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Subject: The good, the bad, the ugly (x3 play sessions) rss

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Matt B
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The Good:

Lots of difficult decisions to make on a turn by turn basis. Juggling your strategies can be complex and enjoyable, or simple and straightforward, the game is good at handling both. The questing by the Heros adds some added flair to the game and makes the game feel like more is going on than just some random armies popping up to control one another. TI:3 it is not, GoT: it is not, but it borrows from both and reduces the complexity quite a bit to make the game more accessible to new players.

Teach ability is under 30 minutes from an experienced player to an in-experienced player.

yuk
The Bad:

Like all games with lots of decisions if you have players that take awhile to choose things plan on adding +2 hours. Playing without exploration tokens and the standard year six / six runes ending the game seems to be over just as its getting really good. You'll have a couple of decent skirmishes but the epic battles are definitely saved for a house ruled epic game. 7 runes with 1 starting rune would be perfect for the warmonger(s) out there.

zombie
The Ugly:

Lots of pieces the game has about a 10-20 minute setup time and lots of little pieces floating around. The fate card deck needs sleeves, although this could've been done with dice, as you'll note in several posts following this review, it was done with cards in mind on purpose. I've altered this portion of the review and accepted the cards as a good mechanic. Still need protective sleeves, which is still ugly.


Final Review:

8.5/10

Its not the epic war game TI:3 is, its not the intrigue/diplomacy that Game of Thrones is, its not the adventure game that Runebound is, but it is a good mixture of all of them. Its re playability is very high, some house rules either way can make it one of your all time favorites, could use 2 more races we often play with 6 people. It will be my game of war choice for quite some time having worn out and gotten tired of the Epic-ly long TI:3.

And I do enjoy the game both as a 2 player, 3 player, and 4 player game which cannot be said for all the games out there.

Let fate decide.
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Scott Lewis
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Smaggler wrote:
The fate card deck although a cool mechanic will eventually wear out and could've been done with custom dice instead.

First, the Fate deck is one I would STRONGLY STRONGLY recommend investing in some card sleeves for. Not only will it make the shuffling easier, but it will keep the cards from wearing out.

Second, I oft hear people suggest "it could've been done with custom dice instead". In some ways, this could be true, except for one thing that to me is a HUGE thing - the changing odds of cards. I like how the card pulls for things affect each other, even when used in different ways. It makes the odds something you can manage - especially the Destiny draws. There's really no way dice could give you anything other than static, never-changing odds. For some, that may not be a big thing. But the more I play, the more I REALLY like the Fate Deck, despite the constant shuffling.


But to each their own Nice review
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Caillin Langmann
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Knowing that in the remaining part of a deck of 6 is one gold symbol means that players are apt to then start diplomacy with neutrals. I often wait for the deck to get played low and if I know there are good odds, I'll try and diplomacy the big stack of neutrals and suddenly I have an army no-one is going to mess with.

It is an important mechanic that is subtle and overlooked.
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Purple Paladin

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Good review.

When I first got the game, I flinched when I saw there were no dice, and just cards. But after a 2p and 4p game under my belt, the cards where definitly the way to go. In fact, I can't even imagine how'd they put all the odds/possiblitlies/rolls in the game using dice without a pamphlet of charts and tables. The cards where just quick, super-easy to learn, yet gave a plethera of info and outcomes with as little complexity as possible.

In fact, drawing a card for each unit each round of battle seems to give a bit more realism and fun in the battles for us.

Setup time, ya, in our 4 player game, 2 of my friends were yawning and tapping their fingers while we set it up, but my other friend and I love setting up the game; we even adjust each neutral unit "just so" on each hex for the extra cool-looking factors.
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Troy English
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langmann wrote:
Knowing that in the remaining part of a deck of 6 is one gold symbol means that players are apt to then start diplomacy with neutrals. I often wait for the deck to get played low and if I know there are good odds, I'll try and diplomacy the big stack of neutrals and suddenly I have an army no-one is going to mess with.

It is an important mechanic that is subtle and overlooked.


Amusingly, the rulebook even says to do exactly that.

So, when people mention the dice part, just show them the part of the rules that explains why they have cards instead of dice, it's not even an oversight or a lucky coincidence that particular mechanic is 100% designed in purposefully.
 
