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Subject: United they stood, together they fell rss

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Marco
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As my previous recommendation request had a bullseye recommendation I come back for more

I am looking for more titles that force players to cooperate to keep a system running (state, ship, whatever) to prevent total loss, but on the other hand require the players to betray/outmanoeuvre each other to win the game.
In other words, it must not be a coop-style game but all players would have common interests.

I will drop some names as examples and my desire levels:
++ The Republic of Rome inspired this request
+ Junta comes close, too.

- Red November and
- Shadows over Camelot meet some of the requirements, but are a little short on "screwage", as both allow only some (or only 1) player, to "betray" the rest.
-- Battlestar Galactica: The Board Game seems to be too heavy on finding the traitors and predestines the sides.

Thank you for your time and suggestions.
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John Culp
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yeah, those bottom three are really co-op games, with a traitor (aside from RN, just a co-op)
 
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Bradley Eng-Kohn
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Cutthroat Caverns immediately came to mind.
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Benjamin Maggi
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"We must all hang together or, assuredly, we will all hang seperately." - Benjamin Franklin
 
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Benjamin Maggi
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What about Life Boats? You are not always helping everyone else, but there is a sense of everybody working together (at times) and deciding by majority vote.
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Daniel Rose
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The Republic of Rome
 
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Jonathan "Spartan Spawn, Sworn, Raised for Warring!"
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lj1983 wrote:
yeah, those bottom three are really co-op games, with a traitor (aside from RN, just a co-op)


Red November has the potential for a traitor. If one of he players has the right equipment he can bail on the sub and hope everyone else inside isnt able to beat the game.
 
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John Culp
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Luftwaffe Flak wrote:
lj1983 wrote:
yeah, those bottom three are really co-op games, with a traitor (aside from RN, just a co-op)


Red November has the potential for a traitor. If one of he players has the right equipment he can bail on the sub and hope everyone else inside isnt able to beat the game.


true, but he isn't actively working against everyone else. simply jumping ship...so 99% pure co-op.
 
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Russ Williams
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The big problem with this game concept for me is that I don't understand what my incentive is to keep the system running if I can see that someone else is going to win. I.e. from a competitive win/lose point of view, I'd rather we all lose instead of me (and some others) losing and Joe winning.

How is it any worse for me, as a player in a game where the goal is to win, if we all lose, instead of just some of us (including me?) losing? From a competitive point of view, all of us losing collectively is similar to all of us winning collectively. But all but one of us losing, while 1 other player wins, seems like a Bad Thing for me.

And if I'm supposed to set that self-interest aside and play the game in a cooperative spirit (let's all work together to keep Rome alive, or whatever) then why are there individual victory conditions instead of us all winning as a team?

It just seems like the game presents me with mutually contradictory incompatible goals.
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Chris Ferejohn
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I believe Castle Panic works this way.
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Gary Bacchus
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cferejohn wrote:
I believe Castle Panic works this way.


This was the first one that came to mind. Might have a winner here.
 
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Gary Bacchus
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Luftwaffe Flak wrote:
lj1983 wrote:
yeah, those bottom three are really co-op games, with a traitor (aside from RN, just a co-op)


Red November has the potential for a traitor. If one of he players has the right equipment he can bail on the sub and hope everyone else inside isnt able to beat the game.


Also, there's the variant to this one where you can beat up on your fellow gnomes.
 
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Sylla fits. The players are Roman politicians competing to be Premier Consul. They need to work together to deal with threats to the city, but compete for the approval of the people. A fine game, overshadowed by its big brother, Caylus.

-R
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Scott Alden
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Terra

The few times we played it - the earth was destroyed.
 
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Adrian Wiecheć
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Chrzanów
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God's playground, I think.
 
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Russ Williams
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justrag wrote:

But there is no concept of group loss in God's Playground.

Sure, Poland can suffer, and everyone will earn fewer points then, but that doesn't change the fact that the person with the most points at the end wins the game.
 
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Scott Anderson
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I've only played it once, but I seem to remember Vanished Planet fitting your criteria and very fun.
 
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