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The Adventurers: The Temple of Chac» Forums » Rules

Subject: Load level of 1 with Stamina special ability? rss

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Eric Bridge
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In our game last night, I discarded down to 3 treasurers because the boulder was moving fast. I was in the river and wanted to be guaranteed 5 actions, so I announced I was using Stamina to reduce my load level by 1 till the end of the turn. This would take my load level from 2, the lowest value on the character card, to a 1, correct?

One of the other players was not sure that I could reduce it below 2, especially since it would guarantee me 5 actions, no matter what was rolled (which ended up including 2 ones and 1 two!). We looked in the rules but we couldn't find anything about a "minimum load level of 2", so we allowed me to do this. As it turned out I was the only one to get out alive

Is this use of "Stamina" legal? Thanks.
 
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Brant Benoit
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Well, looking at the character cards, and using common sense; I would say you've played this wrong.

The reason being is that there is no Load level of 1 on any character card in the game, and there are no rules or references to it in the rulebook.

The cards don't have an LL of 1, nor can you get actions if rolling '1's', simply because the cards/rules don't say that you can. Actions can only be gained by rolling '2's' or higher, with an LL of 2. In instances like this, if the rules don't say that you can, then I would assume it's a safe bet that you can't.

I think the whole point of having Stamina as a special ability is that you can carry more treasure with a lower LL. Discarding so you can get your LL below 2 seems pointless, since LL doesn't go that low on the cards, and if your character is carrying zero treasures, your LL is the same as when carrying 3 treasures. Your LL remains the same if you're carrying from zero to three treasures.

So, how can you reduce LL when it can't go any lower when carrying absolutely nothing at all?
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Ryan Metzler
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Ghool wrote:
Well, looking at the character cards, and using common sense; I would say you've played this wrong.

The reason being is that there is no Load level of 1 on any character card in the game, and there are no rules or references to it in the rulebook.

The cards don't have an LL of 1, nor can you get actions if rolling '1's', simply because the cards/rules don't say that you can. Actions can only be gained by rolling '2's' or higher, with an LL of 2. In instances like this, if the rules don't say that you can, then I would assume it's a safe bet that you can't.

I think the whole point of having Stamina as a special ability is that you can carry more treasure with a lower LL. Discarding so you can get your LL below 2 seems pointless, since LL doesn't go that low on the cards, and if your character is carrying zero treasures, your LL is the same as when carrying 3 treasures. If your LL is the same if you're carrying up to three treasures, how can you reduce LL when it can't go any lower when carrying absolutely nothing at all?


Agreed! LL1 doesn't exist.
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Eric Bridge
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Then why not address this in the rules? Here is what the special ability says in the rules:

"Stamina: After Load Level is adjusted (phase 1), reduce the Adventurer’s Load Level by 1 for the rest of the turn when using this ability."

It seems it would have been very easy in the rules under "Adjust Load Level", or in the description of Stamina's special ability, to say something like "Under no circumstances can Load Level EVER be adjusted below 2."

With this NOT mentioned, it seems to me that you can reduce your level of 2 to a 1, right?

I'm a little shocked if this has never come up before. We will likely need an "official" ruling, because I plan to do this again if I'm ever in a depsperate situation again.
 
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Tim Kelly
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Ghool wrote:

So, how can you reduce LL when it can't go any lower when carrying absolutely nothing at all?


This is the crux of the issue. I agree with the others that LL1 does not exist.
TK
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Eric Bridge
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First of all, they are clearly NOT carrying nothing at all at LL2. A simply look at the drawings or even figures indicates that they are bringing into the temple their standard excavation gear (some of them quite a bit actually). They are simply carrying no treasures at load level 2. It seems odd that increased "Stamina" would allow someone to reduce their burden when carrying some treasure, but not allow them to reduce the burden caused by their standard starting gear. After all, we allow the "Sprint" characters to move an extra space once per turn by using their special ability, so I don't see how this is so game-breaking.

Stamina says reduce your level by 1. Holding 3 treasures my load level is 2. I use Stamina to reduce my load level by 1, per the instructions in the rules. I'm just not seeing what is techinically wrong about this play, but I do see your point too.

I am not trying to break the game, and I am not trying to cheat. If I died last night also, that's fine, I just want the clarification. If the designers chime in and say that they clearly never intended someone to have a load level of 1, and/or that a 1 is ALWAYS a "no action" roll, then I am happy to play it that way. I am just asking a question about a scenario not specifically addressed in the rules, so please do not get upset.
 
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George Husted
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Characters carrying 0 treasure are at a load level of 2.

What does that mean?

Load Level 2 is the minimum possible load level in the game mechanics.

That is, unless, of course, if a character were nakedblush with no Adventurers gear at all...ahem...then perhaps characters in their birthday suits have a load level of 1. But that is just mere speculation...some might even call it crazy talk because, well, some of the girls in the game are half way naked already and they still start with a load level of 2.
 
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http://geekdo.com/thread/434332/can-load-level-be-reduced-to...

From the designer's keyboard to your eyes.
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Tim Kelly
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ebridge wrote:
... so please do not get upset.

I'm sure no one is upset. I just think most of us disagree with your interpretation.
The designers have commented in these forums before, I bet we'll hear from one of them soon.
TK
 
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You can't handle the truth?
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I say, sure use stamina at LL 2 to go to LL 1.

As there is NO LL 1 chart though, use the one you have, LL2.

In effect, you can do it, but it doesn't do what you think it does.
 
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David Tolin
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crambaza wrote:
I say, sure use stamina at LL 2 to go to LL 1.

As there is NO LL 1 chart though, use the one you have, LL2.

In effect, you can do it, but it doesn't do what you think it does.


This doesn't make any sense. Your number of actions is determined by your load level--any dice that roll your LL or higher give you an action. You don't need a chart for anything. If your LL is 1, then all dice will give you an action no matter what they roll.

Interesting strategy if you're really low on treasure. Nice to see the designer chime in with an answer in the other thread.
 
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Eric Bridge
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pigi314159 wrote:
http://geekdo.com/thread/434332/can-load-level-be-reduced-to...

From the designer's keyboard to your eyes.


I hope that everyone will PLEASE read this thread. It seems to me like the designers of the game DO allow this move to take place.

It gave me a guaranteed 5 actions for the turn and allowed me to roll only 1 die to get out of the river.

Now I foreseee that Stamina will become the recognized best special ability in the game (perhaps it was already perceived that way), and everyone will lament not being the character who got that ability. But this is a separate issue ...

Thanks so much to whomever found this thread!
 
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Tim Kelly
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ebridge wrote:

Thanks so much to whomever found this thread!

Ditto! Definitely glad to be corrected on this!
TK
 
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Greg Maynard
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ebridge wrote:
After all, we allow the "Sprint" characters to move an extra space once per turn by using their special ability


Appendix 1 of the rules says that each adventurer's special ability may only be used once per game so none of the special abilities are going drastically alter the game. The trick is to use your one-use special ability at the key moment to most advantage.

With respect to stamina that would seem to me to be getting out of the river, but a quick dash near the end to beat the boulder might also be critical.
 
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Patrick Reynolds
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The designer does make a good point - if you're burning your ability to reduce a LL2 by 1, you're carrying at most only three treasures. Unless you're the only one to escape the temple you're probably not going to be in contention for the win.

In most of the games I have played, it seemed like the winner was generally holding 4-7 treasure cards.

Good to know that it's legal, nonetheless.
 
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