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Sean Shaw
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Tut_613 wrote:
langmann wrote:
Knowing that in the remaining part of a deck of 6 is one gold symbol means that players are apt to then start diplomacy with neutrals. I often wait for the deck to get played low and if I know there are good odds, I'll try and diplomacy the big stack of neutrals and suddenly I have an army no-one is going to mess with.

It is an important mechanic that is subtle and overlooked.


Amusingly, the rulebook even says to do exactly that.

So, when people mention the dice part, just show them the part of the rules that explains why they have cards instead of dice, it's not even an oversight or a lucky coincidence that particular mechanic is 100% designed in purposefully.


OR...it started happening in playtesting and they had a choice, to scrap it or to utilize it as part of the game...OR increase the number of cards. I'd say they decided to utilize it as part of the game since a majority didn't have problems counting the cards and felt it added to the game, or didn't care.

Card counting can be good in some games, but it DOES favor those who are mathematically and numerically talented far more than the normal player...most can tell somewhat what's happening, but against someone who really knows how to count...they could be smoked.

I COULD do that in most games, but many may stop playing with me if I started being that cold and calculating in my games. Probably why even odds for everyone appeal to me better, ends any temptation of even doing such a thing.

For example, the fate deck of this game is child's play to actually memorize for the experienced card counter, but not as easy to catch on except the general idea of what's been used or not for those who aren't.

Not quite fair in my estimation. Luckily, most won't take the time to count the cards so it's about even with the dice anyways in my estimation, and I'm not going to exploit something like that. I tend NOT to be that cut throat, sensitive players and all occasionally.

PS: ON the review, nice review. Much shorter then mine, I could learn a thing or two from you on being more to the point in my writings.
 
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Scott Lewis
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Only the insane will probably do hard-core counting for combat. Counting for destiny isn't that hard - 3 result types to keep track of, and it's pretty easy to know there are 4 "goods".

With poker/blackjack, there's a lot more to count and keep track of. In this, all you are keeping track of is the number left, and that's really easy to do.

Now, again, if you are trying to track damage/orb/rout odds for the various things... well, then you are a bit too crazy.
 
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Sean Shaw
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sigmazero13 wrote:
Only the insane will probably do hard-core counting for combat. Counting for destiny isn't that hard - 3 result types to keep track of, and it's pretty easy to know there are 4 "goods".

With poker/blackjack, there's a lot more to count and keep track of. In this, all you are keeping track of is the number left, and that's really easy to do.

Now, again, if you are trying to track damage/orb/rout odds for the various things... well, then you are a bit too crazy.


For a good counter, it's actually not that difficult. IMO of course, or maybe I'm crazy.
 
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Eric Kuha
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I would just like to add that I played a full game at the Con of the North with my brother and one of the reps from FFG. He said that the contents of the fate discard pile was supposed to be public knowledge. You can look through it at any time to see what cards have come out.

I feel that makes the deck a much more deliberate and desirable mechanic.
 
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Nate Merchant
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Smaggler wrote:
Its not the epic war game TI:3 is, its not the intrigue/diplomacy that Game of Thrones is


TI3 is not a war game in any sense, nor is there any but the most feeble intrigue or diplomacy in GoT. Thank the gods RW is not those games.
 
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Matt B
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Natus wrote:

TI3 is not a war game in any sense, nor is there any but the most feeble intrigue or diplomacy in GoT. Thank the gods RW is not those games.


This is a troll post unless you care to give examples of games that support your opinion, allowing people to respond to your choices in games for those genres would make this post have value.
 
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Scott Lewis
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Smaggler wrote:
Natus wrote:

TI3 is not a war game in any sense, nor is there any but the most feeble intrigue or diplomacy in GoT. Thank the gods RW is not those games.


This is a troll post unless you care to give examples of games that support your opinion, allowing people to respond to your choices in games for those genres would make this post have value.

You don't know Nate, do you? Don't feed him when it comes to FFG games
 
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Matt B
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LOL not really no. Apparently he has a love/mostly hate relationship with them.

On another note, I've altered the review due to your well thought out posts and accepted the cards as a mechanic, but a mechanic that needs protective sleeves.

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