Chris Young
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Here is a post I posted on FFG's forum concerning changes to the crisis deck based on some things I noticed about the Pegasus expansion

any thoughts

http://new.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_foros_discusion.asp?e...

Quote:
One thing I noticed with the Crisis deck is that sometimes its just nuts other times its a breeze.

One thing Ive been looking at trying is to split the Main Crisis deck into 2 halves and play one half before sleeper and one half after.

I was doing this with a friends game so I dont have the full card lists to break down but what I did was remove all the fleet attack cards then seperate the remaining cards into piles based on first skill check, or straight choice then by cylon activation symbol

I divided the skill check card within each activation based on if they seemed to thematicly be challenges early in the series or if they came a bit later.

This was actually almost even splits in most cases. I evenly distributed the food and water shortage cards (maybe a bit heavier on those in the pre sleeper deck.

I seperated the 33 and scar attack cards and placed 33 in the pre sleeper deck and scar in the other. Then I tried to even out the number of base star placements and civilian ships so that both sets of cards had near equal ammounts.

What I ended up with is two 45 card crisis decks that had roughly the same number of each cylon activations.

The idea is that once the fleet has entered the Sleeper Phase of the game you switchcrisis decks much like you do with the new caprica deck in the expansion.



Some other Ideas I had that might make it interesting.

1) I dont know if there is a variant out there where the Pegasus ship doesnt show up till after the first Jump but its something I was thinking would also make the game keep some of the feel from its play without the expansion. In those cases I would suggest that characters like Cain and Ellen would have similar rules to Helo at the start of the game and not be on the board till after the first Jump.

2) I was planning on designating a couple of the skill checks to have the additional pass effects.

a) current player chooses another player and changes seating position with them current players character is then sent to sickbay. (The purpose of this pass effect is to breakup the "murderers row" scenerio that happens fairly often.


edit -- please note this following idea was a bad one but dont let it discourage you from trying the others.
b) In conjunction with the split crisis deck idea in the pre or post sleeper decks all players pass one face down loyalty card to the player on your right/left. If the player has no facedown loyalty cards pass to the next player that does. (This could also happen as a fail effect of a specific check)



Anyway what do you think about any of this.

I was looking for ways work within some of the already given game mechanics to see some more interesting plays as both humans and cylons.

At any rate I hope they make more expansions that play on some of the themes. I think the mechanics of the game have some really interesting possibilities.
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Mark Thomason
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I like the idea of the split deck. Evens out the decks a little bit to prevent too much bunching of fleet attacks in one area while adding to the thematic element for fans of the show.

I also like the Pegasus not arriving until after the first jump concept - but I would limit it to Cain as the only person to arrive late. And I would also make it so that someone else gets to be the Admiral until she's actually on the scene, and then she automatically gets it. Not only thematic with the show, but also slightly weakens Cain who is generally considered the most overpowered character. Ellen did actually arrive before Pegasus, and had been supposedly in the fleet the whole time, just with the civilians, and I don't think I've heard complaints that she's overpowered so I wouldn't saddle her with another negative.

I like the idea of switching seats as part of a skill check, could be a very interesting mechanic.

I don't like the idea of trading around loyalty cards, as it will just be frustrating for those who are working hard as humans to become cylons or vice-versa. The sleeper phase does this kind of a mechanic better and more thematically than people who were cylons handing their loyalty card to someone else.
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Evgeny Reznikov
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I don't think that splitting the Crisis deck would change the game to any appreciable extent.
 
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Chris Young
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The split crisis deck would only make it play out more thematicly is all.

The other ideas (i agree somewhat about swapping loyalty cards) make more of an impact to game play.
 
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Roberta Yang
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Passing Loyalty cards seem awful. I look at my Loyalty Cards. Oh, a You Are A Cylon card? I play human, pass it at Sleeper, and then instantly brig whoever I passed it to. Congratulations, the game's big draw - the Mafia-style game of rooting out the traitors - has been utterly destroyed, and I can't even figure out what the point of it was.
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Chris Young
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I hadnt thought the loyalty card thing through enough but I was going to tie it to a specific skill check so it may never come up. It would present some interesting skill card selection to put into the mix.

You also would not be guarenteed to recieve a human or cylon card either.

I think the swap seats thing would be good though.
 
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Gerry Smit
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many games have turn order that isn't simply "around the table". The simplest being a deck of cards, draw at the start of each round, and play in order. This would be interesting, especially as in BSG they should stay hidden until used. Who is #1? Who goes second? Versus "skinjob coming up, save your cards now for her Super crisis next player".
 
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Cameron McKenzie
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I don't think splitting the deck could necessarily break anything, as long as you are smart about how you do it.

Pegasus coming late could be fine too. Considering how strong Cain is, a fair compromise may be to include Pegasus from the beginning of there is no Cain. However, if somebody chooses Cain, Pegasus and Cain are both out of play until the first jump. Cain basically gives a free jump, so it seems appropriate for her to "sit out" on the first jump. And to balance out the free jump she bring to the table, Pegasus is unavailable along with her. It makes Cain a much weaker character, but as first in line to Admiral that is probably okay.

