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Subject: Retreating neutrals and number restrictions rss

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Therron Thomas
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After reading a previous post where someone answered a
question about retreating neutrals with a statement that said 'this can lead to some large groups of neutrals', it reminded me of a question I meant to ask.

Do unallied neutrals abide by the no more than 8 units in a hex rule?

I only ask because in the RETREATS section it indicates that the player to your left takes control of the neutrals and makes the decisions on where they go and so on. But then after explaining how player controled units, unallied neutrals and heroes work it reads.

"When a figure retreats, it is always routed.
After retreating, if the number of units in an area exceeds eight, then
the owner must destroy units until he has eight or less in the area.
Both routed and standing units always count toward this limit."

Does the player to left become 'the owner' of the neutral units while
making decisions for them?

This doesn't indicate it is restricted to player controlled units.

Thoughts?
 
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Scott Lewis
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I would say yes, they are limited to 8 units as well. As usual, the player to your left would decide how to resolve it, if it happened to stack to more than 8.
 
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Therron Thomas
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Thats funny Scott, I think you are the one who posted the answer that prompted me to ask this one. LOL!

I don't think you meant to indicate groups over 8 but your answer reminded me that I had my question.

Thanks.
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Chris J Davis
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I would say no. The stacking limit rule specifically says that if a player has more than eight units in an area he must reduce them to eight.

As soon as the neutral units become allied to a player though, they must obey the stacking limit.
 
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Scott Lewis
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Page 22 says "After retreating, if the number of units in an area exceeds eight, then the owner must detroy units...".

This doesn't refer to only player-controlled units. The reference to "owner" doesn't imply this either, in my opinion, because that part is just talking about who decides what to destroy. In the case of unallied neutrals, it would be the player to the left of the current player.


I suppose this could be posed to Corey, but I don't see why Neutrals would be exempt from the 8-unit limit.
 
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Therron Thomas
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sigmazero13 wrote:
Page 22 says "After retreating, if the number of units in an area exceeds eight, then the owner must detroy units...".

This doesn't refer to only player-controlled units. The reference to "owner" doesn't imply this either, in my opinion, because that part is just talking about who decides what to destroy. In the case of unallied neutrals, it would be the player to the left of the current player.


I suppose this could be posed to Corey, but I don't see why Neutrals would be exempt from the 8-unit limit.


My exact point.

I noticed you are on the FFG forums too. Is that a good place to pose this to Corey? I posted it in there too.



 
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Scott Lewis
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To ask Corey, you may want to send him an email through the Rules Question link at the bottom of the FFG page, he doesn't check the forum pages often.

That being said, I already posed the question to him


Personally, I prefer the BGG forums over the FFG forums, as I hate the FFG forum software, it's a pain in the butt to use.
 
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Therron Thomas
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Roger. Thanks and please let me know if he replies.

 
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Bill Darrow
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I have only played the game a few times here. But I really do not think you should ever want to get to the point of having that many neutrals stacked on the same space. Someone can just come in with a good amount of initiative and easily ally with all those neutrals in one turn. Instant army!

So I would caution against doing so unless you are really forced by having only one choice of areas for retreat.
 
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Andrew
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Well, on that point, the second they became allied to that player he would have to destroy units down to 8. But I agree that you should be trying to retreat neutral units strategically and not necessarily all to the same area.
 
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Therron Thomas
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I don't think anyone would try to retreat that many on purpose. But as I have observed now more than once, as the armies advance out of their home areas, most neutrals that do retreat eventually start massing toward the middle. Just kind of happens. Suddenly a couple more retreats and you have three, four, or five. One more retreat and its not a choice, sometimes its just the only choice within the rules.

Doesn't happen real often, but would like clarity.

 
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