 1 die to his Attack and Defense Roll (when choosing Orange). The text on the card says "Attack or Defense", but I remember one of the designers state you can use it twice per turn, for both Attack and Defense (1 Resource card for each use of course).

Quote:
So your answer to the Scenario 1 is: Yes, Daredevil would wait for all reroll then use his ability?


Yes. After all the boost rolls, he'd probably keep the single hit. Could choose to reroll the blank (no-brainer probably) and hit/boost+blank. If he rerolled the last, it would negate the one hit from the hit/boost.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.