Changing the turn order shouldn't cause significant problems, but I don't know if a skill check is the way to do it. You could play a series of "rounds." During each round every player gets one turn, but the Admiral or President decides the play order of the humans at the beginning of the round. However, revealed cylons may take their turn at any point they want during the round to balance the extra versatility the humans get (at the end of each human turn, a revealed cylon may choose whether or not to take their turn or allow the next human to go, but they can still only take one turn during the round of course).

This would allow the humans to plan things like "Have Chief go last just in case something gets damaged during the round." but then the cylons have the option to delay their turn in hopes that more cylon ships appear to be activated, or rush their turn to play a super crisis before the humans are ready!

It solves the seating order issue without really introducing anything too fiddly or confusing.

Passing loyalty cards is a bad idea, for many reasons. There is already a sleeper phase, and cylons can already pass away cards they didn't use to reveal. Allowing players to pass off their ONLY cylon card is just problematic, especially if it's tied to a skill check (if the humans are certain to win or lose, people will just keep doing the skill check, playing "hot potato" with the loyalty cards and hoping that they end up with the winning loyalty).
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Roberta Yang
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MasterDinadan wrote:
Pegasus coming late could be fine too. Considering how strong Cain is, a fair compromise may be to include Pegasus from the beginning of there is no Cain. However, if somebody chooses Cain, Pegasus and Cain are both out of play until the first jump. Cain basically gives a free jump, so it seems appropriate for her to "sit out" on the first jump. And to balance out the free jump she bring to the table, Pegasus is unavailable along with her. It makes Cain a much weaker character, but as first in line to Admiral that is probably okay.


This seems like a really good alternate rule, in terms of both theme and mechanics.

It also seems reasonable in this case to have whoever is next in line after Cain to start out as Admiral, and to give the Admiral title to Cain when she and Pegasus show up. Thematically, the humans aren't expecting her and Pegasus to be out there anyhow (though the Helo precedent messes that up), and it seems rather cruel to deny the humans both Pegasus and Nukes, even if only for the first jump.

MasterDinadan wrote:
Changing the turn order shouldn't cause significant problems, but I don't know if a skill check is the way to do it. You could play a series of "rounds." During each round every player gets one turn, but the Admiral or President decides the play order of the humans at the beginning of the round. However, revealed cylons may take their turn at any point they want during the round to balance the extra versatility the humans get (at the end of each human turn, a revealed cylon may choose whether or not to take their turn or allow the next human to go, but they can still only take one turn during the round of course).

This would allow the humans to plan things like "Have Chief go last just in case something gets damaged during the round." but then the cylons have the option to delay their turn in hopes that more cylon ships appear to be activated, or rush their turn to play a super crisis before the humans are ready!

It solves the seating order issue without really introducing anything too fiddly or confusing.


The big thing I don't like about this is that the Cylons can all go last at the end of one round and first at the beginning of the next. This makes it far too easy for a pair of them to tap Cylon Fleet four times in a row when it is convenient and wipe out the humans in an instant from Centurions (or from raiders massacring everyone, or from Basestars destroying everything...) - forget Cavil's OPG being able to randomly end the game, the Cylons now have a similarly powerful ability and are able to use it every other round.
 
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Cameron McKenzie
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Note that cylon players can only take a turn AFTER a human turn. I worded this very deliberately. The first player to act in a round would always be human. If revealed cylons take double turns at the end of a round, then a human will get a turn at the start of the next round before the cylons can take more turns. This would leave only one turn in between the cylon player's pairs of turns, so it may still be rough on them.

You could also forbid cylon players from taking back to back turns at all unless they are the only players left who haven't acted. In this case, they could go back-to-back in one round, and then one of them could go second in the next round, with humans going first and third. Across two rounds, the best way for cylons to "cram" their actions together would be to play HHHCC-HCHCH. Basically, four cylon turns punctuated by two human turns, which doesn't seem too bad especially since the humans have total control over which players will take the human turns. If the cylons try to pull off a multi-activation the humans can use whatever character they need to get the vipers into position and deal with it.
 
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Chris Young
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When splitting the crisis deck you need to sort it in two ways

1 by cylon activation symbols and
2 skill check vs choice or combo

Try to keep the ratios the same by dividing equally as much as possible.

There are some very presleeper crisis cards that are pretty evident as there is no definitive "sleeper" stage in the series you kind of have to draw the line arbitrarily but try to arrange the split of cards chronologically from the series I came up with a first cut a while ago but dont have the saved list and it is actually pretty funny how even things are.

For the attack cards i simply tried to even out the number of base stars that each deck would recieive with the post sleeper getting any overage (as the game starts with 1)

I agree with the admiral cain thing it would pass to her when pegasus arrives.

At any rate if someone wants to try this out and let me know how it goes id appreciate it I wont get a chance for a bit. And I definitely will come up with a split list.



 
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